Summary
GOP pushes back on January 6th commission. GOP Leader McCarthy opposes January 6th commission. GOP representative says Capitol insurrection looked like a normal tourist visit. GOP Representative Greene says, insurrectionists are being abused by being arrested. Democrat Representative Demings will challenge Rubio for Senate seat. North Carolina authorities release body cam footage of fatal shooting of Andrew Brown. District attorney says, Brown`s death was justified. Just a few hours ago, the House passed a Senate bill to address the rise in anti-Asian hate crimes during the pandemic. Congresswoman Grace Meng of New York, who introduced the anti-Asian hate crimes bill alongside Senator Mazie Hirono, is interviewed.
Transcript
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
JOY REID, MSNBC HOST: Good evening, everyone.
We begin THE REIDOUT tonight with a thrown back to the not so distant past. Remember Benghazi? Over the span of four years, we witnessed ten different investigations into that tragic attack on a diplomatic compound in which four Americans died, with investigations in the House, and the Senate, as well as the State Department and the FBI. We heard more than 16 hours of public testimony from former Secretary of State Hillary Clinton, who faced demeaning and outright hostile questioning from overzealous Republican lawmakers.
Benghazi was literally all they talked about. Some even dreamed that it could be the first step toward impeaching President Obama, and after that preventing Secretary Clinton from becoming president. And if that didn`t worked out, impeaching her after the 2016 election.
But after all the, frankly, delusional, obsessive focus and Benghazi becoming practically a swear word for Republicans, many whom probably couldn`t find Benghazi on the map, pop-quiz, what country is it in, there was no evidence of any scandal, no bombshell, no revelations, no supposed stand-down orders Republicans had promised. It was all just horse pucky.
That`s for to today and the same guy who was central to shaking the Benghazi shiny keys as a political ruse is the current leader, quote/unquote, of House Republicans, Kevin McCarthy. Only now, he`s suddenly not so into investigations. Today Kevin came out against legislation to form a bipartisan commission to investigate the MAGA seige of our Capitol on January 6th, Just 24 hours before the vote tomorrow.
Despite his support many reboots of the Benghazi probe, McCarthy had the nerve to say that the January 6th commission would be redundant. Quote, giving the now duplicative and potentially counterproductive nature of this effort, I cannot support this legislation, he said.
But his incoherence doesn`t end there. Instead of focusing solely on the siege itself, Kevin wants the 6th commission to investigate other things, like the Black Lives Matter protests, which has absolutely nothing to do with the insurrection that nearly decapitated our government. It will be like asking the 9/11 commission to investigate the Rodney King beating in protests. The two are completely unrelated.
But Kevin`s special brand of cowards is especially galling because the deal for this commission was brokered by a member of his own conference, Congressman John Katko of New York, who was deputized by Kevin McCarthy to negotiate on behalf of Republicans. In other words, McCarthy has double- crossed Katko, just like he double crossed Liz Cheney last week. According to Punchbowl News, that was not lost on Katko who told his supposedly leader with sarcasm today, thanks for not throwing me under the bus, Kevin. It`s more evidence of the leadership crisis inside the GOP following Liz Cheney`s ouster.
But there`s other reason that Kevin is running scared. He`s a key witness in any investigation into January 6th. He not only spoke to former president while the attack was taking place, he reportedly engaged in a screaming match with Trump who was apparently rooting for the insurrectionist, who were chanting, hang Mike Pence. As Liz Cheney said last week, if Kevin won`t cooperate, he should be subpoenaed.
Joining me now is Errin Haines, Editor-at-Large for The 19th, Jason Johnson, Professor of Journalism and Politics at Morgan State University, and David Jolly, former Republican Congressman from Florida who is no longer affiliated with the party.
But you are former Congressman David, so I`m going to start with you. The thing that so crazy is, you know, what Republicans want to prevent is a commission not about some distant thing that happened in Libya, answered my own pop-quiz, but something that happened to them.
I want to go to -- this is four -- I`m going to skip down, sorry for my producers here. This is Andrew Clyde. This is him comparing the insurrectionists last week to tourists. Take a listen to Andrew Clyde. Okay, there he is on January 6th. Here is what he said about the insurrectionists last week.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
REP. ANDREW CLYDE (R-GA): If you didn`t know the teeny footage was a video from January the 6th, you would actually think it was normal tourist visit.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
REID: So let`s put that picture back up while you talk to us, David. Congress members are trying to suppress something they endured. What the hell is going on?
DAVID JOLLY, MSNBC POLITICAL CONTRIBUTOR: Yes. Here is what I would suggest that comment by Congressman Clyde reflects, is that there`s a bell curve in Congress, just like any institution, and that bell curve includes integrity, honesty and intelligence, and Congressman Clyde is on the wrong side of that bell curve and he displayed that to the world with those statements.
I think if you look at this commission that they`re talking about establishing and now Kevin does not want it to go forward, it`s because we know the focus will be on the culpability of Republican behavior, not just Donald Trump`s behavior but Republican behavior going into the events of January 6th.
And, Joy, I would say the luscious irony in all of this is just as Kevin`s handling of the Benghazi commission, some would argue derailed his ascension to the speakership. When he went on Fox News and said, look, this was all about taking down Hillary Clinton. It wasn`t about Benghazi. Just as that derailed his ascension speakership, when Boehner was retiring, a January 6th Commission could derail Kevin shot at the speakership as well, because it would focus in on what Kevin McCarthy knows about those events.
When Liz Cheney says that Kevin McCarthy should testify, it`s not just because Liz Cheney wants to get to the truth. Liz Cheney has said that McCarthy won`t be speaker, which tells me that Liz Cheney knows that Kevin McCarthy knows something that is so damning, it could undo his ascension to the speakership should Kevin McCarthy go under oath before a January 6th commission.
REID: And, Jason, all he has know is other members of Congress, because a lot of them participated as well. Here is Senator Chuck Grassley, trying to -- you know, they want to obfuscate because they realize how damning this could be for members of the Republican caucus. But here is Chuck Grassley trying to muddy the waters. Take a listen.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
SEN. CHUCK GRASSLEY (R-IA (voice over)): I think that they`re going to have to broaden the inquiries that they`re making in order to get 60 votes.
REPORTER: Okay, got it. Would you support it right now or would you need to see it broadened?
GRASSLEY: I think I`d prefer broadened because there`s more things wrong in this country than what just happened on January the 6th.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
REID: Yes, more things that happened. Here is Marjorie Taylor Greene agreeing with Chuck Grassley.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
REP. MARJORIE TAYLOR GREENE (R-GA): Indeed we should have a commission to study the violent BLM and Antifa mobs that had plague the American cities this past summer. Also, while it`s catch and release for domestic terrorists Antifa, BLM, the people who breached the Capitol on January 6th are being abused.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
REID: So they`re going to have to do that during an entire hearing right, Jason?
JASON JOHNSON, MSNBC POLITICAL CONTRIBUTOR: Well, yes. And this is what makes this so insane. I don`t know why the Democrats are even bothering to try and make a bipartisan commission at this point. The Republicans know that many of them are potentially complicit either in not standing up when this was happening or obfuscating people who might been involved.
I keep going back to the Mikie Sherrill, who was a congresswoman, who said at the beginning, I`m fairly confident that I saw people giving tours to folks who showed up later at insurrectionists and the Republican Party doesn`t want a real investigation. This is the Empire saying like, all right, you got the Death Star, we don`t have to do the whole investigation into Darth Vader. Why do we have to talk about that? Like but you can`t go forward. The country can`t go forward unless we have an investigation.
Because I promise you whoever was responsible for this and the people in Congress who were responsible for this, will try again at some point. I think the Democrats just need to go it alone and forget about getting Republicans involved.
REID: Well, they`re not going to have to. I mean, the vote is going to pass tomorrow, Errin. It`s going to happen. This commission is going to pass and then it`s going to occur and then the people who are going to be spotlighted are going to be a bunch of Republicans who were giving the high fists to the insurrectionists.
