Summary
Threats to Congress skyrocketed after Trump took office. He bought the mass murder weapon legally -- that`s really all you have to know about the details of how the mass murder was carried out -- the mass murder of seven people at a Fourth of July parade in Chicago`s northern suburb of Highland Park. Today the Democratic nominee for governor of Texas Beto O`Rourke said, "It has been six weeks since 19 children and two teachers were taken from us and Uvalde yet Governor Abbott has done nothing meaningful to prevent another mass shooting. Senator Lindsey Graham (R-SC) is subpoenaed in the Georgia election probe. Interview with Rep. Adam Schiff (D-CA).
Transcript
LAWRENCE O`DONNELL, MSNBC HOST: Yeah, Ali, and we`re going to begin tonight, our hour, with what you just ended with. Both the Georgia subpoenas, and the January 6, the next January 6 committee hearing.
Adam Schiff, Congressman Adam Schiff, he`s a member of the community, he`s going to join us, tell us what e can tell us about what to expect in that next hearing. And we`re going to be joined by a former Georgia prosecutor to interpret those subpoenas sent by the Georgia district attorney to Rudy Giuliani, Lindsey Graham, and others. That -- those are really loaded subpoenas.
ALI VELSHI, MSNBC HOST, "VELSHI": I`m glad you are doing that. I have been sort of occupied this hour with the things on the ground here, but this is important for us to understand what is happening in these but investigations, both January 6 and in Georgia.
Thank you, Lawrence. Have a great show.
O`DONNELL: Thank you, Ali. Thank you.
Well, tonight, the Trump team is finally facing subpoenas that they cannot refuse, subpoenas from a criminal grand jury which are enforceable with handcuffs if necessary. And with this new round of subpoenas, Lindsey Graham has finally found his place in United States Senate history.
Now, throughout our history, corruption cases in Washington always get an awful lot of attention. And so it is understandable, that overtime, people come to think of Congress and the Senate as full of corruption.
But, but, the statistical truth is, that far less than 1 percent of the 1,994 senators in our history, have ever faced any kind of legal trouble or legal questions at all. Over 99 percent of them have never come close to being investigated for ethics violations, or violations of law. And it just maybe that none of them actually, none of them, have ever been served with subpoenas by criminal grand juries until today, when Senator Lindsey Graham received his subpoena from the grand jury that District Attorney Fani Willis has convened in Fulton County, Georgia.
The district attorney and the grand jury want to hear about Lindsey Graham`s phone calls to Georgia Secretary of State Brad Raffensperger and his staff, quote, about reexamining certain absentee ballots cast in Georgia, in order to explore the possibility of a more favorable outcome for former President Donald Trump. That is language directly from the subpoena to Lindsey Graham.
That`s one of the things, just one of the things, Lindsey Graham subpoena says, he will be forced to testify about under oath. Now, we have had a couple of senators in our history convicted of crimes. But there is no record of them actually being forced to testify to Grand Rapids before they are convicted.
We`ll keep checking with the Senate historian on this, but Lindsey Graham is on a very short list that just might include only his name is as United States served with a subpoena by a criminal grand jury. And so, Lindsey Graham is trying to fall asleep tonight, while managing even more fear than he felt on the day Donald Trump gave out Lindsey Graham`s cell phone number during the 2016 presidential campaign, which began Lindsey Graham`s quick conversion from Donald Trump opponent to Donald Trump devoted follower, and now, possibly suspected by a grand jury of being a Trump coconspirator.
The grand jury also issued subpoenas specifically mentioning Donald Trump. We will get a reading of the subpoenas in a moment from a former Georgia prosecutor. But they do seem to indicate that District Attorney Fani Willis and the grand jury want under oath testimony about exactly what Donald Trump was doing and saying. Rudy Giuliani received a subpoena which said, that he, quote, possesses unique knowledge concerning communications between himself, former President Trump, the Trump campaign, and other known and unknown individuals involved in the multi-state, coordinated efforts to influence the results of the November 2020 election in Georgia and elsewhere.
