Summary
Trump White House counsel Pat Cipollone to testify behind closed doors with January 6 investigators. WNBA star Brittney Griner pleads guilty to drug charges in Russian court.
Transcript
ALI VELSHI, MSNBC HOST: Chris, thank you very much. You have yourself a good evening. We`ll see you tomorrow.
And thanks to you at home for joining us this hour.
He was fired from his very first job for lying. It was his first job as a newspaper reporter in London and he got caught making up quotes. The more right-wing newspaper didn`t see that as disqualifying so they sent him up to Brussels to cover the headquarters of the European Union.
Once there, he spent the early 1990s doing what he did best, he made things up. They filed reports about how the autocratic foreigners running the E.U. were making harebrained rules about what the U.K. could and couldn`t do. Things like the shape of Britain`s strawberries and how British cheese could be made, and making good old fashioned English fishermen wear hair nets. There was even an entire column about the E.U. making condoms too small.
None of this was true but he seemed to think it was all great fun. He told an interviewer quote: I was just chucking these rocks over the garden wall and listening to the amazing crash from the greenhouse next door over an England. Everything I wrote from Brussels was having this amazing, explosive effect on the Conservative Party. It really gave me this, I suppose, rather weird sense of power, end quote.
His right-wing newspaper would splash its headlines over the front page of the secret evil plans of European bureaucrats to take over British life and rule the U.K. from afar. And his newspaper readers learn to distrust and hate the E.U. Those readers included a lot of your conservative lawmakers and he watched with glee a civil war broke out in his own party about how anti-Europe they should be, because people who know them him well, we`ll tell you back even then as a cub reporter, chucking those rocks over the garden wall, he had higher ambitions.
His name of course was Boris Johnson. You have to hand it to him one score. However improbably, he did eventually achieve the highest ambition of them all. He became the prime minister of the United Kingdom. All it took was tearing his party and his country apart and plunging the U.K. into a catastrophic economic and logistical crisis by ranching is nation out of that thing that he taught so many of his countrymen to hate, the European Union.
And the story of how Boris Johnson came to resign as prime minister today after three tumultuous years at the helm is, of course, its own unique tale of hubris and scandal. Unlawfully suspending parliament to ram through his own Brexit deal, throwing parties during COVID lockdowns, promoting a lawmaker he knew at a history of sexual harassment allegations, trying to get a job for his girlfriend -- enough scandals to have brought down ten prime ministers. He blustered through all of them until he couldn`t.
But it`s also the story of what happens -- stop me if this sounds too familiar -- when too many people are taken in by an ambitious liar who for years is treated like a joke until suddenly he`s the most dangerous man in the country.
Take a look at this clip of Boris Johnson on a news quiz show in 2003. This is just a couple of years after he first became a member of parliament. Watch as how much of a joke even he treats the idea of him being prime minister someday.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP, 2003)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: There has been talk of you, Boris, perhaps becoming the next conservative leader.
BORIS JOHNSON, THEN MEMBER OF PARLIAMENT: I think the chances of that are about --
(CROSSTALK)
JOHNSON: You know, being blinded by champagne cork or decapitated by a Frisbee or - not to disuse fridge or some other statistically.
You got a very effective opposition which is being grotesquely let down by the media.
(LAUGHTER)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: They`re laughing, Boris. They`re laughing.
JOHNSON: They are. And they`re agreeing, they`re clapping.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Yeah.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
VELSHI: It was all a joke. There was no way someone as buffoonish as Boris Johnson could get it together to become prime minister.
Once he became mayor of London, a surprise in such a liberal city, the iconic image of him hanging helplessly of that zip line, British flags in hand, boosting his cities hosting of the Olympics. He didn`t take himself or anything too seriously. He managed to come across as harmless.
When he campaigned to get people to vote to leave the E.U. in the 2016 Brexit referendum, he toured the country with frightening-looking images of hordes of foreigners invading, promising he`d save all this money and reinvested in health care.
[21:05:03]
It was all invented.
Boris Johnson just wanted to be prime minister. He watched gleefully as the Brexit referendum and then the years of trying to actually extricate the U.K. from the E.U., this whole project built out of his lies and ambition tore the country apart.