ERRIN HAINES, THE 19TH EDITOR-AT-LARGE: Yes. That`s exactly right, Joy. And, look, you could mistake that footage for a lot of things, maybe civil war reenactment, maybe Call of Duty footage, but what it was not was just another group of tourists at the Capitol on January 6th.
And so, you know, I think that that was what a lot of American`s saw. And to Jason`s point this commission really is for the majority of Americans who saw that as the violent, racist insurrection that it was attempting to delegitimize black voters and, you know, and want accountability on this just as those insurrectionists, many of whom are facing federal charges and could be going to federal prison for being peaceful tourists that day, you know, according to Congressman Clyde.
You know, Republicans in Congress also need to face accountability. And if indeed it was a peaceful day at the Capitol, you know, let that come out in the commission`s findings, you know, why not have them study this.
And to your point about folks on the Republican side who continue to try to create this false equivalency to the overwhelmingly peaceful Black Lives Matter protests that happened last summer, and that was documented as overwhelmingly peaceful, right, that is the other big lie that some folks just, you know, are continued to be dug in on and that they are attempting to perpetuate and connect to this 6th commission.
REID: For you, first, Errin, and then David Jolly. I wonder if Val Demings might end up on this commission or should she. I mean, she already participated in the impeachment of Donald Trump. She appears now to be running for United States Senate. You interviewed her about that. Is the other fear that someone like Val Demings might end up on that commission get to do some questioning of some people like Kevin?
HAINES: Well, I`m not sure that, that`s going to happen, Joy, but I did ask Congresswoman Demings about this, you know, being that she was the former impeachment manager, she is a member of law enforcement, who is very supportive of those Capitol Police who were having to defend her and her colleagues on January 6th.
And what she said was she wanted to see a 9/11 style commission that had members who were not in Congress, right? So, folks who were not directly involved taking kind of unbiased objective approach to studying the events of that day and coming up with a conclusion that really is unimpeachable.
And so while she was certainly in favor of that commission, she was saying that she is not somebody that would want to be on it but wants to see folks who are impartial, really weighing in on the events of the day.
REID: But whether or not she`s on it, David Jolly, how damaging is it going to be for Republicans, for the nation, to relive through this commission the events of January 6th?
JOLLY: Oh, it`s going to be incredibly damaging because, as much as they want to draw some type of parity to Black Lives Matter or to other protests that simply cannot hold in this event. And it is lunacy for Republicans to suggest it. And we should call them out every step of the way.
I accept that there is no parity in the level of violence. We can see that with our own eyes. But even if you suggest that social protests on other issues across the county has involved violence, has involved injury, what happened on January 6th was an attempt to undermine our democracy, to rip away our election, to undo our republic.
That is not similar to the other protests we have seen, to the other violence has seen. That is not similar, as Kevin McCarthy suggested, to the violence on the baseball field where the shooting occurred of Republican members of Congress.
Yes, violence is wrong in all aspect and should be condemned but the effort going into January 6th, the big lie that Donald Trump led, that Kevin McCarthy amplified and every other Republican that involved themselves in this was an attempt to undo our democracy and undermined our republic.
If Democrats and a commission, bipartisan or not, are able to focus in on that, it is hard for Republicans to suggest why they should return to power in November `22.
REID: Yes. And, Jason Johnson, that brings us to 2022 in which this now becomes the story in that election. Your thoughts.
JOHNSON: It should be. Every single Democrat needs to nationalize this election as soon as possible. And, look, the whole idea of comparing, you know, what on January 6th to last summer, it doesn`t make any sense where we now. You saw more arrest at peaceful protests in Louisville after Breonna Taylor was killed than you saw during the insurrection. It`s taking like months before the insurrection got to 400 different arrests. Not to mention of fact, that there`s a huge difference between your youth pastor with a Black Lives Matter sign in the middle of a Target parking lot and a bunch of people with guns weapons beating and abusing police officers to go take over the United States of America.
The Democrats` 2022 is theirs to lose. All they have to do is keep the economy functioning, which they may or may not be able to control, make this national election and pass voting rights reform. Because the vast majority of Americans are not in favor of the insurrectionist party, they`re not in favor of the handmaid`s still party, they`re not in favor of this insane party and the Democrats should make that their main issue.
REID: Shots, checks and democracy, keep it simple. That is the issue in 2022. Errin Haines, Jason Johnson, David Jolly, thank you all very much.
Up next, on THE REIDOUT, like a scene out of the battle of Baghdad, North Carolina deputies armed to teeth, shot and killed Andrew Brown Jr. in a drugs arrest. Now, the D.A. is calling the horrific display that we all saw justified.
Plus, the sham and the shame, Maricopa County officials many of them Republicans say it`s time for their party to call off the phony recount. One of those Republican officials joins me tonight.
And tonight`s absolute worst spends his days on Russian state T.V. whining that the Americans government is mean to his daddy. And now, little man thinks that can be governor of New York. You don`t want to miss that.
THE REIDOUT continues after this.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
REID: Today, we saw a video of what it looks like when the war on drugs looks like actual war. Authorities in North Carolina finally gave us glimpse of the body camera footage in the shooting death of Andrew Brown Jr. by Pasquotank County sheriff`s deputies nearly a month ago. The video was shown by District Attorney Andrew Womble after he announced that he won`t be filing any charges against the deputies involved. We should warn you this footage is disturbing.
Police claim the deputies were attempting to serve search warrants and arrest warrants related to drug charges, armed like a military unit invading 2003 Baghdad, no less. The D.A. said that the deputies actions were justified under the circumstances.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
ANDREW WOMBLE, DISTRICT ATTORNEY, PASQOUTANK COUNTY, NORTH CAROLINA: Mr. Brown`s death, while tragic, was justified because Mr. Brown`s actions caused three deputies with the Pasquotank County Sheriff`s Office to reasonably believe it was necessary to use deadly force to protect themselves and others.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
REID: The family of Andrew Brown Jr. were able to view some additional footage last week just under 20 minutes of the nearly two hours of body cam video. They have called his death an execution.
In a statement, attorneys representing Brown`s family called the D.A.`s decision an insults and a slap in the face to Andrew`s family, the Elizabeth City community and to rational people everywhere. The attorneys noted, as you saw on the video, that Brown was driving away from the deputies. Four deputies didn`t fire and fatal shot was to the back of Andrew Brown Jr.`s head.
The district attorney, who was urged by the governor to turn over the case to a special prosecutor, argued that the deputies used force reasonably, first because they were there to serve warrants.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
ANDREW WOMBLE, PASQUOTANK COUNTY, NORTH CAROLINA, DISTRICT ATTORNEY: The law enforcement officers were duty bound to stand their ground, carry through on the performance of their duties, and take Andrew Brown into custody.
They could not simply let him go, as has been suggested.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
REID: He also argued that Brown`s decision to, as he termed it, flee escalated the situation from a show of force to employment of force.
So, sheriff`s deputies descended on a residential neighborhood armed to the teeth to serve a drug warrant to an unarmed black man in his car. And within 44 seconds, Andrew Brown was dead, and, according to the district attorney, it was justified. In other words, the war on drugs, it`s wanted, dead or alive.
Joining me now is Ben Crump, attorney for the Brown family, and Jay Fortenberry, assistant professor at Elizabeth State -- Elizabeth City State University and a former police chief in Edenton, North Carolina.
And I want to go to you first, Mr. Fortenberry.
Is that how it`s supposed to work in serving a drugs warrant on an unarmed man in a residential neighborhood? That looked like the assault of Baghdad in 2003, to be honest with you. It looked like they went in to arrest a terrorist cell. Is that how it`s done in North Carolina?
JAY FORTENBERRY, FORMER EDENTON, NORTH CAROLINA, POLICE CHIEF: Hey, Joy. Thank you for having me on here.
