Show: THE LAST WORD WITH LAWRENCE O`DONNELL Date: August 29, 2016 Guest: Russell Schriefer, William Doherty, Dave Archambault II, John Heilemann, Stuart Stevens, Mark Thompson, Robert Traynam
RACHEL MADDOW, MSNBC: Lawrence O`Donnell, good evening, Lawrence --
LAWRENCE O`DONNELL, HOST, THE LAST WORD: Everett, Washington --
MADDOW: Tomorrow at 7:00 p.m. local time. Whether down-ballot Washington Republicans like that or not.
That does it for us tonight, we will see you again tomorrow, now it`s time for THE LAST WORD with Lawrence O`Donnell, good evening Lawrence.
O`DONNELL: Everett, Washington, OK.
MADDOW: Yes --
O`DONNELL: Yes --
MADDOW: Why not? You know, some donor money burning a hole in his pocket.
O`DONNELL: I guess so, that must be it.
MADDOW: Thanks, Lawrence.
O`DONNELL: Thank you, Rachel. Well, Donald Trump is now trying to run for president against Anthony Weiner.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: It has happened again. Former Congressman Anthony Weiner splashed all over the newspapers, and Donald Trump was quick to seize on the news to attack Clinton`s judgment.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Did you see the statement before it was released?
KELLYANNE CONWAY, CAMPAIGN MANAGER, DONALD TRUMP 2016 CAMPAIGN: I did.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Did you -- and you approved of it?
CONWAY: Well, Mr. Trump approves of his statement.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: He doesn`t mention that he contributed to Weiner`s campaign. The last thing I want to talk about is Anthony Weiner because I find his conduct to be disgusting.
DONALD TRUMP, CHAIRMAN & PRESIDENT, TRUMP ORGANIZATIONS & REPUBLICAN NOMINEE, 2016 ELECTION: All the media wants to talk about is the 11 million people --
RUSH LIMBAUGH, RADIO HOST: He`s flip-flopping within the confines of standard ordinary every day political analysis. Trump is outside that.
CHUCK TODD, MODERATOR, MEET THE PRESS: What is his position, specifically on the undocumented immigrant?
REINCE PRIEBUS, CHAIRMAN, REPUBLICAN NATIONAL COMMITTEE: Well, you`re going to find out from Donald Trump very shortly.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I think the question is not whether he`s changing his position, but whether he has a position.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: The basic principle is, build the wall --
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I mean, basically, got a psychopath running for president. I mean, he meets the clinical definition.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
O`DONNELL: Anthony Weiner has a problem. If you didn`t know how bad Anthony Weiner`s problem is until you saw today`s cover of the "New York Post", then you haven`t been paying attention to Anthony Weiner.
Anthony Weiner has been on the cover of the "New York Post" more times than any of us can count. And what got him his first cover of the "New York Post" is the same thing, the very same thing that got on today`s cover of the "New York Post", and every cover he achieved in between, a picture of himself.
Here is today`s "New York Post" which includes a blurred shot of what the "New York Post" says is Anthony Weiner`s child in bed with him.
It`s the little picture in the middle there, while he was sexting with a woman in Colorado who after many months of this stuff, decided it was time for another Anthony Weiner "New York Post" cover.
And so the people who apparently did not understand how bad Anthony Weiner`s problem is were suddenly shocked.
I for one, having known Anthony Weiner long before his first "New York Post" cover was not even slightly shocked.
To be shocked, you`d have to believe that Anthony Weiner`s dangerous, addictive, compulsive behavior was something he could just snap out of without a great deal of professional psychological help.
To be shocked, you`d have to believe that people in the throes of extreme addictive, compulsive behavior do not -- do -- always control themselves in front of their children.
You have to believe that they are actually capable of controlling themselves in front of their children all the time.
And many crack addicts and alcoholics and all -- and people with -- who engage in destructive, addictive behavior do it right in front of their children. Right in front of their babies, and they always have.
It happens all the time. So, shock at today`s "New York Post" cover is a naive reaction. But for some, apparently, it was a last straw.
A local cable channel in "New York City" said they would not use Anthony Weiner for political commentary any more.
The "New York Daily News" said they would not publish his op-ed pieces anymore, and his wife announced today she is separating from Anthony Weiner.
Donald Trump who understands nothing about government and understands nothing about running for president does understand "New York Post" covers.
And so because Anthony Weiner is married to Huma Abedin, a long-time aide of Hillary Clinton`s, Donald Trump decided that this "New York Post" cover is really all about Hillary Clinton.
Donald Trump issued a written statement saying Hillary Clinton was careless and negligent in allowing Weiner to have such close proximity to highly classified information.
So, Donald Trump is outraged that Hillary Clinton allowed -- that`s his word, allowed Huma Abedin to be married to Anthony Weiner.