But he did finally get the job he wanted and he had to be dragged kicking and screaming out of office. There is a reason why people call Boris Johnson Trumpian. But for all the obvious parallels to our recent history, it appears the United Kingdom is going to get one thing out of this change of leaders that we didn`t get, a peaceful transfer of power.
Now, let`s be clear is not over yet. Johnson says he will remain prime minister until his party chooses a successor which could take months. And it`s not like he`s built up a lot of trust. Some people think his resignation announcement maybe just a delay tactic, and he hopes that he can still hold on his job long term.
But I think it`s fair that no one expects Boris Johnson to send an armed mob of his supporters to storm parliament if he doesn`t get his way. One reason for that is that Boris Johnson doesn`t have many supporters left. More than 50 members of Johnson`s government quit in order to force him out. His own party abandoned him, something that never happened to Donald Trump.
And here in this country, not only do we not get a peaceful transition of power, we are still investigating, still learning the full contours of Trump`s attempt to break our democratic system to remain in power.
Yesterday marked 18 months since the attack on the Capitol. The Justice Department says more than 855 people have been arrested for their roles in the attack, nearly 330 of whom have pled guilty including a handful of militia members who pled guilty to seditious conspiracy. Another ten people have been found guilty at trial. As for the investigation in Congress tomorrow, Trump`s White House counsel Pat Cipollone, who was in the middle of so many crucial moments in the days and weeks leading up to the attack on the capital, Pat Cipollone will set for a transcribed video interview with the January 6th committee.
And next week, more public hearings. On Tuesday morning, the committee will prevent present its findings and links between Trump and the extremist militias the played a pivotal role in the attack. This will reportedly include details of conversations between Trump allies and these extremist groups.
And the committee will reportedly be holding a second hearing next week on Thursday. This one will be in primetime, which may suggest that they expected to be particularly important. Perhaps we can expect some kind of synthesis of all the investigations uncovered thus far. It`s going to take a while to come to terms with all the damage wrought by January 6 and by Donald Trump`s time in power. Like Boris Johnson, it wasn`t too long ago that Donald Trump was a figure of ridicule, his presidential aspirations a joke.
Then their respective political parties fall in line behind them. Today in the U.K., the conservative party has belatedly realized the mistake they made. We`re still waiting on the Republicans.
Joining us now is Luke Broadwater, the Pulitzer Prize-winning reporter for "The New York Times". He`s also one of the reporters who broke the news about Pat Cipollone reaching a deal to testify before the January 6 investigation.
Luke, thank you for being with us tonight. We appreciate your time.
LUKE BROADWATER, CONGRESIONAL REPORTER, THE NEW YORK TIMES: Thanks for being having me. Good evening.
VELSHI: Good evening to you.
Let`s talk about Pat Cipollone`s interview tomorrow. He`s one of those characters, we said his name and talk so much about him in the last week or so that it may be civil to remind us why he is such an important witness right in this moment?
BROADWATER: Well, Pat Cipollone is the top attorney in the White House in the final weeks of the Trump administration. In that position, he is privy to every extreme plot and plan that is presented to Donald Trump and that Donald Trump considers. He`s there for conversations about seizing voting machines. He`s there was a plan is floated to send false letters to state officials saying the DOJ, the Justice Department has found fraud and they should reconsider their election results.
He`s there when Bill Barr offered to turn in his resignation to Donald Trump and Donald Trump accepts it after Bill Barr concludes there is no widespread fraud in the election. And is there on January 6th when Donald Trump is in the Oval Office in the dining room and Cipollone and others come in to tell him to try to call off the mob as they are storming the building, and Donald Trump refuses.
And according to Cassidy Hutchinson`s testimony, the White House say that we all saw testify last week that he was there when Donald Trump said that he was accepting of the mobs endorsement of hanging like pants, that he thought they had the right idea.
[21:10:14]
So -- and there may be other things that we don`t even know about. I`m just saying what I know. Pat Cipollone would have had access to multiple other conversations that have not yet been reported. So his testimony could potentially be very explosive for the committee.
VELSHI: What`s your sense of when we`re going to find out about his testimony and when we`re going to actually see any of it?
BROADWATER: Well, we are going to do our best to get it leaked as soon as he testifies tomorrow. I don`t know if we can guarantee that or not. They`ve been pretty good about keeping leaks to a minimum.