And it is a disturbing video to watch. And one of the issues that we talk about a lot in North Carolina and across the country, matter of fact, is militarization of police, when is that necessary?
And it is sad. This case was based on a law mala prohibita. This was not a mala in se-type law. This was not murder, robbery, rape. This was drug -- like you said, a drug offense. And it`s a double-edged sword. Sometimes, police officers, they go in with the use of force, hoping that it will deter any use of force. And, sometimes, it doesn`t.
But when do you use these teams? That`s an issue that needs to be examined across America.
REID: Ben, the family, the attorneys, and I`m assuming, presuming, including yourself, had asked attorney Womble to recuse himself, sending a letter saying that he needed to, that the conflict is well-defined with the sheriff`s office.
What does that mean, well-defined with the sheriff`s office, and why did you want him recused?
BENJAMIN CRUMP, ATTORNEY FOR FAMILY OF ANDREW BROWN JR.: Well, because, obviously, this is a local district attorney who works on a systematic and regular basis with the local sheriff`s department.
In fact, they`re housed in the same building together. And we thought, to remove any hint of impropriety, Joy, that he should recuse himself, so there wouldn`t be exactly what we saw today, this press conference, where he whitewashed the investigation to justify this unjustifiable killing of yet another black man who`s going away from the police, not posing a threat.
But yet they shoot him in the back of his brain. And it will not be swept under the rug. We are demanding that they release all the bodycam video in the North Carolina State Bureau of Investigations report, because, if it`s justified, then what do they have to hide?
And we want the Department of Justice, Merrick Garland, to intervene immediately, because we will not let this be swept under the rug.
REID: And, Jay Fortenberry, not -- a lot of us have done -- looked at a lot of these police cases. We don`t have a lot of faith, honestly, in this connection between prosecutors and police.
When they`re involved, they are -- as you just heard Ben Crump say, they are on the same team. They work together on grand juries. These are their partners. And this guy, attorney Womble, he was asked if he was too close to these deputies to make a decision like this.
This is what he said:
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
QUESTION: Did you feel confident that you could -- you could handle this investigation and not be biased?
WOMBLE: Absolutely. Absolutely.
I`m elected by the people of the First Judicial District to do exactly this job. A special prosecutor or outside counsel is not accountable to the people of this -- of this judicial district. I am.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
REID: And you know what? People don`t trust that, first of all. Let`s start with that. The trust is broken.
You also have within the police department a story that ran in "The Washington Post" today that also ran in the local press about a black council member who protested the killing of Andrew Brown Jr. Police in uniform came to the funeral home that he runs and urinated on it, in uniform.
Why should anybody trust anything coming out of this DA`s office or this police department, knowing all of that?
FORTENBERRY: Well, I tell you, public trust is a big issue in law enforcement today, public trust between the district attorney, all law enforcement, police, corrections, the courts.
And being open, transparent, that`s a big thing too. But without public trust, without -- and any time police use force, we know that diminishes that public trust. So, the use of force the more use of force incidents you see, the less public trust there is. And that kind of thing needs to be addressed. It really does.
As far as whether or not Womble thought he could handle this, that`s his personal decision in that case. But they have to look at the facts and the law and really keep that public trust going.
REID: And I want to just let our audience know that what -- the pictures we were showing you earlier and that we`re showing you again now, these are marches that are taking place right now because of this shooting.
And, Ben, I guess the question is, what now? There won`t be any charges filed. According to the sheriff there, he said the three deputies involved will keep their jobs, but will be disciplined and retrained.
I don`t even know what that means. They were already armed up like they were a tactical military unit and sent into a residential neighborhood, where somebody`s granny might have been in those homes, and shot the place up for one guy.
Retrained how? What do you -- what does the family want to see happen next?
CRUMP: Well, Joy Reid, what they looked like was a lynch mob with guns and badges coming to hunt a black man.
And it was a search warrant. They knew his identity. You see from that video that he was going away. What`s the worst that happens? He gets away. They know his identity. They can regroup and take him again. It`s not like he was wanted for -- as the chief said, for a murder or anything like that.
It was drugs. And this war on drugs oftentimes leads to the death of marginalized people of color, when marijuana has been legalized. Now white men and the government are making billions and billions.
REID: Yes.
CRUMP: But yet they still criminalize us and imprison us for it.
But, with that said, they violated their own policies, shooting into a moving vehicle. We think the Department of Justice, who I have been encouraged by up there in action with George Floyd killing, as well as Ahmaud Arbery killing, they need to come to Elizabeth City, North Carolina, to say that you can`t shoot a man in the back of the head going away from you and say that everything is OK.
REID: Yes.
CRUMP: That is not OK.
REID: And...
CRUMP: Black people deserve due process of the law as well.
REID: Absolutely. You`re absolutely right.
I mean, tech bros are out there selling marijuana now legally, and you`re right, making millions of dollars off of it. And for a drugs warrant, you go in and just execute a guy like this with this over -- it reminds me of the Breonna Taylor case, frankly.
It is repulsive to watch.
Ben Crump, thank you for being here. Jay Fortenberry, thank you both for being here to help us try to make sense of this.
Still ahead: What happens when even Republican officials start slamming the Arizona vote fake audit as craziness and demanding that it be shut down immediately?
Maricopa County`s top election official joins me next, and we will ask him.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
REID: America`s democracy is under assault by a Republican Party that has weaponized Trump`s big lie.
But as bad as the national party might be, the state parties are actually even worse. Just take a look, because it`s happening all around you everywhere. In Florida and in Georgia, they`re restricting access to voting. In Arizona, state Republicans are conducting a third review of the 2020 election, looking to undercut President Biden`s victory.
During their so-called audit, they hired a Florida based-company called Cyber Ninjas, which has no experience with elections. Their CEO does have experience spreading pro-Trump conspiracy theories. How serious is the investigation?
Well, they`re using unscientific methods, like weighing ballots, examining them under microscopes and U.V. light. They`re also hunting for traces of bamboo fibers because of a delusional claim that ballots were smuggled from Asia.
And get this. One supervisor has been accused of feeding thousands of ballots to chickens -- work with me now -- and then burning them, the chickens, with the ballots inside of their little bellies.
These claims are so absurd that even some Republicans have just had enough. Yesterday, in a stunning move, the Republican dominated Maricopa County Board of Supervisors slammed the ongoing fake audit, calling it a sham and a con that was imperiling our democracy.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
BILL GATES (R), VICE CHAIR, MARICOPA COUNTY, ARIZONA, BOARD OF SUPERVISORS: I want to be clear that I believe that Joe Biden won the election. Now it`s time to say, enough is enough.
It is time to push back on the big lie. We must do this. We must do this as a member of the Republican Party. We must do this as a member of the Board of Supervisors. We need to do this as a country. Otherwise, we are not going to be able to move forward.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
REID: In a powerful show of force, the board was joined by the Democratic county sheriff, as well as the Republican county recorder, Stephen Richer.
The board`s unprecedented news conference followed a scathing letter that they sent to state Senate President Karen Fann, in which they said the state has become a laughingstock. Today, Senate President Fann, who`s been orchestrating this farce, kicked out the Democratic leadership team as they tried to attend the fake audit hearing in person, and gave the Trump loyalists a platform to continue to spew their lies about the election.
They did acknowledge that no databases had been deleted, despite a claim made by the former president and current Palm Beach blogger.
And, for more, I`m joined by Republican county recorder Stephen Richer, who called Trump`s statements pushing lies about the 2020 election in Maricopa County unhinged.
Thank you so much for being here. And thank you for standing up for democracy.
I -- in The Bulwark, which I have become obsessed with reading, because this is former Republicans sort of speaking out together, they said that Maricopa is our future.
Are you concerned that, at this point, the Arizona Republican Party has taken all the seriousness out of politics and turned it, as a party, as an entity, Republicanism, into a farce?