Trump world is apparently the place where your boss gets to decide who you can be married to. Who you are allowed to be married to. Donald Trump`s campaign manager, of course, thought it was a perfectly reasonable thing to say.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
CONWAY: He knows Anthony Weiner well, and then he talked about the close proximity that he may have had to national security information --
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Yes --
CONWAY: That could be highly classified and that it may have compromised our national security.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
O`DONNELL: Also in Trump world today, everyone including Donald Trump and his campaign manager, everyone trying to figure out what Donald Trump actually thinks about deporting 11 million people who are in this country without legal documentation to be here.
Donald Trump promised repeatedly to deport all of those people, every one of them, repeatedly said that it had to be done.
But last week, he started to publicly soften on the issue. He called it softening, that was his word. Then after two days of that, he suddenly claimed to be hardening again. But today, his campaign manager made him sound pretty soft on the deportation thing.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE:: Well, tell us, how he intends to clear up the confusion over what exactly is his immigration plan in the 11 million or so people here in this country illegally.
How is he going to do that?
CONWAY: You have to watch his speech on Wednesday and --
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Is that a teaser? --
CONWAY: And it will be in there. I could tease you, and I could say that there are many tenets to his plan, I think they`re incredibly important for everyone to remember.
Build a wall which has to be the signature of his campaign since practically day one that`s there. No amnesty, no legalization, no sanctuary city --
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: No amnesty --
CONWAY: No amnesty, no sanctuary cities. Sanctuary cities has become a very inflection -- a very important inflection point in this campaign.
People address sanctuary cities, people also talk about those who have committed a crime leaving immediately.
Enforcing the law and then he will talk about the 11 million, as he said on a different network last week, it could be 30 million, it could be 2 million, we don`t know.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
O`DONNELL: We don`t know, 11 million, 30 million, we don`t know. And what could prove to be the strangest turn and the strangest presidential campaign in history, Donald Trump who may have the strangest doctor in New York City decided to challenge Hillary Clinton to release detailed medical records saying that he would do the same thing.
The only medical information released about Donald Trump so far is the single most absurd letter ever written by a doctor in the history of the practice of medicine on earth.
Here is a picture of Donald Trump`s doctor who wrote that letter, Jacob Bornstein. In the letter, he says he`s been Donald Trump`s doctor since 1980. And before that his father was Donald Trump`s doctor.
The letter says that Donald Trump`s recent "test results" were astonishingly excellent, not exactly medical terminology. The letter also says his cardiovascular status is excellent.
But in another paragraph, the letter reveals that Donald Trump takes 81 milligrams of aspirin daily and a low dose of statins.
The only reason for Donald Trump to take that aspirin and statins is that his cardiovascular status is not excellent. And as I reported, the day that this letter was released last year, the final line of the letter is the strangest sentence ever written by a medical professional in the history of medicine.
If elected, Mr. Trump, I can state unequivocally, will be the healthiest individual ever elected to the presidency. On Friday, Nbc caught up with Dr. Bornstein at his office and here is how he explained the utter absurdity of his letter.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
JACOB BORNSTEIN, PHYSICIAN: At the end of the day, they came to get their letter.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: And so just tell me about the time -- the time crunch like 5 -- or you wrote it --
BORNSTEIN: No, I thought about it all day, and at the end, I get rushed and I get anxious when I get rushed. So, I try to get four or five lines done fast, possible that they would be happy with.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: But it was based on your --
BORNSTEIN: It`s all --
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Evaluation?
BORNSTEIN: It`s all true.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
O`DONNELL: Joining us now, Stuart Stevens, columnist for the "Daily Beast", Republican strategist, he`s also the senior strategist for Mitt Romney`s 2012 presidential campaign. Also with us, John Heilemann, managing editor of "Bloomberg Politics", and co-host of "With All Due Respect" which airs weeknights at 6:00 p.m. Eastern on Msnbc.
And John Heilemann, you never get anxious when you get rushed by -- unlike Dr. Bornstein. So, you had Kellyanne Conway on your show today as we just showed extensively.
I listened carefully for the Trump plan on the deportation or non- deportation of 11 million people. And there were a bunch of words, but no answer.
JOHN HEILEMANN, MANAGING EDITOR, BLOOMBERG POLITICS: To that question, there was no answer. Well, the answer was wait and see on Wednesday --
O`DONNELL: Wednesday, yes, it will be -- it will be in the speech.
HEILEMANN: Yes, and look, I mean, he has now been pretty much everywhere that you can be on this issue with the exception of what full amnesty, we`re going to let everybody here, who is here or stay here with a lot of - - whole bunch of other people across the border.
We`ve seen him go from where he started his campaign to a certain place that was quite far to the right, then a farther place back to the left.
And the Jeb Bush, Marco Rubio position, now it`s really to me utterly unclear what he believes, if anything, at this point.
Because I don`t know that he may not have a view about this, but on Wednesday, apparently, we`re going to know what his view is on Wednesday.
O`DONNELL: Well, Rush Limbaugh who finds himself now speaking for both Donald Trump and Donald Trump supporters had this to say about it, let`s listen to this.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
LIMBAUGH: I don`t think the vast majority of Trump supporters care about deporting 11 million people or 1 million people. I think they care about stopping any further illegal immigration. So they believe the wall.