But, you know, we do expect them to use video from Pat Cipollone at perhaps the second hearing next week. I do think there is a potential of Pat Cipollone`s testimony if it is explosive enough that we could see another hearing added featuring his testimony in large part or even hearing pushback into the following week. As of right now, I expect them to use that a potentially the hearing that most of us on the Hill will be a Thursday evening in primetime. That hasn`t been officially announced yet, but that`s the hearing we`re dealing with Donald Trump`s more than three- hour delay in calling off the mob and I think that this testimony would fit almost perfectly in that session.
VELSHI: So, there are two things next week. There`s this one that we don`t have confirmed on Thursday night dealing with what you said, and here`s Tuesday`s hearing which we think is going to deal, we`ve been told by the members of the committee, it`ll be deal with the links between the extremists and militia members and Donald Trump`s allies and perhaps even Donald Trump himself. Until now, those have been parallel tracks of investigation, the militias and the extremists what they were doing on the capitol around and let the Trump allies were doing.
There are no attempt on Tuesday to bring that together?
BROADWATER: Yes, and this is the hearing that I am actually most interested in, because this is has been the big question for me from the start. We know Donald Trump encouraged the mob to come to the Capitol on January 6, and we know they brought weapons and they attacked the building and they were carrying out this plan.
Is there anything more? Are there closer ties than what Donald Trump said? We`ve heard of some of these ties. We know about Roger Stone and the close ally of Donald Trump and how he was involved with some members of the Oath Keepers and the Proud Boys, and how he had some of these extremist groups as bodyguards. Perhaps that will be discussed.
We know there was a meeting in the garage between the Proud Boys leader and the Oath Keepers leader. Perhaps that will be discussed.
We know one of the leaders tried to call Donald Trump in the January 6 and use an intermediary who nobody is identified yet. So we don`t know who that intermediary is.
So, I am very, very interested to see who in the political world does the committee believe was the link between Trump and the extremist groups and how much planning, coordination, if any took place.
VELSHI: You said something interesting. He talked about Thursday`s hearing possibly dealing with the three hours of inaction. Liz Cheney very specifically refers to as 187 minutes of inaction, a little longer than three hours. Her argument, and in fact she has been out ahead of some of the Democrats on the committee, her argument is that it was more in that inaction. You can see it as inaction, but he actually failed to stop something he knew was happening.
And I suspect between Tuesdays and Thursdays hearing, the committees going to try and illustrate that for Americans, that wasn`t the America not doing something it was the president failing to do something to protect democracy and the sanctity of the electoral count.
BROADWATER: Yes, she often uses the words dereliction of duty. I think that most people when they see Donald Trump when they hear testimony about Donald Trump agreeing with the mob -- when he knows they have weapons and he says let`s march into the Capitol anyway. When he sees them attacking the building and agrees with what they are doing and thinks it`s proper to put pressure on and then tweets out against Mike Pence saying he didn`t have the courage to do what he needed to do, I think most Americans see that or are aghast at those actions.
That said, if one of the goals of the committee is to establish a criminal conspiracy or to provide evidence that would help prosecutors advance a case of criminal conspiracy, they will need to put some more meat and bones at these hearings. We`ve heard Cassidy Hutchinson`s testimony, are there other people who can testify to similar things to backup that testimony? And other things we don`t know about. Are there conversations that Donald Trump had a lot to be revealed?
So, you know, I`m going to be watching like the rest of America very closely these hearings.
VELSHI: Look, thank you as always for your time. "New York Times" congressional reporter Luke Broadwater with some excellent reporting.
Whatever since Roe was overturned, the fight over abortion access, which used to be either national or was it at a time, is now playing out in a dozen states at once, all in different ways. Every day, it`s not like an avalanche of news, but today was a particularly big day on that front. Both for bad news and for good news, that`s next.
But first, an update on the story we lead the show with last night, "The New York Times" broke the incredible story of how the former FBI director, James Comey, and his former deputy, Andrew McCabe, both of whom President Trump viewed as his enemies for their role in starting the investigation into Trump`s connection to Russia. Last night, "The New York Times" broke the news both Comey and McCabe were selected from the IRS says supposedly random most intense audit.
The odds of being selected for that audit are about one in 30,000. Two people who Trump saw as its top enemies were selected.
