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Transcript: The ReidOut, 9/9/21

Guests: Uche Blackstock, Elie Mystal, Wendy Davis, Kurt Bardella, Glenn Kirschner


President Biden announces new vaccine mandates. Biden to anti-mask fanatics, show some respect. Anti-mask fanatics target school boards. Biden announces vaccine mandate for all federal workers. GOP governors vow to oppose federal vaccine mandates. New vaccine mandates could impact 100 million Americans. Biden says, many Americans frustrated with unvaccinated. Florida judge blocks DeSantis mask mandate ban.


Hi, Joy.

JOY REID, MSNBC HOST: How are you doing, Ari? Thank you very much. You have a great evening.

All right, good evening, everyone. We begin THE REIDOUT tonight with the major development in the fight against COVID. Late today, President Joe Biden outlined the most aggressive attempt yet by the federal government to contain the latest surge. It`s a plan that will affect tens of millions of Americans.


JOE BIDEN, U.S. PRESIDENT: We can, and we will turn the tide on COVID-19. I`m announcing that the Department of Labor is developing an emergency rule to require all employers with 100 or more employees that together employ over 80 million workers to ensure their workforces are fully vaccinated or show a negative test at least once a week. Some of the biggest companies are already requiring this, United Airlines, Disney, Tyson Foods and even Fox News.

May God protect our troops. Get vaccinated.


REID: Even Fox News. President Biden is also requiring vaccinations for all federal workers and for health care workers in settings that receive Medicare or Medicaid funding. He called on large entertainment venues to require proof of vaccination or testing and announced that the TSA will double the fines on travelers who refuse to wear masks and had some strong language to those who disrespect flight attendants.


BIDEN: And by the way, show some respect. The anger you see on television toward flight attendants and others doing their job is wrong. It`s ugly.


REID: The sweeping new mandates could not come at a more critical time. Hospitalizations and infections, including among children, are surging as Americans return to school and work, which may explain why the president specifically called out the elected officials undermining the efforts to protect some of the most vulnerable Americans, unvaccinated kids.


BIDEN: Right now, local school officials are trying to keep children safe in a pandemic while their governor picks a fight with them and even threatens their salaries or their jobs. Talk about bullying in schools. If they`ll not help, if these governors won`t help us beat the pandemic, I`ll use my power as president to get them out of the way.


REID: Multiple Republican governors are, of course, already vowing to challenge the mandates.

Joining me now, Yamiche Alcindor, White House Correspondent for PBS NewsHour and Moderator for Washington Week, Dr. Uche Blackstock, CEO of Advancing Health Equity, Elie Mystal, Justice Correspondent for The Nation.

I`m going to start with you, Yamiche. This is a president who has decided if it`s going to be war, it`s going to be war against the vaccine and any governors who stand in his way. Talk about the thinking behind this much more aggressive posture that we saw from the president today.

YAMICHE ALCINDOR, MSNBC POLITICAL CONTRIBUTOR: President Biden is fed up, and this speech was about telling people, you are now put on notice. The phase of carrots and free beers and all the different things that people were getting to get vaccinated and hundreds of dollars, the president is now saying, if you don`t get vaccinated, not only are you putting the country at risk but you yourself are going to face dire consequences.

The announcements that he made today affect 100 million Americans and two- thirds of American workers. So if you`re someone who thinks this isn`t going to touch your life, President Biden is saying it`s getting personal, I`m coming for you.

The president today was also very clear. He pushed back, as you said, forcefully against Republicans and also took down some of the arguments that we`ve heard from people who don`t want to get vaccinated, including this is my personal choice. He said this is not about freedom, this is not about personal choice, this is about the fact that you need to be taking care of your fellow Americans, the patriotic thing to do, the humane thing to do is to get vaccinated.

I also thought that it was important for the president to say, we`ve been patient with y`all. We`ve been patient with folks. The patience is wearing thin and we are now in a new phase where people need to get it together. And in some ways, I think this really underscores that President Biden wanted to be as aggressive as possible today because you`re starting to see more children in hospitals with COVID-19, you`re starting to see people die over and over again who are saying over and over again, I wish I would have gotten vaccinated. So this is the president, really, I think, going after people and saying whether it`s out of ignorance or out of politics, now is the time to stop playing games with the vaccines to get your life together. REID: Yes, absolutely. And, Dr. Blackstock, let me show you, because the other thing that`s happening is we`re starting to see people get real stupid in schools, pushing past school administrators to try to -- again, this cut 4, let me show cut 4, my producers. This is in Michigan. You know, you literally had a mob outside the school -- sorry, I meant 3, sorry, 3, which is the mob outside of this Tennessee school board meeting, where people were screaming at doctors, threatening them, saying, we know where you live. Let`s play that real quick, it`s 3.