STEPHEN RICHER (R), MARICOPA COUNTY, ARIZONA, RECORDER: Well, thanks for having me on, first of all, I really appreciate it.
It doesn`t sound like I have to do too much convincing of you. The chickens is obviously not a good -- a good story to lead with if you`re trying to impress upon people the seriousness of this situation.
But I will tell you, from my perspective, I was very happy that the Senate walked back its claims that we had unlawfully deleted files, because that`s my dog in the fight. My dog in the fight is looking out for the hardworking people of Maricopa County, and not letting them get defamed, not letting their good efforts be just mocked.
REID: I am concerned that this goes from being ridiculous to terrifying, meaning that 2022 comes along, Mark Kelly goes up for his special election.
And then the Cyber Ninjas are back if he is declared the winner to say, nope, nope, he didn`t win, that this bleeds from the presidential elections to Senate races, and even to some of these members maybe sane voters say, get out of here and vote against them, and then they say: No, I`m not leaving. I don`t accept it. The Cyber Ninjas say I won.
RICHER: Yes.
REID: Are you worried that this then becomes the standard way that your party behaves when they lose elections?
RICHER: Yes, absolutely.
And, well, it opens the door to both parties. I don`t think this is now specific to just one party. But...
REID: Well, Democrats don`t believe in this, though.
Democrats -- do you ever have any record of Democrats ever doing this? The pain in the loss of the 2000 election was real. But Al Gore himself presided over handing over the election to George W. Bush. Hillary Clinton losing to that reality show guy, who everyone knew was unqualified to be president, everyone knew that, she -- they handed over.
You had President Obama, you had Hillary Clinton, who knew they were handing the country over to a madman. They did it. You cannot name (AUDIO GAP) Democrats actually believe in democracy when they lose. Your party doesn`t seem to, sir.
RICHER: No, I appreciate it.
And so I don`t think insanity is specific to just one side of the aisle or other, but this instance, yes, this is -- we`re discussing Republicans right now, absolutely.
And anyone who supports...
REID: No, no, not right now, sir. I`m sorry. I`m sorry.
Listen, I appreciate what you have done for democracy. But let me play you for a second, just one second.
This is the lieutenant governor of Georgia, OK? And he is a Republican like you.
(CROSSTALK)
REID: Let`s play him real quick. Listen to this.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
LT. GOV. GEOFF DUNCAN (R-GA): This doesn`t need to be a personality contest. This needs to be a policy-over-politics platform, where we go to work every day and try to solve real problems for real people.
But when you receive death threats from hundreds of Republicans around the country, that`s a problem, when you`re only sitting there telling the truth.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
REID: Mr. Richer, "When you receive death threats from hundreds of Republicans."
Liz Cheney has said that fellow members of her caucus have received death threats.
RICHER: Yes.
REID: And they were so scared of being murdered by Republican voters that they were afraid to vote to impeach the former president, when they knew he was guilty.
That is not a both sidesy thing. Democrats aren`t threatening to murder public officials because they lost an election, sir.
RICHER: Well, I think we can both agree that it is inexcusable and not appropriate in our discourse, and needs to be called out, and needs to be minimized, and needs to be eliminated, ideally.
As for your earlier question, no, I think that anyone who supports the audit has to ask, I think that you just alluded to, which is, one, does this carry on into the 2022 calendar year, as I said, we`re running up against the next elections, when we`re still doing this?
And then the other question, which you also teed up, which is that, why not every election, and why only the presidential? Why -- all that this took was one committee chair in the Arizona state Senate, who then subpoenaed these materials.
That seems problematic.
REID: Yes.
Have you spoken with the two United States senators who have to then run for election in the state of the Cyber Ninjas?
RICHER: I have not spoken with either of them. I would imagine they have concerns.
Prior to this, my focus had been really cloistered, almost, internal...
REID: Yes.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
REID: Good evening, everyone.
We begin THE REIDOUT tonight with a thrown back to the not so distant past. Remember Benghazi? Over the span of four years, we witnessed ten different investigations into that tragic attack on a diplomatic compound in which four Americans died, with investigations in the House, and the Senate, as well as the State Department and the FBI. We heard more than 16 hours of public testimony from former Secretary of State Hillary Clinton, who faced demeaning and outright hostile questioning from overzealous Republican lawmakers.
Benghazi was literally all they talked about. Some even dreamed that it could be the first step toward impeaching President Obama, and after that preventing Secretary Clinton from becoming president. And if that didn`t worked out, impeaching her after the 2016 election.
But after all the, frankly, delusional, obsessive focus and Benghazi becoming practically a swear word for Republicans, many whom probably couldn`t find Benghazi on the map, pop-quiz, what country is it in, there was no evidence of any scandal, no bombshell, no revelations, no supposed stand-down orders Republicans had promised. It was all just horse pucky.
That`s for to today and the same guy who was central to shaking the Benghazi shiny keys as a political ruse is the current leader, quote/unquote, of House Republicans, Kevin McCarthy. Only now, he`s suddenly not so into investigations. Today Kevin came out against legislation to form a bipartisan commission to investigate the MAGA seige of our Capitol on January 6th, Just 24 hours before the vote tomorrow.
Despite his support many reboots of the Benghazi probe, McCarthy had the nerve to say that the January 6th commission would be redundant. Quote, giving the now duplicative and potentially counterproductive nature of this effort, I cannot support this legislation, he said.
But his incoherence doesn`t end there. Instead of focusing solely on the siege itself, Kevin wants the 6th commission to investigate other things, like the Black Lives Matter protests, which has absolutely nothing to do with the insurrection that nearly decapitated our government. It will be like asking the 9/11 commission to investigate the Rodney King beating in protests. The two are completely unrelated.
But Kevin`s special brand of cowards is especially galling because the deal for this commission was brokered by a member of his own conference, Congressman John Katko of New York, who was deputized by Kevin McCarthy to negotiate on behalf of Republicans. In other words, McCarthy has double- crossed Katko, just like he double crossed Liz Cheney last week. According to Punchbowl News, that was not lost on Katko who told his supposedly leader with sarcasm today, thanks for not throwing me under the bus, Kevin. It`s more evidence of the leadership crisis inside the GOP following Liz Cheney`s ouster.
But there`s other reason that Kevin is running scared. He`s a key witness in any investigation into January 6th. He not only spoke to former president while the attack was taking place, he reportedly engaged in a screaming match with Trump who was apparently rooting for the insurrectionist, who were chanting, hang Mike Pence. As Liz Cheney said last week, if Kevin won`t cooperate, he should be subpoenaed.
Joining me now is Errin Haines, Editor-at-Large for The 19th, Jason Johnson, Professor of Journalism and Politics at Morgan State University, and David Jolly, former Republican Congressman from Florida who is no longer affiliated with the party.
But you are former Congressman David, so I`m going to start with you. The thing that so crazy is, you know, what Republicans want to prevent is a commission not about some distant thing that happened in Libya, answered my own pop-quiz, but something that happened to them.
I want to go to -- this is four -- I`m going to skip down, sorry for my producers here. This is Andrew Clyde. This is him comparing the insurrectionists last week to tourists. Take a listen to Andrew Clyde. Okay, there he is on January 6th. Here is what he said about the insurrectionists last week.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
REP. ANDREW CLYDE (R-GA): If you didn`t know the teeny footage was a video from January the 6th, you would actually think it was normal tourist visit.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
REID: So let`s put that picture back up while you talk to us, David. Congress members are trying to suppress something they endured. What the hell is going on?
DAVID JOLLY, MSNBC POLITICAL CONTRIBUTOR: Yes. Here is what I would suggest that comment by Congressman Clyde reflects, is that there`s a bell curve in Congress, just like any institution, and that bell curve includes integrity, honesty and intelligence, and Congressman Clyde is on the wrong side of that bell curve and he displayed that to the world with those statements.