They think the wall -- even if the wall is symbolic, they believe that Trump is serious about bringing the status quo to a screeching halt.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
O`DONNELL: Stuart Stevens, so, there`s Rush Limbaugh who is talking to Trump supporters every day on his radio show, saying that they don`t care about any of the specifics really, not even the wall. They just care that Trump sounds tougher on this than Hillary Clinton.
STUART STEVENS, COLUMNIST, DAILY BEAST: Look, the whole thing is just a confusing mess. Remember Donald Trump put out a written statement at a time when he was not putting out many written statements, calling for a total and complete ban on Muslims.
And he said that was until the government could figure out what was going on. So, if he`s against that now, and he`s rejecting the idea of a Muslim ban, which is really a religious test, does that mean that the government has figured out what`s going on?
I mean, it`s all very confusing. And the idea of deporting these people, I mean, he talked about a deportation force, which is always kind of confusing because we have ICE which supports people every day.
And now the wall that Mexico is going to pay for apparently is going to be like a virtual wall. I mean, they`re going to -- maybe, get some like coders to build the kind of virtual reality.
It`s just all -- just you know, at his core, Donald Trump is the guy trying to up-sell you to get under coding and he needs to talk to the manager.
(LAUGHTER)
O`DONNELL: John, I want to go back to Kellyanne Conway on your show --
HEILEMANN: Yes --
O`DONNELL: This afternoon, and what she said about this very strange -- it seems strange to me. Idea Donald Trump now has about releasing medical records. Let`s listen to this.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
CONWAY: In terms of health records, he`s just saying, great, more transparency, let`s put them all out there, and he`s challenging her to do the same, why not?
HEILEMANN: So, what about -- what are the records he would put out under those circumstances?
CONWAY: Well, I don`t know, you`d have to ask him. I`m not intimately familiar with his medical records nor should I be.
HEILEMANN: Right --
CONWAY: But he`s willing to do that. In other words, he is willing to -- he has said, he`s willing to put out his medical records.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
O`DONNELL: John, what is going on here? Friday, we saw the emergent of the Trump doctor, which was the single strangest medical event in presidential campaign history, just seeing him.
What are they doing? This -- why are they going into this spot?
HEILEMANN: Again, baffled a little bit by this. And you know, a guy -- I will -- Kellyanne Conway is an incredible campaign professional, and she has a very hard job. I don`t think she knows, but it is what Donald Trump is proposing to put out.
But that seems to me to be a straight forward question. He`s now challenged Hillary Clinton to put out her medical records, saying he will do the same if she does what he`s proposing.
And that -- if you ask, what records are we talking about? What would be the totality of those? Kellyanne does not know the answer to that question. So, it`s kind of a meaningless challenge if we don`t know what`s actually - -
O`DONNELL: Yes --
HEILEMANN: Being challenged. I also just find it extraordinary in the context of the fact that I would like to see more health disclosure on both party sides.
More than Hillary Clinton has done and more than Donald Trump has done by a lot --
O`DONNELL: And she --
(CROSSTALK)
HEILEMANN: But she has gone -- but she has --
O`DONNELL: Yes --
HEILEMANN: Gone a lot more than he has gone --
O`DONNELL: Yes --
HEILEMANN: So, he`s challenging her to a dual --
O`DONNELL: Right --
HEILEMANN: When she`s sort of, you know, armed with a pistol and he`s sort of armed with a sling shot. It so seems kind of a strange thing to take her on when she already has an advantage in terms of transparency.
O`DONNELL: Stuart, can you figure out what the Trump campaign is up to on this one?
STEVENS: No --
O`DONNELL: OK --
STEVENS: I have no idea, this is -- this is sort of the health thing to me, is as baffling as going to Everett, Washington. It`s as if inside Trump headquarters they have one of these lottery machines that has balls in it, and they just pull out a ball at 5:00 and they decide what they`re going to talk about and where they`re going to go.
He`s a guy that is closer to 40 and maybe slipping into the 30s and he`s talking about health records of someone and going to Everett, Washington. It all just -- it doesn`t make sense.
You look at the Senate candidates who are running way ahead -- Republican Senate candidates of Donald Trump.
They`re not acting like this and you have kind of a test case. One is not working, one is working, which one is better? You would think that they would be trying to do -- talk about the economy and --
HEILEMANN: Right --
STEVENS: Stuff that really matters to voters.
HEILEMANN: So, they have this -- so, they have this new ad that they put out --
O`DONNELL: Yes --
HEILEMANN: Right now, (INAUDIBLE) playing in a number of different states with a fair amount of money behind it. These two America`s economy ads.
I believe Kellyanne Conway would like to be talking about the economy, and would like to be talking about what is their paid media?
She`d like to do earned media on that basis. One sort of gets the feeling, and on the basis of the edges of reporting that one can do, that these things, the Anthony Weiner statement, the health record statement, some of the things in Donald Trump`s Twitter feed are being driven much more by Donald Trump.