Well tonight, the IRS has asked the Treasury Department inspector general to investigate how that happens. Maybe it was truly random. Maybe it wasn`t. Looks like we are about to find out.
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[21:21:03]
VELSHI: This bright pink building you are going to see is known as the pink house in Mississippi. It was the only health care facility in the state that provided abortions. Until today.
The pink house more formally known as the Jackson Women`s Health was the clinic at the center of the Supreme Court case that allowed this conservative court to overturn Roe and Casey. Busier than ever this week with streams of cars, with license plates from Texas, Mississippi, Louisiana, and Arkansas, pulling up with patience. Jackson Women`s Health performed its last abortion procedure before the end of the day yesterday. And then it closed its doors for the last time.
Abortion rights advocates posted signs on the properties fencing. They said things like we will always fight for health care. And this is not the end. We have hoped. We have each other.
The pink house tried to put up one more fight this week to prevent the state`s trigger law firm shuttering its doors. But it lost that battle on Tuesday, when a judge denied the clinics request to temporarily block the trigger ban from taking effect today.
Most abortions are now outlawed in Mississippi, effective Sunday. Some clinic workers began packing up the pink house.
Abortion laws influx all over the country with over a dozen states now subjected to trigger bans. These laws are changing so much so fast you can literally track the daily changes on "The New York Times" state-by-state, like you would track viral COVID trends.
But it`s important to remember, the reason these laws are influx because of a sentiment written on those posters outside of the pink house today. People refuse to believe this is the end. They have enduring hope that it will not allow them to given to these extreme anti-health care laws. And they are putting in the work every single day to fight back.
Today, the only remaining abortion provider in North Dakota, Red Women`s River Clinic in Fargo, filed a lawsuit in state court seeking to block enforcement of North Dakota`s trigger ban, which would prohibit nearly all abortions in the state, now that we are in a post-Roe world. That ban is to take effect on July 28th.
There are a bunch of other abortion providers fighting in court, filing lawsuits in states across the country, including Ohio, Oklahoma, Florida, Idaho, Texas, West Virginia. Some of those lawsuits, one in Kentucky, and other in Louisiana, have actually successfully gotten injunctions, or a temporary restraining orders allowing abortions to continue there for now. And some states elected officials are fighting back, too.
This week, Colorado Governor Jared Polis signed an executive order to protect reproductive rights in his state. Police said he will, quote, declined requests for the arrest, surrender, or extradition of any person charged with a criminal violation of the law of another states, where the charge and balls providing or assistance reproductive health care.
In North Carolina yesterday, the governor also signed a executive order protecting abortion rights in the state. Not only are some elected officials making sure that the will of the people`s heard in their state, the people are gearing up to take the fight for reproductive rights head on, at the ballot box.
According to a "Washington Post" analysis, quote, voters as many as eight states will vote on abortion this year. Two additional states have been trying to add abortion policies to their ballots. And they are up against a dead deadline to collect signatures to get it.
Michigan has until Monday to gather 425,000 signatures, but, they already got nearly twice that. Organizers their report about 800,000 signatures, and barring any unforeseen issues abortion will be on the ballot in Michigan in November, which means voters will have a chance at a state constitutional amendments, ensuring reproductive rights.
In Arizona, today was the deadline. The group spearheading the effort, Arizona for Reproductive Freedom, needed 356,000 signatures today, to put abortion access on the ballot, and to make a part of the state constitution.
[21:25:01]
Ultimately, they fall short of the goal for this year. But they did collect more than 175,000 signatures in an incredible feat considering the campaign started 61 days ago. And now, with their sights set on 2024, they say not to count them out just yet.
Campaign treasurer, Shasta McManus, had this to say on the matter. Quote, I am confident that we will succeed in bringing this to voters in 2024. This campaign will not stop until abortions are once again legal and accessible across Arizona.
Joining us is Shasta McManus, treasurer and cofounder of Arizonans for Reproductive Freedom.
Ms. McManus, you for joining us tonight.
SHASTA MCMANUS, TREASURER AND CO-FOUNDER, ARIZONANS FOR REPRODUCTIVE FREEDOM: Thank you so much for having me. We really appreciate it.