[22:05:17]
Multi-state coordinated efforts. When Attorney General Merrick Garland reads his "Washington Post" account of these subpoenas tomorrow morning, when he comes across the phrase "multi-state coordinated efforts to influence the results of the November 2020 election", he is going to realize that if crimes were committed, they were federal crimes, as well as state crimes.
The Giuliani subpoena also describes what Giuliani said to some members of the Georgia state legislator. Quote: Among the evidence offered by Rudy Giuliani, was a video recording of election workers at State Farm Arena in Atlanta, that purported to show election workers producing suitcases of unlawful ballots, from unknown sources, outside the view of election poll watchers. Within 24 hours, of the December 3rd 2020 legislative hearing, the Georgia secretary of state`s office debunked the State Farm video and explained that its investigation revealed no voter fraud of any kind had taken place at State Farm Arena.
Despite this, Rudy Giuliani made additional statements both to the public and in subsequent legislative hearings, claiming widespread voter fraud in Georgia during the November 2020 election and using the now debunked State Farm video in support of those statements.
Trump lawyer John Eastman also received a subpoena the week after the FBI seized his cell phone. The subpoena to John Eastman describes what`s he told some members of the Georgia legislator. At that hearing, John Eastman provided testimony which he advised lawmakers that they had both lawful authority and a duty to replace the Democratic Party`s state slate of presidential electors, who have been certified as the duly appointed electors for the state of Georgia, after the November 2020 election, due to unfounded claims of widespread voter fraud within the state.
Also included in the Trump lawyer group, targeted with subpoenas today, our, attorney Cleta Mitchell, who joined Donald Trump on his tape phone call with Georgia Secretary of State Brad Raffensperger. Kenneth Chesebro, an attorney who helped create fraudulent Georgia electors, attorney Jenna Ellis, and attorney and podcast host, Jacki Pick Deason.
Senator Lindsey Graham`s date for making history by testifying to a criminal grand jury is July 12th, next Tuesday, the same day that the January 6 Committee has scheduled its next hearing.
Joining us now is Michael J. Moore, former U.S. attorney for the Middle District of Georgia. He is a partner in the Moore Hall law form in Atlanta.
Mr. Moore, as we were reading these subpoenas today, at a certain point in the middle of the subpoenas, it`s not like I was reading an indictment. I just couldn`t wait for your legal reading of what is presented in these subpoenas.
Let`s begin with Rudy Giuliani. And his subpoena in which when they want to talk about is very specifically described.
MICHAEL J. MOORE, FORMER U.S. ATTORNEY, MIDDLE DISTRICT OF GEORGIA: Well, I`m glad to be with you, I think it`s pretty clear at this point that the D.A. is assailing the ship nearby. She has not fired the shot across the bow.
You know, what`s Rudy Giuliani has several things going against him, and one of those obviously is the testimony he gave in front of the Georgia general assembly committee, comprised of members of the assembly. And that is where he pushed forward this election loss. He used these tapes, he -- this election fraud, he used the tapes, he did things that clearly seem to indicate that he was not telling the truth.
Now, I imagine at this point, she`s on a lockdown, whether or not this was part of a legal strategy. She`s going to get under oath that, in fact, they have no basis to believe these claims. She`s going to get under oath that, in fact, he knew the certain evidence that he was presenting had been debunked at the time that he presented this information, at the time he made these outrageous claims.
And so, she`ll get Giuliani I think to talk about that. But first, they`re going to have to because you do have lawyers involved, you have campaign lawyers involved. They`re going to have to get past a little bit of the attorney-client privilege information, and that is when the battle we have seen through some of the congressional hearings, and otherwise. I think the courts will make relatively short work of that.