And although there is now greater control that has been brought to bear on him, that has probably ever been brought before, there`s still this kind of peril operations going on here.
One of which is the professional operation that Kellyanne Conway runs, and one of which is the operation that`s happening out of the end of Donald Trump`s fingertips in its path --
O`DONNELL: But I`ve got to say, when I was washing with you this today, she seemed to love every bit of the nonsensical stuff that she was talking about.
And she says the same stuff Trump says. She seemed especially delighted to attack Stuart Stevens and we --
HEILEMANN: Oh --
O`DONNELL: Just happen to have that clip ready to go. Let`s listen to that.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
CONWAY: I don`t know why Steve is -- why Stuart can`t just support the Republican nominee. So many of us supported Mitt Romney, gave money, volunteered our time, went on TV in support of his candidacy.
That`s fine, that`s his right, do not support us, but please don`t say he`s a Republican consultant who just doesn`t like Donald Trump`s campaign, he is constantly attacking us.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
O`DONNELL: Stuart, your reaction to that?
STEVENS: It`s so strange. You know, the normalization of Donald Trump is something that some people resist, and I`m in their camp. You know, I`m being careful not to attack anyone who supports Donald Trump, I have a lot of friends who support him, a lot of good people really believe he`ll be a good president.
I`m not in that category, I respect differences and I think it`s really important right now to respect differences. But we shouldn`t pretend that this is anything good that`s happening for Republicans.
I mean, we went through this process after 2012, which I think Reince Priebus gets a lot of credit for the direction the party needs to go to.
It`s got to appeal to more non-white voters. It has to. And Donald Trump is doing 180 degrees from that. So, it`s just -- there`s nothing positive about this for what it means to be a Republican or a conservative or any of that.
And I don`t think we should pretend otherwise.
O`DONNELL: Stuart Stevens and John Heilemann, thank you both for joining us tonight, really appreciate it. Coming up, breaking news from Trump world, this could be a first, an apology, a big apology by one of Donald Trump`s African-American supporters.
And later, a leader of the protest of the standing rock reservation in North Dakota will join us.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
O`DONNELL: The "New York Times" is reporting tonight Hillary Clinton`s advisors are talking to Donald J. Trump`s ghost writer of "The Art of the Deal" Tony Schwartz seeking insights about Mr. Trump`s deepest insecurities as they devise strategies to needle and undermine him in that first presidential debate.
The Clinton team is also getting advice from psychology experts to help create a personality profile of Mr. Trump to gauge how he might respond to attacks and deal with a woman as his sole adversary on a debate stage.
We`re going to have more about the psychology of Donald Trump coming up.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
O`DONNELL: Herman Cain is finally back on the campaign trail. Here he is tonight in Atlanta with Mike Pence.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
HERMAN CAIN, AUTHOR & BUSINESS EXECUTIVE: So, when you hear all of this BS about America is a divided nation, no, it is not.
They want you to believe that we are divided, so you would give up on Donald Trump and Mike Pence and you`re not going to do that.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
O`DONNELL: On Saturday, the Trump campaign says Donald Trump will visit a black church in Detroit. Today, another one of Donald Trump`s supporters, Pastor Mark Burns tweeted and then later deleted this picture that some people will surely find offensive.
It reads, "black Americans, thank you for your votes and letting me use you again, see you again in four years." Here is how Mark Burns explained that tweet this afternoon on Msnbc.
(BEGIN AUDIO CLIP)
MARK BURNS, REVEREND MINISTER: The picture is designed to do draw attention to the very fact that Hillary Clinton do pander after black folks, after black people. She do pander and the policies are not good for African-Americans.
It is doing exactly what it`s designed to do. We`re not playing the political piecing game to make you feel --
(CROSSTALK)
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: But is that the right way to get your message across?
(END AUDIO CLIP)
O`DONNELL: Some time after that, apparently, Mark Burns had second thoughts and he tweeted tonight, "I want to apologize for my tweet that many found to be offensive." Meanwhile, voters in Louisiana may get this voicemail from former Ku Klux Klan grand wizard David Duke.
(BEGIN AUDIO CLIP)
DAVID DUKE, FORMER MEMBER OF THE LOUISIANA HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES: Hi, this is David Duke, I`m sorry I missed you. I`m running for your Senate and I`ll tell the truth that no other candidate will dare say. Unless massive immigration is stopped now, we`ll be outnumbered and out-voted in our own nation.
It`s happening, we`re losing our gun rights, our free speech, we`re taxed to death, we`re losing our jobs and businesses to unfair trade. We`re losing our country. Look at the Super Bowl salute to the black panther cop killers.
It`s time to stand up and vote for Donald Trump for president and vote for me, David Duke for the U.S. Senate.
(END AUDIO CLIP)
O`DONNELL: In response to that, the Trump campaign released this statement. Mr. Trump has continued to denounce David Duke and any group of individual associated with the message of hate. There`s no place for this in the Republican Party or our country.