VELSHI: What are you feeling right now? A remarkable effort 61 days in excess of 175,000 signatures, but falling short of what needed to happen to put it on the ballot.
MCMANUS: While today is really hard for us, we are celebrating today because we accomplish something historic. Arizona`s liberty and freedom is 100 percent grassroots people-driven effort, and volunteered showed out by the thousands. We had over 3,000 people on the ground, that collected 175,000 signatures, and as you said, it is 61 days. That is over 2,800 signatures a day, by volunteers that felt this urgency.
And, behind me, you can see the boxes of positions that we had planned to turn in. But behind me is 175,000 people in the state of Arizona, who came out and found us to scientists position, because they understand the urgency.
VELSHI: So this is important because 175,000 people had something that they could do, right? Because people across this country say what do we do now? And that is something that they can do or could have done.
How do people who cannot believe these laws that are crumbling state to state, Arizona`s law governing abortion dates back to 1901. There are people in your state that cannot imagine in 2022 that you are going back to 1901, and that its laws about abortion.
MCMANUS: You are exactly right on every bit of that. We went to bed on a Thursday, and we woke up on a Friday. We rolled back over 100 years. When these laws were made, the civil war was still going on. All of us did not have rights to votes, you know, then.
So the laws that Arizona are under right now, are barbaric. This coalition was founded following the leak, the Supreme Court leak. And we were overwhelmed by the number of health care providers, patients, abortion providers, reproductive advocates, who all came together to say we see what`s is coming, and we have to do something now. We can`t wait to try again later.
And we knew this was going to be an uphill battle. But we also wanted to make sure that on that Friday when the Supreme Court decision did come down, that the people of Arizona could look up and see somebody fighting for them. That they weren`t alone, and that we are a community that cares about their reproductive rights and their futures.
We had an option to wait two years. But we understand in these exact two years and that`s what`s sad about today, is that lives and livelihoods are going to be decimated. In the next two years. And we all know who this is going to affect the most. And of course it is you know those who are living with limited means, are black and brown indigenous people in Arizona, working families.
We understand who this is going to hurt the most. And while that is sad, we are and we see that Arizonans are ready to fight back, because this effort has been historic and we so our confident for our next effort. Arizonians came out and showed we are ready for this and we are right to take us on. Give us two more weeks and we would have been there. We are ready to go.
VELSHI: Ms. McManus, in the last two years, we`ve interviewed a lot of people buy home camera, and we`ve seen a lot of interesting things. You`ve got an old sewing the sheen over your right shoulder, you`ve got a guitar earlier left shoulder.
[21:30:01]
But this is one of the most interesting shots have ever seen, because behind you are 175,000 signatures of people who decided they were going to do something. And we thank you for that.
MCMANUS: Thank you and thank you for highlighting the work of our amazing volunteers and the people of Arizona, because was absolutely a coalition effort and we are filled with warmth and gratitude for everybody, and we are ready to go again.
VELSHI: Shasta McManus is treasurer and co-founder of Arizonans for reproductive freedom -- thank you for your time tonight.
Well, there were Trump steaks, Trump University, Trump`s reoccurring donation scandal, you can see a lot about president -- former President Donald Trump. But he`s nothing but if not inventive in how to monetize his supporters, and his latest grift is a doozy. We`ve got that next.
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[21:35:28]
VELSHI: So you can pay 35 bucks for general tier ticket which gets you general admission. You can pay $195 for the liberty ticket, and that one is buy one, get one free. Then there is the delegate section for $495, or you can get the ambassador level for a steal, of nearly 1,300 bucks.
And either of those last two tears, delegates and ambassador, include a Q&A breakfast with a famed conspiracy theorists, Dinesh D`Souza. The presidential ticket goes for nearly $4,000, which gets you among other things, a photo op with Kimberly Guilfoyle.
But if you want a photo with the actual former president himself, you need a patriot level ticket. And I can`t tell you how much it will cost you to be a patriot because the cost isn`t even listed on the website. Better hurry though because these prices won`t last long. According to the site, the next price increase could come tomorrow.
These are the ticket prices for the American Freedom Tour which is Donald Trump`s latest gig, lucrative, paid speeches. It is, of course, important to state the obvious. Getting paid speeches is not a strange or unusual thing for a former president to do, by any means. Former President Bush, Clinton, Obama, they all took on lucrative speaking engagements.