[22:10:03]
But I will tell you that the Judge McBurney, even as he sits now, made last week I think, he took up a hearing about other members including lieutenant governor who had been subpoenaed. And they were talking about whether or not they had certain immunity because they were in the legislator. He is trying to craft a way for them to answer questions.
So you`re going to see some of that here I think, dealing with attorney- client privilege. You`ve got to know the attorneys that you just mentioned, has been subpoenaed. But I think at the end of the day, there will be a way for them to answer questions just to close holes in the factual case and to go ahead and rebut offenses that will likely be made down the road.
O`DONNELL: What happens to witnesses like this when they get the subpoenas? Is this a moment where Rudy Giuliani realizes that under oath, he has a choice? That it`s either protect Donald Trump or protect himself?
MOORE: You know, I do think that is true but I think oftentimes it things if the witnesses have conscience. And they`re going to make a decision about am I willing to put my neck on the noose for someone who clearly has not been able to be loyal to me?
My thought honestly, when I read the story, was that we have been right to see what Lindsey Graham. He strikes me is probably the one with a lot to lose here. You remember early on, I actually requested that he would be investigated for attempted -- or when I thought it sounded potential violations of Georgia election law.
And I do think that he has a much at risk of because of that. He was not candid. He was not calling on behalf of the campaign. But he did try to meddle with the election results, even requesting are suggesting possibly that certain votes had not been counted, that there been 2 million in one place, sort of some crazy things that he was suggesting to Raffensperger at the time.
My guess is that he is having to think through that, because he is not in a position to say, look, I was a candidate. I was caught in my own race. I was trying to check to see if someone could overcome this deficit and vote, which I think we will hear should they indict Trump.
But he was called in to meddle in another race. He is not a senator from Georgia. He was called in for the Senate races. He was also calling because of Trump, apparent defeat here.
And I think it really puts him in a much different posture and I am sure it was a moment of awakening at least, when you got noticed by a subpoena.
O`DONNELL: Michael J. Moore, thank you very much for starting off our coverage tonight. Really appreciate it.
MOORE: Always good to be with you. Thank you.
O`DONNELL: Joining us now is Andrew Weissmann, former FBI general counsel, and former chief of the criminal division in the Eastern District of New York. He`s a professional of practice at NYU law school.
Also with us, Claire McCaskill, former Democratic senator from Missouri and an MSNBC political analyst.
And Senator Mitt McCaskill, I go to you on your level of shock and surprise at Lindsey Graham is making history -- making history by getting a grand jury subpoena.
CLAIRE MCCASKILL, MSNBC POLITICAL ANALYST: No shock, no surprise, although this is going to get complicated. We got a lot of issues here as the former prosecutor was delineating. You got some privilege issues. You`ve got some work product issues.
And the other thing to remember here, Lawrence, is this is a special grand jury. This is not a regular grand jury. This is a special grand jury that can set a longer than a typical grand jury that just sits the term of a court.
The special grand jury can subpoena witnesses, but interestingly enough, in Georgia, it cannot indict. So the decisional indicting would have to lie with the prosecutor in this case, unless there was another type of grand jury called subsequent to this.
I don`t know, maybe Andrew knows, whether they can grant immunity. And that`s the other issue here. People forget, Eastman can`t take the Fifth like he did in front of the special committee if they give him immunity. And there`s a lot of lawyers here that I think will stand in line for a ticket for immunity, if they can be done with this mess they got themselves in, where they have been actively committing crimes while pretending to get legal advice.
O`DONNELL: Andrew, if you are John Eastman`s lawyer, and you get an offer for immunity in Georgia, do you immediately get on the phone to Washington, to the Justice Department and say, I need federal immunity at the same time?
ANDREW WEISSMANN, FORMER CHIEF OF CRIMINAL DIVISION, EASTERN DISTRICT OF NEW YORK: Well, I don`t think you actually need to do that. If you get state immunity, you can actually turn operate to provide immunity federally, because what is called the sort of silver platter doctrine.