We have no knowledge of these calls or any related activities, but strongly condemn and disavow. Here is Democratic vice presidential candidate Tim Kaine.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
TIM KAINE, NOMINEE OF THE DEMOCRATIC PARTY FOR VICE PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES IN THE 2016 ELECTION: Hillary Clinton gave a speech in Reno, Nevada, calling out Donald Trump on a lot of things, on this equality idea.
Calling him out on the fact that he has supporters like David Duke connected with the Ku Klux Klan who are going around and saying Donald Trump is their candidate because Donald Trump is pushing their values.
Ku Klux Klan values, David Duke values, Donald Trump values are not American values, they`re not our values and we`ve got to do all we can to fight to push back and win.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
O`DONNELL: Joining us now, Robert Traynam, a Republican strategist and an Msnbc political contributor and Mark Thompson, the host of "Make it Plain" on "Sirus Xm" radio.
Mark, do you know Pastor Burns? Were you surprised by that tweet and/or surprised by his apology?
MARK THOMPSON, RADIO HOST: Well, to be clear, I don`t know him. He was -- I met him for the first time, he was on my show Friday, we had a wide- ranging discussion that ended up being somewhat cathartic, and he agreed that Donald Trump should moderate his position in terms of -- his rhetoric in terms of speaking to African-Americans.
O`DONNELL: How long did you talk to him?
THOMPSON: An hour.
O`DONNELL: Yes, see, I think that`s what it takes is a long period of time --
THOMPSON: Yes --
O`DONNELL: Because when you squeeze in these short segments, you might not get the totality of what somebody thinks. But --
THOMPSON: Yes, he tried to get cross with me like Christy did, Chris -- and I talked him --
O`DONNELL: Yes --
THOMPSON: Down.
O`DONNELL: Yes --
THOMPSON: And then I said, basically, you don`t get the black vote speaking this way, and he agreed. And he --
O`DONNELL: Yes --
THOMPSON: Agreed that Trump will moderate his position. So, I am surprised he tweeted that out today. And he used the word attention in talking to Christian.
I think this was the bottom line here, Lawrence. These are people who want attention, want that five minutes of fame and that`s what they do. There is no way that this is going to appeal to African-Americans.
Shaggy-doggy is not going to appeal to African-Americans. You know, I have an aunt who listens, she`s big on grammar -- he`s saying, Hillary Clinton do pander to black people. That`s not how you speak to African-Americans.
And he said that he deleted his tweet, that was fraud because it`s actually a tweet. But I`m surprised because he told me that they were going to sit down with Trump, they were going to try to moderate some of these.
You can see it for yourself, he said absolutely he needs to moderate his position, Trump is not going to do it. And then as you and John alluded to, the left hand doesn`t know what the right hand is doing, you can`t control Donald Trump`s thumb.
So, even though that apology came out, that doesn`t mean anything. Burns even said on Friday to me that David Duke was in no way endorsing Donald Trump, that it never happened.
This is proof that he is and Trump can`t do anything about it.
O`DONNELL: Yes, and Robert Tramp, what do you make of the Trump campaign`s quick denunciation of the David Duke phone call?
ROBERT TRAYNAM, REPUBLICAN STRATEGIST: I commend the Trump campaign for doing that because remember, Lawrence, probably about maybe four or five weeks ago, it probably would not have been quick to do so.
In fact, they probably would have been dog whistle politics where they would have waited a couple of days before they denounced it.
So kudos to Kellyanne Conway, she is a (INAUDIBLE) professional here. But I want to get back to the earlier issue here.
This is not about the Reverend or about Donald Trump reaching out to African-American voters. This is about the Trump campaign trying to moderate its message to Sally, to Suzzy, to Ashley, to Debbie, to Darlene.
This is about the white moderate voter out there that is probably offended at the rhetoric that the Trump campaign is putting out there and secretly wishes that a Republican would win the White House against Hillary Clinton.
And wants to feel good about voting for Republican come November. But this is not about the African-American vote. Although, I will say, I do think the Reverend from South Carolina who is a Trump surrogate.
You can hear the passion in his voice, I disagree with it. But you can hear the passion in his voice. I actually think he thinks that Donald Trump is the right candidate for African-American voters, but I strongly disagree with that.
O`DONNELL: Mark, in terms of the David Duke situation, it seems to me that it`s easy for the Trump campaign though to come out with we denounce, we don`t want that -- but David Duke is not going to change his endorsement.
There`s no question for David Duke who he wants between Hillary Clinton and Donald Trump.
THOMPSON: And David Duke would not have said that if Trump weren`t saying things that David Duke agrees with.
O`DONNELL: Yes --
THOMPSON: You set yourself up for, you know, that kind of support from a David Duke. And I think that`s something we all should be very concerned about.
As I said, just a couple of days ago, Pastor Burns was denying the support of David Duke. It`s clear it`s there, Trump is creating that rhetoric.
Look, and Robert, I hear what you`re saying about the passion, but Robert, don`t you think that if, in fact, this Pastor -- and this was a real relationship and he`s trying to appeal to the black community.