The key difference is that those were paid for mostly by businesses. Donald Trump`s new ventured getting paid speeches, while they are not paid by big businesses. They are paid mostly by individual fans buying tickets.
Here is the latest entrepreneurial report from "The Washington Post". The title is, quote, Trump`s new moneymaker, political speeches to fans, the former president makes millions appearing at events that resemble his political rallies.
Here it is, quote, the fees aren`t going to Trump`s political action committee, his 100 million dollar war chest. This event was not a Trump rally, where attendance is free. Instead, it was a for profit show, more like a rock concert. The proceeds benefit Trump personally as part of a multimillionaire dollar bill to speak at the events. The program, the American Freedom Tour, is the work of a long time motivational speaker promoter with a trail of bankruptcy filings and business disputes across the country.
It is also common for politicians to offer access to big spenders, though the money usually goes to a campaign, not just a candidate`s pockets. Trump moneymaking is especially brazen considering that he is the only modern ex- president contemplate running for president again, end quote.
Donald Trump is not raking in millions from Wall Street firms. He is lining his pockets by selling tickets to regular ordinary people, to what are basically glorified rallies. He is not giving these look at a paid rallies to pour money into his political action committee for his next run for office, the millions are going directly to Donald Trump himself. And he is getting that money from his fans! This is nice work if you can get it.
Joining us now is Isaac Arnsdorf. He`s a national political reporter at "The Washington Post", and one of the reporters byline on this reporting.
Mr. Arnsdorf, thank you for your time tonight. We appreciate it.
ISAAC ARNSDORF, NATIONAL POLITICAL REPORTER, THE WASHINGTON POST: Thanks for having me, Ali.
O`DONNELL: Is it -- from your knowledge, do these rally goers who are buying these tickets know where their money is going, and doesn`t matter? Do you think they would care if they know it was going off the Donald Trump political arsenal, to make America more great again, but into his pockets?
ARNSDORF: We talk to a lot of people. We didn`t find anyone who had a problem with that. There was definitely some -- there were necessarily super clear, they got, they get the Trump campaign fundraising emails. And then they get an ad for this tour. And they buy tickets.
But the reality is, you know, whether the money went to Trump personally, or to the campaign, they were thrilled to do it. Because they really wanted to see Trump, they were willing to pay for it, and they love him, and they want to help him. They wanted to give him their money.
VELSHI: Tell me about who these folks are, because there are a lot of things in life that I would do for free that I probably wouldn`t have 15 bucks to do, and yet there seems to be people willing to do this. Are they enthusiastic Trump supporters?
ARNSDORF: Yeah, absolutely. They are people who have been to Trump rallies before. Or people who haven`t gotten the chance because there wasn`t one nearby. They are regular working people, recent high school graduates, nurses, retirees, and they just really, really, really wanted to see Trump.
[21:40:01]
And they were thrilled to pay for it, like they would pay for concert tickets.
VELSHI: So, one can always understand, or could try to understand why Donald Trump does this, and why it`s different from his predecessors. But who else speaks at these rallies? We got a sense of who the attendees are, who are the cast of characters? Aare there openers and covers for them?
ARNSDORF: Yeah, and they are very handsomely paid as well. They are other right-wing stars like Dinesh D`Souza, you mentioned. Candace Owens, Donald Trump Jr. and Kimberly Guilfoyle. They also have some speakers who offer courses in investment, personal finance, that they are trying to sign you up for some follow-up seminars.
So they is a full range of Republican stars, like you would see at a Trump rally, and then some other things that are more in that for-profit space, too.
VELSHI: But this is not part of a campaign, or the Republican Party, or anything like that? It`s -- a guy who organizes this, like a concert promoter?
ARNSDORF: Yeah, it`s a private business, the guy has a background in motivational speaking. People like Tony Robins, and this opportunity came up, they saw an opportunity, they struck on multi-million dollar deal for Trump to appear at these events, and they have been holding him over the past year, and are planning more.
VELSHI: What is the sense -- you said they are planning, more does that mean more with Donald Trump? Is this Donald Trump thing until he announces that he is running for office or not?
ARNSDORF: Well, he has been holding regular rallies to, you know,
VELSHI: The unpaid kind.