So, I do think that what Claire said, though, is what we are going to see with respect to Eastman and Giuliani. If you are there counsel, you are going to take five. And then the decision will be made by the state attorney general`s office, whether they are going to go to court to get an immunity order.
[22:15:04]
And that really puts a lot of pressure on both of them. What`s useful for people to remember, just because you have immunity, that does not mean you are then free to lie to the grand jury. If you do that, you can be prosecuted for perjury.
So the clean way out of this is if you are granted immunity, is to just tell the truth, and then you won`t ever face any sort of criminal liability for what you testify to, or any leads of what you testified to. But obviously, in the situation, that could lead to giving up Donald Trump and many, many others.
But I suspect that is going what you going to see, is you`re going to see a state and possibly a federal deal to really pressure them by granting immunity, unless they can build an independent criminal case against them quickly.
O`DONNELL: And, Senator McCaskill, there is Merrick Garland if it`s tomorrow morning, when he reads these phrase, it is "Washington Post" coverage our New York Times coverage of the subpoenas, that described a multi-state coordinated activity, that could be criminal. That sounds like what the Justice Department was invented for.
MCCASKILL: It does. And I will say this, I think with the Cassidy testimony last week, I think I -- in the very beginning of all this process, as a former prosecutor, who had to make very difficult charging decisions, in my mind, I kept thinking, how are they going to prove intent? Trump is so careful to say people told me, or I heard that. And how are they ever going to get to intent?
I think now, they have got a big body of evidence on intent, on his criminal intent. That he knew he had lost the election, and he wanted to steal power. And that`s fraud. It is a crime, it one of those years crimes that can be committed.
So, I think Merrick Garland, if he is not totally awake now to the pressure that he is going to be facing, I think now for him not to indict, frankly, would cause this country more harm that even if he indicts and there is a hung jury or not a successful conviction.
O`DONNELL: Andrew Weissmann, if you are a discretionary running a grander like this. And you don`t want to interfere with the Justice Department, and you may in fact want to help the Justice Department get to where it needs to get, in its investigation, what would -- is there anything you would do differently in your own investigation as a district attorney to try to help the Justice Department?
WEISSMANN: Well, the states and the federal prosecutors can coordinate. They can permission share what is happening in the grand jury with criminal prosecutors at the state level, and at the federal level.
Here to pick up on what Claire said, if you are the federal government here, it is unusual to see the state proceeding on what really is a prong of the conspiracy that was laid out by the January 6 committee, and really should be investigated as a whole by the federal government.
But one way to do that is to have close coordination. We haven`t seen signs of that yet. But I would be very surprised if we don`t see that in short order.
O`DONNELL: Andrew Weissmann, and Claire McCaskill, thank you very much for joining us on this chapter of this story. There will be more. Thank you very much.
And coming up, Congressman Adam Schiff joins us with his reaction to the Georgia subpoenas of Lindsey Graham, Rudy Giuliani, and John Eastman, and what he can tell us about the January 6 Committee`s next scheduled hearing next week. That`s next.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
[22:23:40]
O`DONNELL: You are 17 years old, they`re working your first internship, you are one of the lucky ones who has landed internship with your member of the House of Representatives. And then you pick up the phone at the office. And you hear this.
(BEGIN AUDIO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: You backstabbing son of a (EXPLETIVE DELETED). You go against Trump you`ll know y`all mother (EXPLETIVE DELETED) are sitting up there lying. Like a damn dog.
(END AUDIO CLIP)(
O`DONNELL: And then you fell out of form noting that Illinois Republican Congressman Adam Kinzinger has received yet another call in opposition to his service on the January 6 Committee. And then, those calls keep coming.