UNIDENTIFIED MALE: We know who you are.





UNIDENTIFIED MALE: We`re on these guys` side. They`re on our side.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: No. No, they`re not. They`re not on our side.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: The police are on our side. The police are on our side. Let`s calm down. Calm down. We know who you are. We know who you are. You can leave freely, but we can find you and we know who you are.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: You`ll never be allowed in public again.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: We know who you are.


REID: That was some unruly people, parents and people who weren`t even parents, yelling, screaming at health care workers like yourself for daring to say kids should wear masks. There was a Michigan school where parents encouraged their students to push past administrators, disrespect them and force their way into a school. They didn`t even get to go to class. This is just an update on the story. We showed this video yesterday.

According to the health department`s public information officer, the students who pushed past in Michigan, they were actually put in a separate area. They weren`t even allowed to go to class. So all their parents did was get them in-school detention.

For you as a health care professional, Dr. Blackstock, what is your reaction to having the president finally say, it`s above you now. We are taking this off of the individual doctors and nurses, this is now a policy, a national policy?

DR. UCHE BLACKSTOCK, FOUNDER AND CEO, ADVANCING HEALTH EQUITY: Right, as it should be, Joy. And it should have been probably a few months ago. We`ve gotten to the point where we have 1,500 people dying a day from COVID, 100,000 people hospitalized.

And so this was the logical next step. As I said, I think that it could have been done earlier, but we have 100 million people who will hopefully be vaccinated. But I want people to keep in mind, it`s going to take a while for those 100 million to get vaccinated. And so while I also appreciated seeing was the invoking of the Defense Production Act to increase testing, especially rapid at-home testing, which we know is very important for keeping schools open.

Something else I would have liked to see is more about masking. We know masking is very simple. But I think because it`s been politicized so much, it may not have been included in that plan. But masking is incredibly important. I would like to see more attention to ventilation in schools and workplaces as well as vaccine mandates for air travel.

REID: Yes, I think you`re absolutely right and the mask situation is actually -- I mean, we do know that -- we know that in Los Angeles, Los Angeles County schools, they have now given people until January to get fully vaccinated, everyone 12 or over in Los Angeles public schools. We know that New York has issued a very strict guideline requiring teachers and students to get vaccinated. So states are acting in one way in blue states, and, Elie, in a very different way in red states.

Here is the list of governors who are freaking out about what they heard the president say. It`s the usual suspects, Brian Kemp in Georgia, Kristi Noem in South Dakota, Kim Reynolds in Iowa. You can go on and on and on, the usual suspects. We haven`t seen DeSantis weigh in yet but he`s probably so busy dealing with the six or seven lawsuits that he`s already lost trying to force COVID on to -- he wants COVID on cruise ships, he wants COVID in the schools, he wants COVID everywhere, apparently wants to spread it everywhere.

The argument that`s being made against what the president is doing is that somehow it is illegal, that he cannot enforce businesses to abide by these mandates and that he is behaving somehow as a dictator. Talk about the legal backing for what the president is doing. Does he have one?

ELIE MYSTAL, JUSTICE CORRESPONDENT, THE NATION: Of course he has one. And welcome to the immense reserves of federal power that we have existed under for this entire 250-year experiment. Of course, the federal government can mandate basic health and safety regulations, the same power that allows TSA to take off my shoes and molest me because I want to go to South Dakota allows the federal government to mandate a vaccine and mandate testing at the employment level.

For the labor situation, the constitutional authority is a little bit attenuated, but Biden is giving them I think a very interesting choice, right? You can have your employees, if you have more than 100 employees, you can have them be vaccinated, you can test them every week or you can pay them to stay home because they`re sick. Go ahead, if you don`t want to comply, pay your employees to stay home. That`s your option too, employers. So, that really covers all of your legal bounds.

There is simply no argument. And I will particularly not stand for and will not hear it from the forced birth aficionados (ph), right? The same people that you just listed over there are now arguing against the mask mandates are the same people who have been running around for a week saying that it`s okay to force a woman to bring pregnancy to term against her will. That is ridiculous. Those people can take all of the seats, all right? Dan Crenshaw needs to sit down before he faints under the weight of his hypocrisy for where we are right now. Of course, vaccine mandates are legal and, of course, forcing women to give birth is not. And if you can`t understand that, I suggest you read this document, which explains it to you.

REID: Yes.


I mean, really quickly, DeSantis hasn`t responded yet, but he`s actually gone to court trying to force cruise ships to let unvaccinated people who might have COVID on their ships. Like he`s lost a bunch of cases because he`s trying to force schools and private businesses to allow potentially infected people onboard. Elie, does it surprise you that he keeps losing when he tries to make that argument in court? Because he`s doing the opposite, he`s like, my government power is going to be used to let COVID in.