ARNSDORFT: Right. And then you know, kind of on and off between those and these. You know like you mentioned, it`s unusual for a candidate for public office ordinarily would be very sensitive about how they are making money. And any appearance that they are taking money from people who are paying for access with them, and that is just not something that -- not a rule that Trump is playing by.
VELSHI: Isaac, thanks for joining us. Thanks for your reporting. Isaac Arnsdorf is a national political reporter at "The Washington Post". We appreciate your time tonight.
ARNSDORF: Thank you.
VELSHI: Well, it`s been 140 days since the American WNBA star Britney Griner was arrested in Russia on Trumped up charges. That is a longer than Ukraine and Russia have been at war this year, but today, we got hope that Griner`s wrongful detainment may be coming closer to an event. We will have an update after this.
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[21:47:11]
(BEGIN VIDEO CLI)
REPORTER: Tonight, Marine veteran Trevor Reed home in Texas for the first time in nearly three years after being freed from a Russian jail. President Biden agreed to a prisoner swap for a convicted Russian drug smuggler serving 20 years in the U.S.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: We believe that he probably safe our son`s life.
REPORTER: The two prisoners trading places between American and Russian planes at a tarmac in Turkey overnight.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
VELSHI: Last time prisoner between Russia and U.S. took place was just a few months ago in April. Russia`s case against that Prisoner Trevor Reed was sketchy from the start. In 2018, while visiting his girlfriend in Moscow, he was taken to a police station to sober up after a night of heavy drinking. The next moment after this question by the Russian intelligence service, the FSB, the marine veteran was detained and accused of assaulting the officers who taken him in.
During Reed`s trial, those officers struggle to remember the incident. They repeatedly contradicted themselves. The whole thing was such a farce that at one point the judge laughed at the evidence.
So, it`s no surprise the people thought that read was used as something of a bargaining chip for Russia. History may be repeating itself in the case of the WNBA star Brittney Griner. Today, at a Russian courtroom, Griner pleaded guilty to drug charges claiming that the two vape cartridges found in her luggage with police said contain cannabis oil were left there unintentionally. But she still faces up to ten years in jail if convicted. She`s expected back in court on July 14.
Her wife and her team, the Phoenix Mercury, have been speaking up about her imprisonment. Last night, they held a public rally in their home arena, calling on the Biden administration to do more of to free the basketball star.
But ironically, today`s guilty plea could be a sign that we maybe closer to seeing a diplomatic resolution to the situation. A top Russian official has indicated that no steps could be taken to free Griner until her case was resolved.
And with that now in motion, Russia appears interested in exchanging Brittney Griner for a former Soviet military officer and arms dealer named Viktor Bout. Bout is currently serving a 25-years prison sentence for conspiring to sell weapons to people who said they plan to use those weapons to kill Americans.
The Biden administration has not made any official comment on whether they would agree to that swap but had said that Griner`s safe return is a priority.
Now, this situation is also complicated by the fact that Brittney Griner is not the only America held by Russia right now. Paul Whelan has been imprisoned in Russia for more than three years after Russia convicted him of espionage charges which he denies.
So could today`s developments be the first up and bringing one or both these Americans home?
[21:50:02]
Joining us now is Kimberly St. Julian-Varnon, historian and PhD student at the University of Pennsylvania. Her work is focused on race and the Black experience in Russia and the Soviet Union. She`s consulted with the WNBA players union about Griner`s detainment.
Ms. St. Julian-Varnon, good to see you again. Thank you for being with us
KIMBERLY ST. JULIAN-VARNON, HISTORIAN SPECIALIZING IN SOVIET UNION AND UKRAINE: Thank you for having me.
VELSHI: Brittney Griner pled guilty today. Reportedly, this was her decision after consulting with her lawyers and experts. But a little -- a simple Google about the Russian criminal justice system will tell you that there is almost 100 percent conviction court in rate in Russian courts.
ST. JULIAN-VARNON: Yes, the Russian criminal justice system if he can call it that, has almost over 97 percent conviction rate. A good way of thinking about Brittney`s plea and in the Russian system they work a little differently. She has acknowledged her guilt for this crime, it`s still up to the Russian prosecutor to prove the evidence to the crime that she pled guilty to.