I think if you look at this commission that they`re talking about establishing and now Kevin does not want it to go forward, it`s because we know the focus will be on the culpability of Republican behavior, not just Donald Trump`s behavior but Republican behavior going into the events of January 6th.
And, Joy, I would say the luscious irony in all of this is just as Kevin`s handling of the Benghazi commission, some would argue derailed his ascension to the speakership. When he went on Fox News and said, look, this was all about taking down Hillary Clinton. It wasn`t about Benghazi. Just as that derailed his ascension speakership, when Boehner was retiring, a January 6th Commission could derail Kevin shot at the speakership as well, because it would focus in on what Kevin McCarthy knows about those events.
When Liz Cheney says that Kevin McCarthy should testify, it`s not just because Liz Cheney wants to get to the truth. Liz Cheney has said that McCarthy won`t be speaker, which tells me that Liz Cheney knows that Kevin McCarthy knows something that is so damning, it could undo his ascension to the speakership should Kevin McCarthy go under oath before a January 6th commission.
REID: And, Jason, all he has know is other members of Congress, because a lot of them participated as well. Here is Senator Chuck Grassley, trying to -- you know, they want to obfuscate because they realize how damning this could be for members of the Republican caucus. But here is Chuck Grassley trying to muddy the waters. Take a listen.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
SEN. CHUCK GRASSLEY (R-IA (voice over)): I think that they`re going to have to broaden the inquiries that they`re making in order to get 60 votes.
REPORTER: Okay, got it. Would you support it right now or would you need to see it broadened?
GRASSLEY: I think I`d prefer broadened because there`s more things wrong in this country than what just happened on January the 6th.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
REID: Yes, more things that happened. Here is Marjorie Taylor Greene agreeing with Chuck Grassley.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
REP. MARJORIE TAYLOR GREENE (R-GA): Indeed we should have a commission to study the violent BLM and Antifa mobs that had plague the American cities this past summer. Also, while it`s catch and release for domestic terrorists Antifa, BLM, the people who breached the Capitol on January 6th are being abused.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
REID: So they`re going to have to do that during an entire hearing right, Jason?
JASON JOHNSON, MSNBC POLITICAL CONTRIBUTOR: Well, yes. And this is what makes this so insane. I don`t know why the Democrats are even bothering to try and make a bipartisan commission at this point. The Republicans know that many of them are potentially complicit either in not standing up when this was happening or obfuscating people who might been involved.
I keep going back to the Mikie Sherrill, who was a congresswoman, who said at the beginning, I`m fairly confident that I saw people giving tours to folks who showed up later at insurrectionists and the Republican Party doesn`t want a real investigation. This is the Empire saying like, all right, you got the Death Star, we don`t have to do the whole investigation into Darth Vader. Why do we have to talk about that? Like but you can`t go forward. The country can`t go forward unless we have an investigation.
Because I promise you whoever was responsible for this and the people in Congress who were responsible for this, will try again at some point. I think the Democrats just need to go it alone and forget about getting Republicans involved.
REID: Well, they`re not going to have to. I mean, the vote is going to pass tomorrow, Errin. It`s going to happen. This commission is going to pass and then it`s going to occur and then the people who are going to be spotlighted are going to be a bunch of Republicans who were giving the high fists to the insurrectionists.
ERRIN HAINES, THE 19TH EDITOR-AT-LARGE: Yes. That`s exactly right, Joy. And, look, you could mistake that footage for a lot of things, maybe civil war reenactment, maybe Call of Duty footage, but what it was not was just another group of tourists at the Capitol on January 6th.
And so, you know, I think that that was what a lot of American`s saw. And to Jason`s point this commission really is for the majority of Americans who saw that as the violent, racist insurrection that it was attempting to delegitimize black voters and, you know, and want accountability on this just as those insurrectionists, many of whom are facing federal charges and could be going to federal prison for being peaceful tourists that day, you know, according to Congressman Clyde.
You know, Republicans in Congress also need to face accountability. And if indeed it was a peaceful day at the Capitol, you know, let that come out in the commission`s findings, you know, why not have them study this.
And to your point about folks on the Republican side who continue to try to create this false equivalency to the overwhelmingly peaceful Black Lives Matter protests that happened last summer, and that was documented as overwhelmingly peaceful, right, that is the other big lie that some folks just, you know, are continued to be dug in on and that they are attempting to perpetuate and connect to this 6th commission.
REID: For you, first, Errin, and then David Jolly. I wonder if Val Demings might end up on this commission or should she. I mean, she already participated in the impeachment of Donald Trump. She appears now to be running for United States Senate. You interviewed her about that. Is the other fear that someone like Val Demings might end up on that commission get to do some questioning of some people like Kevin?
HAINES: Well, I`m not sure that, that`s going to happen, Joy, but I did ask Congresswoman Demings about this, you know, being that she was the former impeachment manager, she is a member of law enforcement, who is very supportive of those Capitol Police who were having to defend her and her colleagues on January 6th.
And what she said was she wanted to see a 9/11 style commission that had members who were not in Congress, right? So, folks who were not directly involved taking kind of unbiased objective approach to studying the events of that day and coming up with a conclusion that really is unimpeachable.
And so while she was certainly in favor of that commission, she was saying that she is not somebody that would want to be on it but wants to see folks who are impartial, really weighing in on the events of the day.
REID: But whether or not she`s on it, David Jolly, how damaging is it going to be for Republicans, for the nation, to relive through this commission the events of January 6th?
JOLLY: Oh, it`s going to be incredibly damaging because, as much as they want to draw some type of parity to Black Lives Matter or to other protests that simply cannot hold in this event. And it is lunacy for Republicans to suggest it. And we should call them out every step of the way.
I accept that there is no parity in the level of violence. We can see that with our own eyes. But even if you suggest that social protests on other issues across the county has involved violence, has involved injury, what happened on January 6th was an attempt to undermine our democracy, to rip away our election, to undo our republic.
That is not similar to the other protests we have seen, to the other violence has seen. That is not similar, as Kevin McCarthy suggested, to the violence on the baseball field where the shooting occurred of Republican members of Congress.
Yes, violence is wrong in all aspect and should be condemned but the effort going into January 6th, the big lie that Donald Trump led, that Kevin McCarthy amplified and every other Republican that involved themselves in this was an attempt to undo our democracy and undermined our republic.
If Democrats and a commission, bipartisan or not, are able to focus in on that, it is hard for Republicans to suggest why they should return to power in November `22.
REID: Yes. And, Jason Johnson, that brings us to 2022 in which this now becomes the story in that election. Your thoughts.
JOHNSON: It should be. Every single Democrat needs to nationalize this election as soon as possible. And, look, the whole idea of comparing, you know, what on January 6th to last summer, it doesn`t make any sense where we now. You saw more arrest at peaceful protests in Louisville after Breonna Taylor was killed than you saw during the insurrection. It`s taking like months before the insurrection got to 400 different arrests. Not to mention of fact, that there`s a huge difference between your youth pastor with a Black Lives Matter sign in the middle of a Target parking lot and a bunch of people with guns weapons beating and abusing police officers to go take over the United States of America.
The Democrats` 2022 is theirs to lose. All they have to do is keep the economy functioning, which they may or may not be able to control, make this national election and pass voting rights reform. Because the vast majority of Americans are not in favor of the insurrectionist party, they`re not in favor of the handmaid`s still party, they`re not in favor of this insane party and the Democrats should make that their main issue.
REID: Shots, checks and democracy, keep it simple. That is the issue in 2022. Errin Haines, Jason Johnson, David Jolly, thank you all very much.
Up next, on THE REIDOUT, like a scene out of the battle of Baghdad, North Carolina deputies armed to teeth, shot and killed Andrew Brown Jr. in a drugs arrest. Now, the D.A. is calling the horrific display that we all saw justified.
Plus, the sham and the shame, Maricopa County officials many of them Republicans say it`s time for their party to call off the phony recount. One of those Republican officials joins me tonight.