(BEGIN AUDIO CLIPS)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: In front of your house this weekend. We know where your family is and we`re going to get you.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Wrath of the Lord God Almighty come upon you, your health, your family, your home, your livelihood, and I`ll pray if it be God`s will that you suffer.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: You and Liz Cheney can both go to hell.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: We`re going to get you. Coming to your house on. Going to get you and Liz Cheney. Going to get you two little (EXPLETIVE DELETED). Ha, ha, ha.
(END AUDIO CLIP)
[22:25:04]
O`DONNELL: Congressman Kinzinger released a three-minute sample of the kinds of calls he has been getting, actually not him but his interns and have been fielding at his office. Thanks to Trump supporters, threats to members of Congress have increased dramatically since Donald Trump became president. They are up 144 percent since 2017.
And as the January 6 Committee continues its work, the threats will surely continue.
Joining us now is Democratic Congressman Adam Schiff of California, who`s chairman of the House Intelligence Committee, a member of the January 6th Select Committee. And he served as a lead impeachment manager for the first impeachment trial of Donald Trump.
Congressman Schiff, thank you very much for joining us tonight.
I`m sure you have heard those calls to Congressman Kinzinger`s office, I am sure you have your own sample that you could release.
What do you say to staffers, those young people, who get those calls?
REP. ADAM SCHIFF (D-CA): Well, it is very hard. And you are right, Lawrence. We all had those calls, certainly all of us on the committee. And we confirm with each other, about the threat environment out there, what we are hearing from people.
I was in a parade over the weekend, actually on July 4th, and most of the crowd was supportive. There was a healthy contingent of people calling me a traitor, saying I betrayed the country and like sentiment.
So we are all getting these kind of threats on the phone. We report them to the Capitol Police when we feel there is sufficiently specific and yes, it is traumatizing, I think for the young people working in our office.
I had young people with me during the parade hearing that kind of feedback from people. And I`ll tell you what was most traumatic for me was at a firework celebration, talking to a -- but I think it was a middle schooler about her active shooter drills. And the fear she feels in school.
And we have a lot to cope with as a country right now. We have to I think reject these calls of violence, and we have to do something far more substantial when it comes to gun violence in particular.
O`DONNELL: The committee announced today, that you will be having a hearing a week from today on Tuesday, there are reports tonight that the witness will be Sarah Matthews. She`s 27 years old. She served as a deputy press secretary in the Trump White House. She resigned that night of January 6th, 2021, with a resignation letter saying, she was deeply disturbed by what I saw. She said: Our nation that needs a peaceful transfer of power.
Can you confirm for us that she will be the public witness next Tuesday?
SCHIFF: I can`t confirm that, one way or the other. I`m going to leave that to my chair or vice chair, or to one of my colleagues who will be handling the next hearing or the next couple of hearings. But we do expect to get into what`s that crowd was made about, the participation of those white nationalist groups, the summoning of that mob to the mall. This is part of the progression that the chair and vice chair announce at the beginning of these hearings.
We pretty much track those all a with a straight state pressure campaign, with a pressure campaign against vice president, hearing on that they lie, and now focusing on that mob itself. And then finally, with the president was doing, and more important, when he was not doing during that attack, that terrible dereliction of duty from the president of the United States.
O`DONNELL: We`ll be here -- in the next hearing, we will be hearing more testimony like we heard from Cassidy Hutchinson, that is in effect testimony from inside the White House?
SCHIFF: Lawrence, I really cannot go into these kinds of past the specifics yet. We -- I know it`s frustrating, at times, to you all, but we have been very disciplined about what we are willing to share in advance and particularly, this is not a hearing that I will be leading. I really don`t want to comment on the specifics.
O`DONNELL: So, but what you just address it is that it will be about actual attackers of the building. Could you, give us some basic frame of the hearing?
SCHIFF: Well, we want to shed light on how that mob came to be there, on January 6. How they were called, how they were brought together, what`s different groups were participating, relationship between groups, how they were incited. So, that will certainly be the subject of some of our upcoming hearings.