So, I think it`s a strategy. It`s one of the ways that she can say she had an accident but you didn`t mean to break Russian law, but that she respects Russian raw law. I think that was a very smart move on her and her legal team`s behalf.
VELSHI: So, the thinking by some legal analysts say that if she does this and allows Russian authorities to say face. If they have any interest in coming up with a deal, she`s not trying to embarrass them. She says, yeah, you got me with stuff.
That said, the allegations against her are not supported by the fact that she may have had to vape cartridges with her. I
ST. JULIAN-VARNON: I think that`s the case. She`s facing two charges. One is procession without intent to sell and the other one have been translated as narcotics trafficking, but it`s bringing in a controlled substance into Russia. So, that would be her having those cartridges in her baggage when she was coming into the Moscow airport, and that is the heavy charge that carries the 5 to 10-year sentence.
VELSHI: Go ahead. I`m sorry. I didn`t mean to interrupt. Carry on.
ST. JULIAN-VARNON: So, in thinking about her acknowledging her guilt, I think one of the reasons she would do that as that in Russian law, it doesn`t necessarily mean matter how many vape cartridges you had, the fact is intended to scene there because she brought it into Russia from a foreign country.
VELSHI: Brittney Griner is rightfully getting attention right now, but there is this case of Paul Whelan. His family has been upset by the difference in the way it is been handled. What`s your sense of it?
ST. JULIAN-VARNON: I can completely understand why Paul Whelan`s family is upset. Paul Whelan is in a Russian security maximum security regime prison. He`s been out for two years. He also had a high profile case at the beginning, but it`s been four years. Media tension has kind of fallen off. He`s continually protested against his conviction and constantly said that he`s innocent.
I think that we are going to talk about Brittney Griner`s case, we`re going to have to talk about Paul Whelan`s case because simply he`s been there longer, he`s in a worse spot compared to where Brittney is now. We were talking about him until we started talking about her.
VELSHI: Right. So, I`m just going to say, is this negative for Paul Whelan or positive now there is a discussion? And that Americans were not as much involved with for Trevor Reed, there`s now a discussion about how Paul Whelan and Brittney Griner might back to America.
ST. JULIAN-VARNON: I definitely see it is a positive because he has been there for so long, and despite the rumors that Trump could get Brittney Griner out, I think Trevor Reed and Paul Whelan are examples of how little Donald Trump did for Americans were held in Russian custody. So Brittney Griner`s case, while it`s terrifying for her family and her supporters, it could be a boon for Paul Whelan and helped him be freed for maximum security Russian prison.
VELSHI: Kimberly, it`s good to see you. Thank you for being with us. Kimberly St. Julian-Varnon is a PhD student in history for Pennsylvania -- thanks for making time to join with us.
ST. JULIAN-VARNON: Thank you.
VELSHI: One of the biggest stories of the decade came to its conclusion today. I`ll have that, up next.
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VELSHI: Former Minneapolis police officer, Derek Chauvin, was sentenced to 21 years behind bars in federal court today. He was convicted for using excessive force under the of color of law, meaning he used the power given to him by the state as a police officer, to go beyond his rightful power, and in this case, used excessive force.
And this wasn`t just for the high profile murder of George Floyd, but also for a separate but similar incident in which he entered a Black 14 year old boy, in 2017. More than two years now since the videos of then Officer Chauvin, kneeling on George Floyd`s neck for nearly nine minutes, made the case a centerpiece of the national Black Lives Matter movement. Just saying his name, George Floyd, is on its own, a rallying cry for the movements, along with his words, I can`t breathe, and the phrase no justice, no peace.
And now, today, the justice part of the story at least in this case has come to an end. Last year, Chauvin was convicted very publicly in state court, of second degree murder, third degree murder, and second-degree manslaughter, for the killing of George Floyd. His new federal prison sentence will be served concurrently with his longer 22 and a half year state level sentence.
But the sentencing marks the last of Chauvin`s slate of cases. And in larger sense, both the state and federal sentences against Derek Chauvin, signal a new commitment to justice by the Minneapolis Justice Department, and our federal Justice Department, a willingness that has not always been there to hold police officers accountable criminally for the crimes that they commit.
That does it for us tonight.
Time now for "THE LAST WORD WITH LAWRENCE OP`DONNELL".
Good evening, Lawrence.