MYSTAL: Here`s the simplest way to understand this. The government can require people to be healthy. It cannot require people to get sick. It`s as simple as that. When you are trying to force private businesses to get their customers sick, you can`t do that. When you are trying to -- and remember, when we`re talking about mandates, we`re not talking about the federal government coming into your house and jabbing you with medicine. That would be a violation of your 14th and 4th Amendment rights. We`re talking about the federal government requiring you to take a vaccine in order to participate in the society. That is legal. Making people sick is not. I don`t know any other way to say that.

REID: And it goes back to George Washington, who was the first person to require vaccinations, I believe, for smallpox.

Let me play what Stephanie Ruhle had to say, earlier, Yamiche, that was really smart. She was talking about the fact I think Republicans assume that this is a winning issue for them, that this is going to become an issue of personal freedom that`s going to help them with business woners, et cetera. Stephanie Ruhle is talking to these CEOs and they`re saying the opposite. This is Stephanie earlier today on Nicolle`s show.


STEPHANIE RUHLE, MSNBC SENIOR BUSINESS CORRESPONDENT: Are we going to see some businesses sue the administration and say, hey, we don`t want to do this? Sure. But for the most part, CEOs that I`m speaking to, especially CEOs who run big businesses in the south, this is exactly what they want. They are looking for the federal government to give them air cover so they can require vaccines.


REID: Is that what the administration is hearing, Yamiche, that businesses want this covered? They don`t want to have their lower paid employee at the front desk having to enforce mandates, they`d rather have it come from the top?

ALCINDOR: Based on conversations that I`m having both with White House officials and with some business leaders, the feeling is that businesses want to make sure that their employees are healthy so that they can work. It kind of in some ways goes along the line with what Elie was just saying, which is it`s sort of common sense. Businesses do not want to be paying for unvaccinated people to, one, have health insurance who then get sick and in the hospital who then can`t work and whose medical bills they have to pay.

So there`s a real, I think, logical issue for this apart from, of course, the moral issue of do you want other employees making some employees sick. So, there`s a real feeling inside the administration when I talk to folks that they feel like the backing is on their side, that the people who are the decision-makers in these companies, that they are welcoming this.

The other thing I think it`s important to note is that President Biden talked about these GOP leaders when he talked about the word bullying. I think this was the president saying, you`re trying to bully people into being sick. You`re trying to bully teachers into teaching in unsafe environments. And I will move you out of the way. I think when we think about the companies, we also have to think that President Biden, as much as he tries to be the nice, compassionate, consoler in chief that we talk about, this is also President Biden saying, I will slap you with a stick and move you out of the way, Ron DeSantis, if I have to.

REID: Yes. And last word to you, Dr. Blackstock, because I know as somebody who is still afraid to eat in an indoor restaurant because I am afraid of COVID and as a parent who I`m afraid that my kids will eat at an indoor restaurant, I would feel so much confident or comfortable doing that myself or knowing my kids were doing it if I knew that everyone in that space was vaccinated.

In your view just as a medical professional, is this a confidence-building measure that in the end will make people feel more comfortable utilizing some of these businesses and their services?

BLACKSTOCK: Sure it will, Joy. I have the same concerns even in my personal life. And so what vaccine mandates will do are they will make workplaces, health care settings safer. People will be less likely to get sick. They will be less likely to get hospitalized, less likely to die. As I said, this is a logical next step. And it`s going to hopefully help us get to the end of this pandemic.

In the meantime, we really need to focus on controlling the spread of the virus. But I think that this plan was a step in the right direction.

REID: Yes, absolutely. And I agree with you, we need more on masks.

By the way, I just want to report to you. This was just in my ear, so I didn`t hear every word of it, but apparently our friend, Greg Abbott in Texas, has issued a statement saying that he plans to issue an executive order -- you can`t make this stuff up, I don`t work for Saturday Night Live, protecting Texans` right to choose. The jokes write themselves.

MYSTAL: All the seats, they can take all the seats.


REID: All the seats. Right to choose, I might need another hour. Thank you, Yamiche Alcindor, Dr. Uche Blackstock, Elie Mystal. Lordy, Lordy, Lordy, Lordy.

Up next on THE REDIOUT, fighting back, Attorney General Merrick Garland announces legal action, a right to choose, Texas over its unconstitutional abortion ban.

Plus, new concerns about possible violence as supporters of the Capitol insurrectionists prepare for their next D.C. rally just nine days from now.

Also, Trump`s passionate defense of confederate Robert E. Lee, saying, except for Gettysburg, he would have won the war. Okay. Well, except for Biden`s 81 million votes, you`d still be the president, Donald, but you lost, just like Robert E. Lee.