I asked the Pastor, Donald Trump has never even appeared in Burn`s church. That`s the first black church he could have -- he should have gone to.
O`DONNELL: Yes --
THOMPSON: Then I asked -- think about this. I asked Burns, do you know what church Donald Trump attends and who his Pastor is?
Burns didn`t even know that. So here you are, a clergyman supporting someone -- and I guess, doing some type of spiritual advising, you don`t consult with his Pastor, you don`t even invite him to your own church.
O`DONNELL: Robert, a quick last word.
TRAYNAM: I don`t disagree with you. Look, Donald Trump is playing footsie with David Duke and some of the white supremacist out there.
We know that Donald Trump is not an evangelical, we know that Donald Trump is yet to speak out to the black community, not only with clarity but also with some specificity about the future. So, look, this is one big game here. We know it and we`ll see what happens comes November.
O`DONNELL: Robert Traynam and Mark Thompson, thank you both.
THOMPSON: Thank you, man, I appreciate it.
O`DONNELL: Coming up, the Trump campaign finally going to spend some money on TV advertising. That`s coming up in the war room. And also that protest in North Dakota that we first reported to you last week, we`ll be reporting from there tonight.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
O`DONNELL: Time for tonight`s Campaign War Room. The Trump campaign says it`s placing its biggest TV Ad buy yet, a new $10 million buy that will expand the campaigns ad efforts from four battleground states to nine battleground states. NBC has confirmed Trump campaign has purchased at least $2.8 million of TV time as of today.
The Trump campaign also released its second TV ad of the general election to run as part of the new ad buy.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: In Hillary Clinton`s America, the middle class gets crushed. Spending goes up, taxes go up. Hundreds of thousands of jobs disappear. It`s more of the same, but worse. In Donald Trump`s America, working families get tax relief. Millions of new jobs created. Wages go up, small businesses thrive, the American dream achievable, change that makes America great again. Donald Trump, for President.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
O`DONNELL: I`m glad the campaign responder over the statement calling the Trump ad misleading, with 70 days left for the Presidential Campaign War Room joining us tonight in the Last Word War Room is Russell Schriefer, a veteran of Mitt Romney`s 2008 and 2012 Presidential Campaign War Rooms.
Russ, I want us to take a look at Hillary Clinton`s TV Ad on the economy and then let`s grade them both here. Let`s look at Hillary Clinton`s Ad.
RUSSELL SCHRIEFER, AMERICAN POLITICAL STRATEGIST: Sure.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: He wears it like a crown. "Make America Great Again." But Trump made his shirts in Bangladesh, his ties in China, and his suits in Mexico. In fact, the real Donald Trump outsourced his products and jobs to 12 different countries. So don`t believe the hat. You can`t make America great again, if you don`t make things in America.
(END VIDEO CLIP) O`DONNELL: Russ, who`s got the better message on the economy in those TV Ads?
SCHRIEFER: Well, again, they`re very different messages. And I think that they -- and they tried to accomplish two very different strategic goals. Trump`s clearly trying to drive a contrast with him and Hillary Clinton. His is 50 percent negative toward against Hillary, 50 percent positive towards TRUMP. Listen, I think it`s a pretty good ad for Trump and I think it`s the right message.
The economy is the number one issue. And it`s an issue that Donald Trump, a lot of people believed that he can do something about it. He`s a businessman. They think that he can do something about the economy.
The Hillary Clinton Ad is completely negative about Donald Trump. And I think that just goes to a little bit towards what their strategy is, disqualify Donald Trump. Disqualify him as being a good messenger on the economy. Disqualify him as being someone that you can trust to be President of the United States.
O`DONNELL: And Russ, the Trump Campaign says they`re going to spend $10 million on this Ad Buy which in terms of a national campaign is not a big number. And we`ll believe they`ve actually spend the $10 million when they spend it because they`ve made such claims before. But what about this huge gap in the TV Advertising between the Clinton Campaign and the Trump Campaign, and can the Trump Campaign ever close that gap?
SCHRIEFER: No. They`re never going to close the gap. And the gap on television advertising is going to be something that we`re going to begin talking about between now and the end of the campaign. The scariest moments of the Romney campaign four years ago were during the summer because of the way the rules work.
We weren`t able to raise any new dollars, any new general election dollars and we`re limiting to how much money we could spend. And the Obama campaign had over a $100 million in the bank. And they were able to outspend us, you know, three and four to one.
The Trump campaign has been dark the entire summer. They just recently went up on the air. It`s better to be up on the air if you`re running a campaign. I`m hosting (ph) someone be on a campaign that is on the air. It has messages out there.
It is the one thing in the campaign that you can control. I think the Trump campaign believes that they can do something a little bit different by holding these big rallies wherever they are. I think that`s one of the reasons you see them holding them in places like the Washington State and Austin, Texas because they know the media is going to cover them. That`s how they`re going to be driving their message.
O`DONNELL: Russ Schriefer, thank you very much for joining us tonight.
SCHRIEFER: Great. Thanks Lawrence.