And tonight`s absolute worst spends his days on Russian state T.V. whining that the Americans government is mean to his daddy. And now, little man thinks that can be governor of New York. You don`t want to miss that.
THE REIDOUT continues after this.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
REID: Today, we saw a video of what it looks like when the war on drugs looks like actual war. Authorities in North Carolina finally gave us glimpse of the body camera footage in the shooting death of Andrew Brown Jr. by Pasquotank County sheriff`s deputies nearly a month ago. The video was shown by District Attorney Andrew Womble after he announced that he won`t be filing any charges against the deputies involved. We should warn you this footage is disturbing.
Police claim the deputies were attempting to serve search warrants and arrest warrants related to drug charges, armed like a military unit invading 2003 Baghdad, no less. The D.A. said that the deputies actions were justified under the circumstances.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
ANDREW WOMBLE, DISTRICT ATTORNEY, PASQOUTANK COUNTY, NORTH CAROLINA: Mr. Brown`s death, while tragic, was justified because Mr. Brown`s actions caused three deputies with the Pasquotank County Sheriff`s Office to reasonably believe it was necessary to use deadly force to protect themselves and others.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
REID: The family of Andrew Brown Jr. were able to view some additional footage last week just under 20 minutes of the nearly two hours of body cam video. They have called his death an execution.
In a statement, attorneys representing Brown`s family called the D.A.`s decision an insults and a slap in the face to Andrew`s family, the Elizabeth City community and to rational people everywhere. The attorneys noted, as you saw on the video, that Brown was driving away from the deputies. Four deputies didn`t fire and fatal shot was to the back of Andrew Brown Jr.`s head.
The district attorney, who was urged by the governor to turn over the case to a special prosecutor, argued that the deputies used force reasonably, first because they were there to serve warrants.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
ANDREW WOMBLE, PASQUOTANK COUNTY, NORTH CAROLINA, DISTRICT ATTORNEY: The law enforcement officers were duty bound to stand their ground, carry through on the performance of their duties, and take Andrew Brown into custody.
They could not simply let him go, as has been suggested.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
REID: He also argued that Brown`s decision to, as he termed it, flee escalated the situation from a show of force to employment of force.
So, sheriff`s deputies descended on a residential neighborhood armed to the teeth to serve a drug warrant to an unarmed black man in his car. And within 44 seconds, Andrew Brown was dead, and, according to the district attorney, it was justified. In other words, the war on drugs, it`s wanted, dead or alive.
Joining me now is Ben Crump, attorney for the Brown family, and Jay Fortenberry, assistant professor at Elizabeth State -- Elizabeth City State University and a former police chief in Edenton, North Carolina.
And I want to go to you first, Mr. Fortenberry.
Is that how it`s supposed to work in serving a drugs warrant on an unarmed man in a residential neighborhood? That looked like the assault of Baghdad in 2003, to be honest with you. It looked like they went in to arrest a terrorist cell. Is that how it`s done in North Carolina?
JAY FORTENBERRY, FORMER EDENTON, NORTH CAROLINA, POLICE CHIEF: Hey, Joy. Thank you for having me on here.
And it is a disturbing video to watch. And one of the issues that we talk about a lot in North Carolina and across the country, matter of fact, is militarization of police, when is that necessary?
And it is sad. This case was based on a law mala prohibita. This was not a mala in se-type law. This was not murder, robbery, rape. This was drug -- like you said, a drug offense. And it`s a double-edged sword. Sometimes, police officers, they go in with the use of force, hoping that it will deter any use of force. And, sometimes, it doesn`t.
But when do you use these teams? That`s an issue that needs to be examined across America.
REID: Ben, the family, the attorneys, and I`m assuming, presuming, including yourself, had asked attorney Womble to recuse himself, sending a letter saying that he needed to, that the conflict is well-defined with the sheriff`s office.
What does that mean, well-defined with the sheriff`s office, and why did you want him recused?
BENJAMIN CRUMP, ATTORNEY FOR FAMILY OF ANDREW BROWN JR.: Well, because, obviously, this is a local district attorney who works on a systematic and regular basis with the local sheriff`s department.
In fact, they`re housed in the same building together. And we thought, to remove any hint of impropriety, Joy, that he should recuse himself, so there wouldn`t be exactly what we saw today, this press conference, where he whitewashed the investigation to justify this unjustifiable killing of yet another black man who`s going away from the police, not posing a threat.
But yet they shoot him in the back of his brain. And it will not be swept under the rug. We are demanding that they release all the bodycam video in the North Carolina State Bureau of Investigations report, because, if it`s justified, then what do they have to hide?
And we want the Department of Justice, Merrick Garland, to intervene immediately, because we will not let this be swept under the rug.
REID: And, Jay Fortenberry, not -- a lot of us have done -- looked at a lot of these police cases. We don`t have a lot of faith, honestly, in this connection between prosecutors and police.
When they`re involved, they are -- as you just heard Ben Crump say, they are on the same team. They work together on grand juries. These are their partners. And this guy, attorney Womble, he was asked if he was too close to these deputies to make a decision like this.
This is what he said:
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
QUESTION: Did you feel confident that you could -- you could handle this investigation and not be biased?
WOMBLE: Absolutely. Absolutely.
I`m elected by the people of the First Judicial District to do exactly this job. A special prosecutor or outside counsel is not accountable to the people of this -- of this judicial district. I am.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
REID: And you know what? People don`t trust that, first of all. Let`s start with that. The trust is broken.
You also have within the police department a story that ran in "The Washington Post" today that also ran in the local press about a black council member who protested the killing of Andrew Brown Jr. Police in uniform came to the funeral home that he runs and urinated on it, in uniform.
Why should anybody trust anything coming out of this DA`s office or this police department, knowing all of that?
FORTENBERRY: Well, I tell you, public trust is a big issue in law enforcement today, public trust between the district attorney, all law enforcement, police, corrections, the courts.
And being open, transparent, that`s a big thing too. But without public trust, without -- and any time police use force, we know that diminishes that public trust. So, the use of force the more use of force incidents you see, the less public trust there is. And that kind of thing needs to be addressed. It really does.
As far as whether or not Womble thought he could handle this, that`s his personal decision in that case. But they have to look at the facts and the law and really keep that public trust going.
REID: And I want to just let our audience know that what -- the pictures we were showing you earlier and that we`re showing you again now, these are marches that are taking place right now because of this shooting.
And, Ben, I guess the question is, what now? There won`t be any charges filed. According to the sheriff there, he said the three deputies involved will keep their jobs, but will be disciplined and retrained.
I don`t even know what that means. They were already armed up like they were a tactical military unit and sent into a residential neighborhood, where somebody`s granny might have been in those homes, and shot the place up for one guy.
Retrained how? What do you -- what does the family want to see happen next?
CRUMP: Well, Joy Reid, what they looked like was a lynch mob with guns and badges coming to hunt a black man.
And it was a search warrant. They knew his identity. You see from that video that he was going away. What`s the worst that happens? He gets away. They know his identity. They can regroup and take him again. It`s not like he was wanted for -- as the chief said, for a murder or anything like that.
It was drugs. And this war on drugs oftentimes leads to the death of marginalized people of color, when marijuana has been legalized. Now white men and the government are making billions and billions.
REID: Yes.
CRUMP: But yet they still criminalize us and imprison us for it.
But, with that said, they violated their own policies, shooting into a moving vehicle. We think the Department of Justice, who I have been encouraged by up there in action with George Floyd killing, as well as Ahmaud Arbery killing, they need to come to Elizabeth City, North Carolina, to say that you can`t shoot a man in the back of the head going away from you and say that everything is OK.
REID: Yes.
CRUMP: That is not OK.
REID: And...
CRUMP: Black people deserve due process of the law as well.
REID: Absolutely. You`re absolutely right.