And tonight`s absolute worst is the big old double cross on Capitol Hill.

THE REIDOUT continues after this.



REID: The Justice Department is officially taking on the state of Texas over its near total ban on abortions.

Today, Attorney General Merrick Garland announced the Justice Department is suing the Lone Star State, arguing its new abortion law violates Supreme Court precedent and is clearly and intentionally unconstitutional.


MERRICK GARLAND, U.S. ATTORNEY GENERAL: In the words of Planned Parenthood vs. Casey, that -- quote -- "Regardless of whether exceptions are made for particular circumstances, a state may not prohibit any woman from making the ultimate decision to terminate her pregnancy before viability."

The obvious and expressly acknowledged intention of this statutory scheme is to prevent women from exercising their constitutional rights by thwarting judicial review for as long as possible.


REID: Garland is seeking an immediate injunction from the federal courts before any further harm can be caused.

Texas Governor Greg Abbott, the man whose genius contribution to this discussion so far was to declare that Texas would simply end rape in the state, well, he threw his 2 cents in, saying: "Unfortunately, President Biden and his administration are more interested in changing the national narrative from their disastrous Afghanistan evacuation and reckless open border policies instead of protecting the innocent unborn. Confident the courts will uphold and protest the right to life."

Joining me now, former Texas state Senator Wendy Davis, who was the Democratic nominee for governor against Greg Abbott back in 2014.

And I -- it still boggles my mind that they voted him in, instead of you, ma`am.

So thank you very much for being here.

I have to read you this tweet.

And I generally don`t like reading tweets from people who tweet things that aren`t super bright, but I`m going to read it to you anyway, because I feel like I would love to hear your response.

This is Greg Abbott`s response to Joe Biden`s vaccine mandates. And so it`s about a different issue. But he wrote: "Biden`s vaccine mandate is an assault on private businesses. I issued an executive order protecting" -- and here`s the ringer -- "Texans` right to choose whether they get the COVID vaccine and added it to the special session agenda," something about a power grab that he`s trying to stop.

Your thoughts.


As you said in your prior segment, Joy, you just can`t make this stuff up. I mean, it`s an absolute absurd argument in the face of the overreach that right-wing Republicans in this state have made against people who are seeking to terminate pregnancy in our state.

That is the absolute bodily control. And it`s not, of course, just about controlling the bodies of women who can`t access abortion anymore. It`s about controlling everything in their future. There was a great report today in The 19th, where they were talking about the fact that women who are prohibited from access to abortion, who otherwise would have one, have deepening poverty at a much greater rate than women who have access to abortion state by state by state.

And when women in our state and across this country are already bearing an undue amount of burden as a result of COVID, and the many women who had to leave the work force as a consequence of that, this is injury upon injury. And, of course, with the unemployment benefit supplement ending, so many women in our state are going to be put in a dire, dire situation and, indeed, already are.

REID: Yes.

And like the voting ban -- I won`t call it a voting ban, but it might as well be -- the voter restrictions that were also jammed through the Republican legislature and signed by the governor, this law would disproportionately hurt women of color.

Let`s put the stats up, white, black and Latino women. Black women would be disproportionately harmed, who are 28 percent of those seeking abortions, and only 13 percent of population. Latina women, Hispanic women are 42 percent of population, about 39 percent.

What do you make of the fact that you still have major corporations that are funding these Republicans? I`m going to put the list up on the screen, from AT&T on, to CVS, even CVS Health, my God, that are still pouring money into these politicians in your state that are trying to rob women of their liberty.

What do you make of that?

DAVIS: Apparently, AT&T actually wrote Greg Abbott a $100,000 check on the very day that he was signing the voter suppression bill into law in our state.

And when you think about it, Joy, women, of course, who are dramatically impacted by this anti-abortion law here are not only in many companies the majority of the employees; they`re also the majority of consumers.

And I hope that we, as women, will exercise our voices and our choices in terms of the businesses that we give our money to, and that we work with, based on whether they are going to align their values with what matters to the vast majority of people in this state.


And let`s make this clear. A very discrete minority of people are the folks that Greg Abbott and other right-wing radical Republicans are speaking to and trying to make happy with laws like this; 70 percent of Texans said they want Roe to be left alone and they want women in Texas and others who can become pregnant to have access to abortion care, as it is guaranteed under Roe v. Wade.

So we are in a situation where we`re being choked by this minority group. And I hope that we can convince our businesses in Texas to be reflective of the majority of people who live here, and not this minority right-wing fringe that Greg Abbott is trying to court so that he can run for president.

REID: I think a lot of people remember you from your epic filibuster in which you tried to save women`s rights and women`s liberties before.