O`DONNELL: Coming up, the last 24 hours on national television, Donald Trump has been called a psychopath, a sociopath, and a pathological liar. We`ll be joined by a Professor of Psychology to tell us what he thinks and later the protest at Standing Rock Reservation in North Dakota.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
O`DONNELL: Yesterday in explaining why Donald Trump`s campaign for President is failing miserably in some states where Trump should be competitive, David Plouffe, the campaign manager of President Obama`s first Presidential campaign said this.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
DAVID PLOUFFE, AMERICAN POLITICAL STRATEGIST: I mean, basically, we have a psychopath running for president. I mean, he meets the clinical definition, OK?
CHUCK TODD, AMERICAN TELEVISION JOURNALIST: Wait a minute. Let me --
PLOUFFE: So, Hillary Clinton -- yes.
TODD: Wait a minute. Do you really think diagnosing people on air, and -- I assume you don`t have a degree in psychology. Is that fair? I mean --
PLOUFFE: Well --
TODD: -- we`re jumping -- we`re jumping to conclusions here. I think this is what got -- gets voters a little frustrated with this I think
PLOUFFE: Well, you know listen. He -- the grandiose notion of self worth, pathological line, lack of empathy and remorse. So my point -- so here is and I think he does. Right, I don`t have degree in psychology.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
O`DONNELL: Joining us now someone who does have a degree in Psychology, William Doherty, Psychology Professor a t the University of Minnesota. He is the author of what he calls a public Manifesto called Citizen Therapists against Trumpism. Professor Doherty, thank you very much for joining us tonight. So, how did David Plouffe do in his public diagnosis there?
WILLIAM DOHERTY, PSYCHOLOGY PROFESSOR, UNIVERSITY OF MINNESOTA: Not so good.
O`DONNELL: OK.
DOHERTY: Not so good. This is what I call "weaponizing diagnosis". I don`t think it serves the public interests.
O`DONNELL: And what have you done with your manifesto? Is that a diagnosis of Donald Trump?
DOHERTY: No. No. No. I think a diagnosis really requires knowing somebody`s private/personal life. It`s a medical procedure, if you will.
What I`ve done with the Citizen Therapist against Trumpism is that we`re talking about the public behavior and the public positions of a public official. And there is plenty to talk about there and there are plenty of major problems with his public behavior and his public position.
O`DONNELL: And you`re not talking about what could be things involving neurological function like his speech patterns, his stopping sentences in the middle --
DOHERTY: No.
O`DONNELL: -- and going to off on another sentence. You`re talking about a style of his approach to public policy and presentation. Give us your notion of what Trumpism is?
DOHERTY: Well, it`s kind of hyper masculinity, a strong-man approach to public positioning that says, I will solve your problems for you. I will denigrate my critics. I will assign simple solutions to complex problems and just trust me. Just trust me. I`m a strong man. I am confident. I have no flaws.
O`DONNELL: Now I assume you can sympathize with those of us who`ve been turning to psychology more than politics to explain Donald Trump because we`ve never seen public behavior like this on a political stage.
DOHERTY: Yes. Yes, that`s right.
O`DONNELL: And I want to show you what happened on "Morning Joe" this morning when they went in this direction. Let`s watch this.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
JOE SCARBOROUGH, CO-HOST, MSNBC`S MORNING JOE: No, psychopath -- there are a lot of similar traits except psychopath chains people downstairs and eats them. A sociopath --
HOWARD DEAN, AMERICAN POLITICIAN: This is why nobody should make a diagnosis over the --
SCARBOROUGH: A sociopath though and I think David Plouffe has that one wrong.
MIKA BRZEZINSKI, CO-HOST, MSNBC`S MORNING JOE: Yes. Yes.
SCARBOROUGH: A sociopath does not inflict physical pain and torture people.
DEAN: Actually that`s not true. Sociopaths can as well.
SCARBOROUGH: They will. They could. Yes.
DEAN: They could but they`re less likely to than say psychopath.
BRZEZINSKI: How about just narcissist and make some anxiety and --
DEAN: There`s no anxiety --
BRZEZINSKI: But anyhow, it`s not for a --
SCARBOROUGH: Look at the definition of sociopath.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
O`DONNELL: So, the one physician there, Howard Dean, tried to calm the waters. But I think, I mean, I think you can understand why people are reaching for psychological explanations --
DOHERTY: Yes, yes.
O`DONNELL: -- of what they see as that strange man at the podium.
DOHERTY: Yes. We`re having a big national psychological conversation. I think the danger of Medicalizing this, of personalizing this is that we miss the social phenomenon, the public phenomenon. We miss the fact that there`s 30 percent or more people who lived by him, OK?
This is the larger issue and that we can talk in lay people`s language about bullying, about demonization, about saying whole groups of people are enemies of our country, that Muslims should be banished. These are things that are deeply troubling to me as a therapist.
And we have 2,500 therapists who have signed our manifesto because they are seeing people in their offices who are very stressed by what`s going on. That Donald Trump is presenting as a public character. We should not personalize and medicalize this in my opinion.