[22:29:49]
O`DONNELL: Now you already had your Georgia hearing, feels like a month ago. It was a matter of a couple weeks ago. Georgia focused hearing with Brad Raffensperger, who we know is a witness in the grand jury in Georgia.
Today, we get a flood of subpoenas for that grand jury including for United States Senator Lindsey Graham.
What is your -- what did you see in that -- did you see a pattern in those subpoenas that went out today?
SCHIFF: Yes. You know, the Fulton County district attorney -- you know, hats off to her -- is pursuing this very aggressively. The fake elector plot, the attempt to interfere with the secretary of state`s office, with the secretary of state in particular. The calls, the urging, the false claims of fraud, the false presentation about that video that took place at the State Farm Arena suggesting a corruption that wasn`t there.
And I have to think that it was very telling for the district attorney`s office in Fulton County to watch our hearing and see the Attorney General Bill Barr, deputy attorney general and others, talk about how they investigated this. How it was complete nonsense, and they told the president this.
And so that demonstrates the president and his campaign`s knowledge that what they were pushing in Georgia was just plain false and fraudulent. And so I think that provided some important evidence to the district attorney`s office.
I do want to underscore something that Andrew told you before the break because I completely concur with it. It is very unusual for a local district attorney`s office to be way out ahead of the U.S. Justice Department in a case of federal and national significance.
It is very unusual for Congress to be way out ahead of the Justice Department. And it really ought to be a broad Justice Department investigation, and I hope that the actions of our committee and Fulton County, have given the Justice Department a real sense of urgency about these matters.
O`DONNELL: Congressman Adam Schiff, thank you very much for joining us tonight. Always appreciate it.
SCHIFF: Thank you.
O`DONNELL: Thank you.
Coming up, there was sadly, nothing new in yesterday`s mass murder At the Fourth of July parade in Highland Park, Illinois except the names and the lives and the deaths of the new victims.
Mass murderers have used rooftops before, for shooting down crowds as well as high floors in hotel windows. If you pay attention to all of the details about what happened yesterday, you will learn nothing new about this American way of death being gunned down by a mass murderer with an assault weapon.
The only detail that matters is the detail that guarantees that it will happen again soon and the next mass murderer will probably buy his murder weapon legally also. And that is because the Republican Party is now dedicated to a position that guarantees that America`s mass murderers are the best-equipped mass murderers in the world. That is next.
[22:33:16]
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
O`DONNELL: He bought the mass murder weapon legally. That`s really all you have to know about the details of how the mass murder was carried out -- the mass murder of seven people at a Fourth of July parade in Chicago`s northern suburb of Highland Park. While the mass murderer was at it, he wounded 46 people. He is of course like most American mass murderers a young man, 21 years old, white. He`s also a Trump supporter and the son of an Illinois Republican politician who is also a Trump supporter and who liked this tweet after the mass murder of 19 children and 2 teachers in Uvalde, Texas this tweet saying, "Protect the Second Amendment like your life defends on it. Retweet if you agree."
Today Mitch McConnell said the only thing that matters about the mass murderer is that he has mental health problems. But that is not it because other countries have the same or more mental health problems that this country has, but only in this country do Republicans make sure that everyone who wants to buy a mass murder weapon can buy a mass murder weapon.
And so yesterday`s mass murderer in Highland Park at the Fourth of July parade bought his mass murder weapon legally because this is the country where he could do that. And he could do it and did it because Republicans do everything they can every day to make sure America`s mass murderers are the best equipped mass murderers in the world.
Joining us now is Shannon Watts, the founder of Moms Demand Action, a group advocating for gun safety.
[22:39:44]
O`DONNELL: And Shannon, because I follow you on Twitter and you follow the details of these things very carefully in order to debunk all the Republican arguments about why we should make sure that mass murders are able to get these guns, I know more details than I think we -- that I think I need to understand what this is.
It is very obvious what this is. Someone like this could go buy this mass murder weapon legally, and use it whenever he wanted to.