Very quickly, any chance that you will give another shot at running for office? Maybe Greg Abbott could use an opponent again.

DAVIS: I`m very happy to be doing what I`m doing right now, Joy, leading a nonprofit organization that I founded, Deeds Not Words. We`re training the next generation of young women to be able to move into these positions of power and make the changes that our state so desperately needs.

And one of the great things that they`re working on right now is raising a legal defense fund for all of the clinic workers, doctors who are subject to personal and extreme financial liability as a consequence of this anti- abortion law.

And we hope you will take a look at that on our Web site and consider contributing to that very valid cause.

REID: Tweet that out, and we will retweet it from my account and the show account.

Thank you very much, former Texas state Senator Wendy Davis. Thanks for all you do.

And still ahead: Today is the deadline for telecom and social media companies to turn over records requested by the select committee investigating the January 6 Capitol insurrection, this as the defenders of the insurrectionists plan yet another rally in Washington.

What could possibly go wrong?



REID: Today is the deadline for more than 30 social media and telecom companies to respond to the select committee`s request to preserve phone records and other materials related to January 6.

And as we have learned this month, one of the 12 known targets of those requests is the feckless minority leader of the House, the House GOP, that would be, little Kevin McCarthy.

Despite being in touch with Donald Trump during the insurrection, little Kevin made the dubious statement last week that he doesn`t have anything to add to the investigation. And he falsely claimed that Trump had nothing to do with the mob that Trump summoned to Washington to -- quote -- "stop the steal that day."


REP. KEVIN MCCARTHY (R-CA): There`s nothing I have that can add to that day.



QUESTION: Isn`t there another question -- another question that the Democrats want to know is, how deeply was the president involved with what happened that day?

MCCARTHY: Well, you know what is interesting about that? That`s where law enforcement goes. The FBI has investigated this.

The Senate had bipartisan committees and come back. And you know what they have found? That there was no involvement.


REID: Nope. Nope. Of course, neither the FBI nor the Senate reached any such conclusion.

Meanwhile, law enforcement is preparing for the so-called Justice for J6 rally on September 18. That`s a protest in support of the jailed insurrectionists who attempted to overthrow our government. That rally is being organized by a former Trump campaign official.

And while the permit for the event claims that only 700 participants are expected to attend, nobody really knows how many might turn up, nor how deranged they might be.

Here`s how Speaker Nancy Pelosi bluntly described them yesterday.


REP. NANCY PELOSI (D-CA): Now these people are coming back to praise the people who were out to kill.


REID: Law enforcement is now planning to reinstall the protective fencing around the Capitol.

And "Roll Call" reports that, according to police intelligence, there`s been an uptick in violent talk about the rally online. Extremists have discussed committing violent acts against local Jewish centers and liberal churches while law enforcement is distracted.

And one user said -- quote -- "I will be there with my AR-15, even though, legally, I can`t have one."

Notably, many Republicans who`ve been outspoken in their defense of the insurrectionists are not planning to attend, including sedition cheerleaders, Margie Q. Greene and Madison Cawthorn.

According to "Roll Call," Louie Gohmert and Lauren Boebert will also be sitting this one out.

With me now, Glenn Kirschner, former federal prosecutor, and Kurt Bardella, adviser for the DCCC.

And, Glenn, I have to wonder if maybe the decisions they`re making might be the first sign of intelligent life that we have seen in the GOP Caucus.

Here`s Jim Jordan last week fudging on whether he`d be there.


LAUREN WINDSOR, REPORTER: Are you going to be there on September 18?

REP. JIM JORDAN (R-OH): On September 18? Is there a rally coming?

WINDSOR: There`s going to be another rally.


JORDAN: Oh, really?

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: It`s going to be a big rally in D.C. for all the people that they`re holding right now.


UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Not people that attacked officers -- but, like, yes.

JORDAN: I get in on the 19th or 20th.


REID: And, likewise, Madison Cawthorn, Glenn, was last week threatening to bust those guys out, thinking -- or ruminating about how they could bust them out of prison.

Do you think this might be a sign that they`re worried about their legal situation?

GLENN KIRSCHNER, FORMER FEDERAL PROSECUTOR: Yes, Joy, I think this protest, this rally, whatever they want to call it, will probably fizzle.

But if it doesn`t, what I am confident of is, Joe Biden`s administration will make sure that the Capitol is protected. There will be enough federal law enforcement forces deployed to protect whatever the threat is to the Capitol as a result of this new little protest that they`re trying to gin up.

Of course, it may fizzle in part because Donald Trump has lost all of his platforms, so he can`t gin up the kind of hateful support that he`s used to ginning up.