I mean, tech bros are out there selling marijuana now legally, and you`re right, making millions of dollars off of it. And for a drugs warrant, you go in and just execute a guy like this with this over -- it reminds me of the Breonna Taylor case, frankly.
It is repulsive to watch.
Ben Crump, thank you for being here. Jay Fortenberry, thank you both for being here to help us try to make sense of this.
Still ahead: What happens when even Republican officials start slamming the Arizona vote fake audit as craziness and demanding that it be shut down immediately?
Maricopa County`s top election official joins me next, and we will ask him.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
REID: America`s democracy is under assault by a Republican Party that has weaponized Trump`s big lie.
But as bad as the national party might be, the state parties are actually even worse. Just take a look, because it`s happening all around you everywhere. In Florida and in Georgia, they`re restricting access to voting. In Arizona, state Republicans are conducting a third review of the 2020 election, looking to undercut President Biden`s victory.
During their so-called audit, they hired a Florida based-company called Cyber Ninjas, which has no experience with elections. Their CEO does have experience spreading pro-Trump conspiracy theories. How serious is the investigation?
Well, they`re using unscientific methods, like weighing ballots, examining them under microscopes and U.V. light. They`re also hunting for traces of bamboo fibers because of a delusional claim that ballots were smuggled from Asia.
And get this. One supervisor has been accused of feeding thousands of ballots to chickens -- work with me now -- and then burning them, the chickens, with the ballots inside of their little bellies.
These claims are so absurd that even some Republicans have just had enough. Yesterday, in a stunning move, the Republican dominated Maricopa County Board of Supervisors slammed the ongoing fake audit, calling it a sham and a con that was imperiling our democracy.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
BILL GATES (R), VICE CHAIR, MARICOPA COUNTY, ARIZONA, BOARD OF SUPERVISORS: I want to be clear that I believe that Joe Biden won the election. Now it`s time to say, enough is enough.
It is time to push back on the big lie. We must do this. We must do this as a member of the Republican Party. We must do this as a member of the Board of Supervisors. We need to do this as a country. Otherwise, we are not going to be able to move forward.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
REID: In a powerful show of force, the board was joined by the Democratic county sheriff, as well as the Republican county recorder, Stephen Richer.
The board`s unprecedented news conference followed a scathing letter that they sent to state Senate President Karen Fann, in which they said the state has become a laughingstock. Today, Senate President Fann, who`s been orchestrating this farce, kicked out the Democratic leadership team as they tried to attend the fake audit hearing in person, and gave the Trump loyalists a platform to continue to spew their lies about the election.
They did acknowledge that no databases had been deleted, despite a claim made by the former president and current Palm Beach blogger.
And, for more, I`m joined by Republican county recorder Stephen Richer, who called Trump`s statements pushing lies about the 2020 election in Maricopa County unhinged.
Thank you so much for being here. And thank you for standing up for democracy.
I -- in The Bulwark, which I have become obsessed with reading, because this is former Republicans sort of speaking out together, they said that Maricopa is our future.
Are you concerned that, at this point, the Arizona Republican Party has taken all the seriousness out of politics and turned it, as a party, as an entity, Republicanism, into a farce?
STEPHEN RICHER (R), MARICOPA COUNTY, ARIZONA, RECORDER: Well, thanks for having me on, first of all, I really appreciate it.
It doesn`t sound like I have to do too much convincing of you. The chickens is obviously not a good -- a good story to lead with if you`re trying to impress upon people the seriousness of this situation.
But I will tell you, from my perspective, I was very happy that the Senate walked back its claims that we had unlawfully deleted files, because that`s my dog in the fight. My dog in the fight is looking out for the hardworking people of Maricopa County, and not letting them get defamed, not letting their good efforts be just mocked.
REID: I am concerned that this goes from being ridiculous to terrifying, meaning that 2022 comes along, Mark Kelly goes up for his special election.
And then the Cyber Ninjas are back if he is declared the winner to say, nope, nope, he didn`t win, that this bleeds from the presidential elections to Senate races, and even to some of these members maybe sane voters say, get out of here and vote against them, and then they say: No, I`m not leaving. I don`t accept it. The Cyber Ninjas say I won.
RICHER: Yes.
REID: Are you worried that this then becomes the standard way that your party behaves when they lose elections?
RICHER: Yes, absolutely.
And, well, it opens the door to both parties. I don`t think this is now specific to just one party. But...
REID: Well, Democrats don`t believe in this, though.
Democrats -- do you ever have any record of Democrats ever doing this? The pain in the loss of the 2000 election was real. But Al Gore himself presided over handing over the election to George W. Bush. Hillary Clinton losing to that reality show guy, who everyone knew was unqualified to be president, everyone knew that, she -- they handed over.
You had President Obama, you had Hillary Clinton, who knew they were handing the country over to a madman. They did it. You cannot name (AUDIO GAP) Democrats actually believe in democracy when they lose. Your party doesn`t seem to, sir.
RICHER: No, I appreciate it.
And so I don`t think insanity is specific to just one side of the aisle or other, but this instance, yes, this is -- we`re discussing Republicans right now, absolutely.
And anyone who supports...
REID: No, no, not right now, sir. I`m sorry. I`m sorry.
Listen, I appreciate what you have done for democracy. But let me play you for a second, just one second.
This is the lieutenant governor of Georgia, OK? And he is a Republican like you.
(CROSSTALK)
REID: Let`s play him real quick. Listen to this.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
LT. GOV. GEOFF DUNCAN (R-GA): This doesn`t need to be a personality contest. This needs to be a policy-over-politics platform, where we go to work every day and try to solve real problems for real people.
But when you receive death threats from hundreds of Republicans around the country, that`s a problem, when you`re only sitting there telling the truth.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
REID: Mr. Richer, "When you receive death threats from hundreds of Republicans."
Liz Cheney has said that fellow members of her caucus have received death threats.
RICHER: Yes.
REID: And they were so scared of being murdered by Republican voters that they were afraid to vote to impeach the former president, when they knew he was guilty.
That is not a both sidesy thing. Democrats aren`t threatening to murder public officials because they lost an election, sir.
RICHER: Well, I think we can both agree that it is inexcusable and not appropriate in our discourse, and needs to be called out, and needs to be minimized, and needs to be eliminated, ideally.
As for your earlier question, no, I think that anyone who supports the audit has to ask, I think that you just alluded to, which is, one, does this carry on into the 2022 calendar year, as I said, we`re running up against the next elections, when we`re still doing this?
And then the other question, which you also teed up, which is that, why not every election, and why only the presidential? Why -- all that this took was one committee chair in the Arizona state Senate, who then subpoenaed these materials.
That seems problematic.
REID: Yes.
Have you spoken with the two United States senators who have to then run for election in the state of the Cyber Ninjas?
RICHER: I have not spoken with either of them. I would imagine they have concerns. Prior to this my focus had been, I`ve been cloistered, just been focusing on the nuts and bolts.
Maybe you heard but I ran to make the recorders office boring again.
REID: Yes.
RICHER: So, I had not taken full interview prior to Friday. And, you know, we were planning on reaching out once the COVID situation was completely under control and giving tours to all elected officials, Republicans and Democrats and, yeah, we started with some of our federal delegation. We want them feel good about this.
I`m scared and nervous that we will not get there in 2020. I don`t know what the polls will look like. I don`t know what turnout will look like, and most importantly, I don`t know what acceptance of the results will look like.
REID: Yeah, it`s scary place to be as a democracy. And I appreciate you standing up for that democracy. You`re right, it`s supposed to be boring. Let it will boring again. We all want that.
RICHER: We`re gloried bean counters. I don`t even know if we`re glorified, but we should just be counting beans, counting votes.
REID: Amen. Yes, amen. Well, go back -- well, we hope you can get back to just counting beans very soon.
Stephen Richer, thank you, sir, for being here today.
Up next -- I mean, let them count their beans. Stand up for democracy.