SHANNON WATTS, FOUNDER, MOMS DEMAND ACTION: That is exactly right. And as you said, the details are still unfolding, but it is eerily similar to what we have seen time and time again from Uvalde, to Buffalo, to Charleston, to Parkland and on and on.
You know, if you look at the shootings since 1966 in this country, about 190 shooters have killed over four people in public places. Five of those shooters were women, the rest were all men. And 40 percent of them were between the ages of 18 to 29.
Now, there are other countries and peer nations that are full of disgruntled young men. Only America gives them easy access to arsenals and ammunition. And that is what we saw in this case, it appears to be the case that this person had easy legal access to weapons of war, and used them to destroy an entire community.
O`DONNELL: You know, when these events happen, I know what we are going to do, and I know what we are going to do on programs like this. And I know we are going to say the same words or versions of the same way words that we said before. And it seems like the people who need to hear it do not hear it, refuse to hear it.
I want to put up that photograph again of this police officer in Highland Park, and what he was dealing with yesterday. And Shannon, at various points in our history the Vietnam War, the Civil Rights Movement in the 1960s, there were certain photographs that told the story more powerfully than anything any speech anyone could give.
And this photograph for me I hope is one of those photographs. That this police officer should not have seen what he had to see, should not be dealing with what he has to deal with. The community he serves should not be suffering this. And yet, the words we say do not get through to the people who are enabling this to happen.
WATTS: The photograph is stunning and it is tragic, And the stories that are coming out including the parents of a toddler who were killed leaving this two-year-old an orphan.
This community is traumatized forever. In fact, I think our nation is traumatized right now. I think we are all dealing with trauma from gun violence that happens every single day. 110 people are shot in this country, hundreds more wounded.
And it is not just mass shootings, right. It is the daily gun violence that is killing Americans. And just down the street from Highland Park in Gary, Indiana ten people were killed and wounded at a cookout, at a barbecue for the Fourth of July.
So this is a crisis in this country, and Lawrence, I understand the frustration, I do. But I also want to be clear that we are making progress. I wouldn`t wake up and do this work every day as a volunteer for 10 years if we weren`t. We have passed laws all over the country, hundreds of them that save lives today.
Hundreds (INAUDIBLE) action volunteers who were with Governor Murphy in New Jersey as he signs sweeping gun reform legislation into law. They are passing policies through city councils in places like Virginia and Colorado and even lower than that at school boards.
You know, when Ohio`s governor signed a permit-less carry bill into law, and then when he signed a law allowing teachers to be armed, school boards stood up and said no, not in our school district you will not endanger our students.
So things are happening, progress is happening, but we do need everyone to use their voice and vote on this issue.
O`DONNELL: Shannon watts, we need -- I needed to hear your determination and your version of optimism about this tonight because I`m sitting here, I`m looking at this photograph of Kevin McCarthy 37 years old, his wife Irina 35 years old, both killed leaving the orphan two year old who you mentioned to be brought up now by the grandparents. And I have no words to follow what I`m seeing in this shooting this time.
And so thank you very much for delivering what we needed to hear tonight. Thank you very much, Shannon.
WATTS: Thank you.
O`DONNELL: Coming up, we have an update tonight from Uvalde, the most recent deadliest mass murder before Highland Park. That is next.
[22:44:52]
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
O`DONNELL: Today the Democratic nominee for governor of Texas Beto O`Rourke said, "It has been six weeks since 19 children and two teachers were taken from us and Uvalde yet Governor Abbott has done nothing meaningful to prevent another mass shooting. Take action and save lives."
[22:49:49]
O`DONNELL: On Sunday, Beto O`Rourke tweeted, "94 percent of Republican voters in Texas support universal background checks, 98 percent of Democratic voters in Texas support universal background checks. Greg Abbott still opposes them."