O`DONNELL: Professor William Doherty, thank you very much for joining us tonight.
DOHERTY: My pleasure.
O`DONNELL: All right. When we come back we will joined by a leader of the protest at Standing Rock Reservation.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
O`DONNELL: A new national poll released today shows that 24 percent believed that Donald Trump is not releasing his tax returns because of an audit. And 52 percent believe that Donald Trump doesn`t want the public to know. But that`s the reason his doing it. Of course the question they should have also have asked is, do you believe Donald Trump is actually being audited even though he`s offered no proof of that. Up next one of the leaders of the protest of the Standing Rock Reservation will join us.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
O`DONNELL: Last week on this program, we gave the first national television attention to a protest demonstration at the Standing Rock Sioux Reservation in North Dakota. Thousands of Native Americans have been camping on the banks of the Cannonball River there trying to stop or reroute the construction of an oil pipeline approved by the Federal Government. The pipeline will be built underground and go under the Missouri River. And so, the tortured relationship between the Sioux Nation and the Federal Government continues.
The Federal Government signed treaties with the Sioux in 1851 and 1868 that the Federal Government then violated as the Federal Government violated all of its treaties with Native American Tribes. Whenever you wonder why the United States government doesn`t have more trust around the world, one reason is that the world has been watching. The world has been watching for hundreds of years, watching how we have treated the people who were here long before us.
The people who now risk the chance of being arrested for trespassing on land that for centuries they have treated as sacred ground. Joining us now, Dave Archambault II. He`s the Chairman of the standing Rock Sioux Tribe. Chairman Archambault, thank you very much you joining us by Skype from North Dakota. I really appreciate your taking the time.
Tell us how it came to this given that within the Federal Government there was some resistance to this pipeline by the Obama Administration, Environmental Protection Agency and others. But the Army Corps of Engineers in the end have the approval authority of this and they approved it.
DAVE ARCHAMBAULT II, CHAIRMAN, ROCK SIOUX TRIBE: Well it`s -- before I say anything, I just want to thank you for your words in the last week`s piece. If you ever come to Standing Rock, I want to honor you for recognizing the disparities that have gone on for hundreds and hundreds of years.
The reason why this is an issue for us is because and why it came to this, we`ve been talking about the disparities and the wrongs of this particular pipeline for two years, ever since we learned about it. We`ve been asking for meaningful consultation with the Corps of Engineers, with the company saying you need to take a look at where you`re putting this pipeline. And let us have a say, let us take a look, and let us comment whether or not this is a safe place for -- we went and approached the Army Corps of Engineers year after year.
And that fell on deaf ears. They say they want to hear us. They say they want to acknowledge that we are there. But it`s just the check in the box.
I believe this pipeline and the process for pipelines is so simple that`s it`s rubber stamped. As soon as a corporation that wants to do something the Federal Government seems to back them. And it`s always on the back of Native Americans.
O`DONNELL: This pipeline has already been rerouted once. Wasn`t there an original plan that went in a different direction?
ARCHAMBAULT: That`s a -- you`re right. The Governor of North Dakota claims that there`s very, very little chance of the environment at risk. There`s very, very little chance that our waters are at risk.
But yes, when the pipeline was propose today go North of Bismarck, the Capitol of Bismarck, where the Governor`s house is, they reroute it because their concerned of safe drinking water. That doesn`t make sense. We`ve been saying the same thing over and over but it falls on deaf ears.
O`DONNELL: Bernie Sanders, last week, came out in support of you. Have you heard anything from the Presidential candidates about this?
ARCHAMBAULT: This needs to be a topic for both presidents and now we`re telling America what kind of candidates is out there. What kind of leadership is coming into office and that should determine who they will vote for. If our candidates are driven by greed and money then they don`t belong in office because it`s a risk to the environment. It`s a risk to future generations. It`s a risk to children who are not here yet.
O`DONNELL: And the Federal Judge is going to make a decision on how this will proceed next month. If the decision goes against you, what do you expect to do?
ARCHAMBAULT: We`ll explore all of our legal options. We`ll look at -- of course we`ll appeal. And there`s more than just the injunction that we file. We just want to make sure that every nation has an opportunity to be consulted in a meaningful way with the Federal Government or the corporate so that we can be heard.
O`DONNELL: Chairman Archambault, thank you very much for joining us tonight. A real honor to have you here on the program. Really appreciate it.
ARCHAMBAULT: Thank you.
O`DONNELL: We`ll right back.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP) UNIDENTIFIED MALE: On Wednesday night, he`s going to lay out his plan to secure our borders, build a wall, to advance the kind of policies that resolve an internal enforcement in the United States of America. And really ensure that we`re enforcing the laws in the way for American citizens and everyone who is here legally to be able to prosper. But I just think that most important thing is to know that nothing has changed in all these many months.
(END VIDEO CLIP) O`DONNELL: So on Wednesday night, we will find out if Donald Trump is softening or the other thing. Our live coverage continues now with Chris Hayes. Chris.
END