But I will tell you, when you look at what happened on January 6, it sure looked like the executive branch, Donald Trump`s executive branch, deprive the Capitol of the forces it needed to repel the attack, the attack that was orchestrated and launch by Donald Trump himself.


That stood in stark comparison to the BLM protests, which I attended. And there was every law enforcement agency known to man and some unknown to man, because they weren`t even wearing proper insignia. For goodness` sakes, the Bureau of Prisons riot squad was there. And I have never seen that unit deployed outside of Bureau of Prisons riots?

So, listen, let them bring their 700 people, or however many show up. Joe Biden`s administration will be well-prepared.

REID: Yes.

And I think it`s a very good point, Kurt, that we all -- we understand that, but for there having been January 6, these 700 or whatever odd number of oddballs would have showed up, and there would probably be very little and light police presence, because let`s just be blunt, this is not a group of black people showing up, right?

But, that aside, do you think that, without Donald Trump tweeting the it`s going to be wild tweets that he did last December and ginning up a -- basically, a rally for himself and saying, come to do this to defend me, that they will lack these groups, that they lack sort of the impetus to put it together and to make it -- and to pull it off?

KURT BARDELLA, DEMOCRATIC CONGRESSIONAL CAMPAIGN COMMITTEE ADVISER: Yes, I mean, I think that`s the optimistic view here, that without the megaphone of social media at its disposal to incite and motivate people to attend, that this will essentially be a nonevent.

This will just be your typical gathering of white nationalists protesting the incarceration of domestic terrorists in America, because that`s where we`re at right now in this country.

But I think this is also going to be an interesting and instructive case study about what happens when you don`t allow open air hate speech to litter the entire social media apparatus, when you don`t allow those platforms to be used as a rallying cry, as a uniting cry by these hate groups and by hateful people like Donald Trump.

The reason why this may fizzle out is because Trump`s not on Twitter anymore, because all these actors aren`t using them as propaganda vehicles to try to get all these people to show up and commit an act of domestic terrorism.

So, hopefully, what we see coming up is nowhere near what we saw on January 6. And that just tells me that removing people from these platforms works. And we need to keep doing it, and doing it more aggressively.

REID: Yes. Are you telling me that Gettr and Parler are not hot? Is that what you`re trying to basically tell me?

Anyway, very quickly, to stay with you for a minute -- sorry -- what does it tell you that these now are now trying to operate in Brazil? I mean, it seems like they`re trying to take their show on the road, Kurt.

BARDELLA: I mean, it just seems to me that people like Steve Bannon and Jason Miller, that -- and this has really been their modus operandi for the better part of five years.

If there`s money to be made somewhere, if there`s an opportunity to extend the grift, they`re going to go there and do it. We have seen Bannon pal around with very controversial billionaire Chinese figures. We have seen now Jason Miller in Brazil. We`re seeing them try to take the show on the road...

REID: Yes.

BARDELLA: ... and do what they have done in America, which is dupe and sucker people into giving their money to these people...

REID: To them, yes.

BARDELLA: ... who then use it to enrich themselves.

REID: Glenn, I have to give you the last word here, because we have seen a couple of these Proud Boys and such who are now facing -- they`re facing the music.

And what do you make of these requests? You have Gabriel Garcia, who`s a defendant. He`s arguing that the -- his ankle monitor is unsafe because his potential clients can hear the beeping, so it`s messing with his business.

You have Dominic Pezzola. He`s arguing for his relief because he says the hygiene is not good, or the showers aren`t good, and everything`s nicer in gen pop. I guess he wants to go to the general population.

What do you make of these -- these whinings?

KIRSCHNER: So, these requests are entirely ordinary.

Any time somebody is on a release, and a judge imposes conditions of release to make sure, one, the community is protected and, two, the defendant doesn`t flee, we get these requests to modify the conditions of release.

And it`s a shame that the ankle monitor may be chafing the ankle of a domestic terrorist. I don`t feel all that bad for him. But here`s what I predict the judges will do.

They will say, the reason you`re behaving is because you`re wearing an ankle monitor. So, the last thing the court is going to be inclined to do is modify the conditions, in the wake of these complaints, and take the ankle monitor off these characters. Not going to happen.

REID: Yes, that`s -- it seems right to me.

Glenn Kirschner, Kurt Bardella, thank you guys both very much.

Up next: The loser of the last presidential election has a special place in his heart for the loser of the Civil War. And his latest rant on the subject contains three special words that have the rest of us scratching our heads in wonder and amazement. You will hear those three words next.

Stay with us.



REID: It is impossible to overlook the parallels between the January 6 attack on the Capitol and the Republicans whitewashing it, whitewashing of it, and the first effort to mythologize sedition, the lost cause of the Confederacy, the false narrative that the Civil War was a noble cause fought by men of honor, as opposed to a battle led by treasonists with the goal of continuing to enslave black Americans.