On Friday the newest member of the city council in Uvalde was forced to resign from the city council because he refused to attend public meetings of the city council. Pete Arredondo was secretly sworn into the city council by the mayor of Uvalde one week after the mass murder at Robb Elementary School where 19 children and two teachers were murdered while Pete Arredondo was standing in the hallway of the school for over an hour and refusing to order police officers to go through a classroom door and confront the mass murderer. Pete Arredondo was there in his capacity as the police chief of the Uvalde school district.
The "New York Times" report, "Martin Herrera who lost a grandson shot and has been helping a surviving granddaughter recover from the horror of the day called the resignation a step in the right direction. Mr. Herrera said Mr. Arredondo should also vacate his post as the school police chief immediately. But Mr. Herrera said he also wanted to see others who botched the response and the aftermath face consequences."
Joining us now is Texas state senator Roland Gutierrez. He represents Texas` 19th district which includes Uvalde. And Senator, let me begin with what you felt when you heard the news from Highland Park yesterday, another mass murder.
ROLAND GUTIERREZ (D), TEXAS STATE SENATOR: Well Lawrence, first off thank you for having me on. Yesterday we posted that image of that police officer, you know, with his hands in his face.
This is a grown man. You know, just a law enforcement officer crying most likely. Just seeing that devastation that we saw in Uvalde for weeks on end it seemed because it just didn`t seem to go away. My heart goes out for those folks in Highland Park because they are now going to experience what we have had to experience here in San Antonio and the Uvalde area. You know, I don`t wish this on anybody.
O`DONNELL: You have been trying to get at the truth of what happened inside the school. Pete Arredondo has resigned the city council, but not resigned his police position. He is on administrative leave, which means, there is no police chief of the school district at this point. Are you getting any closer to finding out more of what happened inside the school?
GUTIERREZ: As you know Lawrence, we filed a lawsuit, we should be in court here in the next couple of weeks with regard to that.
Today, you know, you have called this the Texas cover-up, today the mayor of Uvalde called it a cover-up. We need to look at the people that are doing the covering up. And that is the Department of Public Safety, this district attorney`s office, also state employees -- there was 12 officers in that hallway.
Pete Arredondo is a symptom of a larger problem. A larger problem was that there was systemic failure. We, as Americans don`t ever want to admit that our system failed.
But the system failed in Uvalde. You could look at the stark distinctions yesterday up in the Illinois area where you saw a briefing every 30 minutes. We had briefings every three days in Texas. And we are still waiting for the answers.
It is time that the folks here in Texas woke up and started to see the systemic failures that happened from the top layers of government on to the local officers.
O`DONNELL: What are the families doing now as they wait for this information. What else can they do?
GUTIERREZ: Well, you are starting to see things like last week, and the mayor`s city council meeting, one of the woman, one of the sisters of the teacher that passed away, she started a petition to remove the district attorney`s office there. That is the kind of anger that is fomenting in the community.
You are starting to see Jasmine Gaza, is the sister of Jackie Gaza, she`s going to have a rally this Sunday in Uvalde. People are very anguished and their angry about what has happened. They are angry about the police response. And they are angry about the systemic failures.
In 2022, not one single radio system worked inside that brick building. We are now finding out over the last seven years, that Greg Abbott was given notice of these failed systems, and did nothing about it, did nothing to fix it.
Those are the kinds of systemic failures that we are talking about. And we need to start looking at this in greater detail.
O`DONNELL: Texas state senator Roland Gutierrez, thank you very much for joining us again tonight.
GUTIERREZ: Thank you Lawrence.
O`DONNELL: Thank you.
We`ll be right back.
[22:54:42]
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
[22:59:52]
O`DONNELL: Time for tonight`s LAST WORD.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
DONALD TRUMP, FORMER PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: All I want to do is this. I just want to find 11,780 votes, which is one more than we have.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
O`DONNELL: That is tonight`s LAST WORD.
"THE 11TH HOUR WITH STEPHANIE RUHLE" starts now.