Unsurprisingly, the orange demigod of the current lost cause is on the side of the hero of the first, Robert E. Lee the Confederate general whose statue was removed from its perch in Richmond yesterday.

Now, it must be stated the hagiography of Robert E. Lee is a proverbial stew of whitewashing and willful ignorance. As Adam Serwer pointed out, the myth of the heroic General Lee is a fiction of a person who never existed. He was a slaveholder who led a war in defense of human bondage.

He wasn`t even an American general. He resigned from the U.S. Army as a colonel and only got his elevated rank from the traitors who seceded and then invaded the United States.


It`s no wonder the former president digs him, having been a fraud himself with that whole successful businessman shtick.

In a statement, our current biggest loser called Lee the greatest strategist of them all, adding that: "Except for Gettysburg, he would have won the war."

Yes, and except for D-Day, the Axis would have won World War II. Oh, and except for Biden`s margin of seven million votes last November, Trump would still be in government housing, pounding ivermectin tablets and Diet Coke, probably. And, sure, except for a crushing -- a crushing defeat, where Lee lost a third of his army to a real general, Ulysses S. Grant, forcing him to retreat and turning the tide and the war.

What`s up with that? Human bondage would have continued for God knows how much longer in America, just as old Robert E. Lee intended

Joining me now, Steve Schmidt, former Republican strategist.

And, Steve, welcome back. I haven`t seen you in too long.

And I got to read to you this really genius tweet by Congressman Conor Lamb of Pennsylvania.

He wrote the following, said: "I guess Trump and Robert E. Lee both know how it feels to suffer a humiliating defeat at the hands of pro-democracy forces in Pennsylvania."

Your witness.



Look, well, Robert E. Lee at Gettysburg on the third day launches an attack uphill over a mile, nine Confederate brigades who are wiped out. The truth about Robert E. Lee is, he never won a major battle against the North after Stonewall Jackson was killed.

He was an impatient gambler. Sometimes, those gambles paid off. They did it Chancellorsville, where he divided his force, in contravention of all military history and rules, and encircled the Union Army and crushed it. And again gambling at Gettysburg, he lost.

The point about Gettysburg that we should remember, though, Joy, is the second day, where, literally, within a couple of minutes, the Union was saved. And the Union was saved when General Hancock rode down the line at a full gallop.

A New York ne`er-do-well politician named Dan Sickles, a congressman who had shot his wife`s lover on broad daylight, Lower Manhattan, in command of Union forces, had allowed the Confederates to possibly get around the end of the line and be in position to end the Battle of Gettysburg by being on the high ground between Washington, D.C., and the Union Army.

To this day, the men that responded to Hancock`s order, the 1st Minnesota, when he said, fix bayonets and charge, 250 men against thousands of Confederates, to this day, it`s the highest casualty action in the history of the United States military; 84 percent of those men were wounded or killed.

But, in that charge, most of those men immigrants, they saved the United States of America.

Robert E. Lee`s due has come -- the bill has come due by history.

REID: Yes.

SCHMIDT: He is what he was. He was a traitor. He raised his sword against the flag of the United States of America for an immoral cause, the building and maintenance of a slave state on North American shores.

And it`s fitting that that statue has come down.

REID: Yes, it offends me, to be honest, because our family and close -- a few people closely in the military, for him to even called general. He was not a general in the American, in the U.S. Army.

He was made a general by the traitors. So, even using the term general, to me, it sticks in my craw.

I got to ask you about someone else who like, I would say, Ulysses S. Grant, who should have more statues, it was decisive today -- President Biden. There is a lot of caterwauling going on among Republican governors.

We will put up the list, 17 so far and counting, starting with Greg Abbott, who had a weird comment about choice, and ending with Tennessee`s Bill Lee. We will just put that up.

They`re quite upset with this mandate. But I got to tell you, Steve. I don`t know if you agree with me on this. I feel like the majority of Americans are vaccinated already, right? We`re talking about six, seven in 10. In some states, it`s 70 percent.

And most of the people I know who are vaccinated are irritated and really impatient at this point with those who are refusing for whatever reason to do this easy thing to save us from this nightmare pandemic.

Do you agree with the sort of Dave Wassermans of the world that Biden now being real decisive and coming down strong on the side of the vaccinated is actually good politics and -- for him and bad politics for Republicans?

SCHMIDT: You use the word irritated, which is evidence of your magnanimity.

I think the majority in this country is enraged over this, about being held hostage by an extremist, intransigent, junk science-believing minority that is endangering America`s children.


We`re in the opening months of what will be the children`s phase of this pandemic, and we will see death of America`s children. And I think there is a lot to be said about how a society treats its children, its most vulnerable citizens.

And these GOP governors are showing they`re anything but pro-life when it comes to children with their cavalier disregard for the lives of America`s children and the immunocompromised and our most vulnerable populations.

And so here`s the deal as we move into the second year or third year. Someone`s going to lose out. Someone`s going to have to stay home. And let it be the people that would rather take horse dewormer than a safe, viable, effective vaccine that is saving lives.

Someone`s world is going to get smaller. I don`t want it to be mine. And I don`t want it to be my kids. So you have a lot of rights in America. I am completely opposed to the government mandating that you must, in the private sector, as a private citizen, take a vaccine.

But you don`t have a right to fly on American Airlines or Delta Air Lines. Congress should pass laws that make it easier to file class-action lawsuits against companies that won`t make the right decisions to protect their consumers, that pack them in into canisters at 35,000 feet in the air, for example, the incentives that government can bring, and including the imposition of appropriate mandates using the full lawful authority of the United States government.

And I think it`s important to understand that imposing mandates around vaccines and quarantines around diseases is as American as apple pie, and has gone on since the beginning of the country.

REID: Yes.

SCHMIDT: We live in an age of misinformation and an age of insanity. And enough is enough is enough.

REID: That`s right.

SCHMIDT: Reality is reality.

And it`s time to end the B.S. And so I think that he should approach this with an iron fist. And I think that the overwhelming majority of the country is going to be deeply appreciative of somebody standing up at long last and saying to the small minority of nuts in this country, enough.

REID: Yes, I think -- I 100 percent agree. I think that`s how most people are going to feel.

Steve Schmidt, thank you very much.

And don`t go anywhere. Tonight`s "Absolute Worst" is straight ahead, as a conservative Democratic senator puts the squeeze on the rest of his party.

Stay right there.



REID: It`s a fact of life that even kindergartners understand. A deal is supposed to be a deal.

When centrist Democrats and the White House insisted on a compromise with Republicans on infrastructure, they and progressives came to an understanding. Democrats would vote for the pared-down bipartisan infrastructure deal, as long as they could advance a separate $3.5 trillion human infrastructure bill that can be passed without the need for any Republicans.

Republicans got to go home and crow about getting their voters roads and bridges. And what did progressives get? A lot of hemming and hawing, it turns out, from members of their own party over the price tag of the bill.

There`s South Carolina Representative Jim Clyburn, who said maybe we don`t need to spend quite that much money, or Florida Representative Stephanie Murphy, who says she`s a no-vote on committee -- in committee until she gets details on where the money would come from.

And it shouldn`t be a surprise to anybody that both Kyrsten Sinema and Joe Manchin, the Bonnie and Clyde of Chamber of Commerce Democrats, have balked at the price of the bill, without saying exactly what they will or won`t support.

While exact details haven`t been released, Democrats have said that they do plan to pay for the bill by raising taxes on the wealthy and on corporations.

California Congresswoman Katie Porter had a brilliant response to Manchin`s concerns about the price tag today.


REP. KATIE PORTER (D-CA): We`re going to generate the revenue to pay for these things. I have the will to do it. The question is, does Senator Manchin, or is he more concerned about his corporate donors, including large corporations, the oil and gas industry, the big pharmaceutical industry and others, who are getting away with paying nothing under our current tax system?


REID: Hmm.

Well, as the Internet reported this week, Manchin has intensive ties to coal companies with grim records of pollution, safety violations and death, not to mention his family`s ties to Wall Street and big pharma. His daughter is currently under fire for working with Pfizer to keep EpiPen prices high.

But here`s the thing about this reconciliation bill. If Democrats want to be on the record for making necessary systemic change in this country, this bill, where, again, Republicans have zero say, might be their only chance to do it.

It`s never been more clear that government spending helps Americans, with coronavirus spending causing a record drop in poverty, particularly thanks to child tax credits, which the reconciliation bill would expand.

It could be a once-in-a-lifetime opportunity to address the country`s affordable housing crisis, as an expert told NBC News. Its paid family leave proposal could help 37 percent of unemployed Americans return to work sooner, not to mention the benefits expanded child care and universal pre-K would bring to parents.

And its clean electricity programs would be a significant step towards ensuring that we actually continue to have a planet to live on.

So, moderate Democrats, for double-crossing progressives and caring more about numbers than about your constituents, which really ain`t cool, because a deal is supposed to be a deal, you are tonight`s "Absolute Worst."

And that is tonight`s REIDOUT.

"ALL IN WITH CHRIS HAYES" starts right now.



JOE BIDEN, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: My message to unvaccinated Americans is this. What more is there to wait for?


HAYES: The president speaks up .