OK. You`d think between banking big bucks off a pandemic book deal, an investigation into that deal, allegations he suppressed data about nursing home deaths and alleges of sexual harassment that New York Governor Andrew Cuomo would have a lock on the absolute worst. Not so fast. The big reveal is next.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
REID: We learn today that New York Governor Andrew Cuomo is going to earn a staggering $5.1 million for his book on how great he handled the pandemic. The problem is, while he was soaking up all that good press, mostly because he wasn`t a Republican governor resisting to taking action on the pandemic, he was also suppressing information on just how bad the death toll was in New York`s nursing homes and what "Times" calls a months- long effort to obscure the full scope of nursing home deaths. Cuomo`s office has denied altering the data.
That`s not even the only scandal he`s faced this year, with multiple women accusing him of sexual harassment.
Cuomo`s denied any wrongdoing and his denials have become more strident with each passing week. He delivered this particularly tone-deaf response to a reporter last week.
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GOV. ANDREW CUOMO (D), NEW YORK: Harassment is not making someone fell uncomfortable. That is not harassment. If I made you feel uncomfortable, that is not harassment. That`s you feeling uncomfortable.
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REID: As that reporter later pointed out, Cuomo`s definition of workplace sexual harassment seems to contradict the law that he signed in 2019 which lowers the standard of what`s considered harassment.
Through all of this, Cuomo has refused to resign and for that, plus the money that he made profiting off the pandemic, he`s pretty much the worse.
But he`s not the absolute worse that the state of New York could actually do. They could do worse. That dishonor goes to someone who may very well run against him for governor, Andrew Giuliani, Rudy`s 35-year-old son, who just announced that he is entering the race today.
Andrew has never served in political office and his job working at orange Julius Caesar`s administration was, given his lack of qualifications and a surname widely seen as nepotism. Beyond that, his campaign website cites his pro-golf career and stint as CEO of his golf company, though it doesn`t mention he got cut from the Duke University golf team for bullying, which he, of course, denies.
Since Trump left office, Andrew Giuliani has been wandering around conservative media trying to defend his daddy who is currently under investigation for cozying up to Ukrainians, in a sad attempt to dig up dirt on Joe Biden.
Here is on actual Russian state TV complaining that Americans don`t want to live here anymore because the mean old DOJ which no longer protects Trump`s friends like William Barr`s Justice Department used to.
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ANDREW GIULIANI (R), NY GOVERNOR CANDIDATE: The thing that`s been amazing is over the last couple of weeks, how many people and some of these people are people that haven`t talked to my father in five or ten years have come out and said, we may not have always agreed with your politics but we completely agree this is absolutely the wrong thing. They don`t want to live in a country where you`re going to have a Justice Department that`s going to politicize something to the point where a former president`s personal counsel is going to actually be signed on by the Justice Department.
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REID: Change his heart, Andrew. Also, is he ever learned anything about Vladimir Putin?
So, for his hubris and one might say stupidity in thinking he`s the most qualified person to be the actual governor of New York and for his pitiful defense of his cry-me daddy, Rudy Giuliani, Andrew Giuliani is tonight`s absolute worse.
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REID: Attacks against Asian-Americans have escalated during the pandemic in no small part due to the former president by putting a target on their backs by blaming the coronavirus on China. In a terrific piece for his show this past weekend, my friend and colleague Ali Velshi spoke to six Asian- Americans and Pacific Islanders in San Francisco about their lived experiences with hate in America.
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DEBRA WONG YANG, ATTORNEY: I`m a 100 percent American. I mean, I`m fifth generation and I`ve been very lucky here. I can`t speak the language, but I eat the food. I behave the way I`m supposed to as a Chinese girl, and I have all these cultural attributes.
But my heart 100 percent bleeds red, white and blue. And so, I may look differently and I may not look like the quintessential American, but this is what quintessential America is.
CHRISTINA SHEA, RICHMOND AREA MULTI-SERVICES DIRECTOR OF CLINICAL SERVICES: Especially the beginning of 2020, our then-president`s rhetoric about the China flu and, you know, anybody who looks Chinese was the bad guy. And I think that sort of reminds us about how we had been treated all along.
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REID: Just a few hours ago, the House passed a Senate bill to address the rise in anti-Asian hate crimes during the pandemic.
And Congresswoman Grace Meng of New York who introduced alongside Senator Mazie Hirono joins me now.
Congresswoman, congratulations on the bill.
And I guess the question is, you know, it was passed, it`s gone through the House. What will it actually do to change things?
REP. GRACE MENG (D-NY): Thank you so much for having me and for addressing this issue.
We are thrilled that the legislation has passed and it is one of many steps that we will have to take towards addressing this serious issue.
The bill does a few things. It has dedicated personnel at the Department of Justice to actually review these cases. Most hate crimes and hate incidents are not being reported to the federal government at all.
And so we want to make sure, as with any public health crisis like gun violence, that we are having a more accurate and complete set of data to figure out how we can better target and address this problem.
We want to make it easier for people to actually report these incidents. Oftentimes, we`re just telling people to report them, but some people might not feel comfortable going into a new building, a police precinct. They might have language obstacles, they might be disabled, they might literally be on their way to work when something happens to them.
So we want local law enforcement to establish online reporting in multiple languages, for example.
REID: Yeah. And also fear of police, right, because it`s not -- it`s not like all communities of color don`t have a certain amount of fear of police. I also wonder if there is a sense among some Asian-Americans that they might not even get some concern coming back.
I think about -- I mean, Ali talked about that this weekend. The Vincent Chin case which people may not remember, but it`s one of the cases that established the idea we need a hate crime legislation. This was in 1992.
And Vincent Chin was a Chinese-American man who`s beaten to death in Detroit by two men who were Chrysler workers who are frustrated about the U.S. auto industry`s troubles with Japan. And just because he was Asian- American, they just decided -- he`s not even Japanese American, even if he was, it wouldn`t have been right.
And they just got off. No jail time. The judge said, we don`t sentence people like you.
Is there a sense of something you can do in law to deal with the, I guess, lack of concern that we`ve seen potentially out of law enforcement about this?
MENG: Well, right now, most cases that are happening around the country, I think about over 80 percent of hate incidents are not even being reported to the federal government. So we just wanted to make sure that we are holding police accountable, making sure that they are actually telling the federal government when these incidents happen, and that they`re properly investigating them as well.
REID: Yeah, and let`s talk about the education piece of it, because we were talking about this with our producers today about this segment. And one of the producers brought up a really good point which is you have legislation as well about reintroducing some legislation that you had before to promote the teaching and learning of Asian Pacific American history in schools across the U.S. It`s called the Teaching Asian Pacific American History Act.
And there is this poll that is really shocking and it`s by leading Asian- Americans to Unite for Change. This was a March-April poll.
It asked people -- name a prominent Asian-American who comes to mind. Look at that, don`t know, 42 percent. Jackie Chan and Bruce Lee each around 10 percent.
Is that part of the issue, that people just don`t know the history and don`t know prominent Asian-Americans when asked by a pollster?
MENG: Absolutely. And today, to your previous point, would have been the 66th birthday of Vincent Chin.
And many Americans, including Asian-Americans, have not learned enough about the contribution of Asian-Americans and unrepresented communities to this country. We want to make sure that our kids are understanding a more complete picture of what Asian-American history looks like. As kids growing up here, we don`t learn enough about the China Exclusion Act, Japanese incarceration camps, slaves building the U.S. Capitol, the very place where I work every day.
And in order to, in the long term, break down these walls of these biases and stereotypes, we need to make sure that our children are getting a complete picture of who and what America history is made up of.
REID: Yeah, stay tuned. Tom Cotton is probably going to be angry about that. Unless it`s sunny and rosy, he doesn`t like history.
Let me play another piece from this great Ali Velshi set of interviews. This is Pastor Joey Chen and he was actually talking about the Asian- American officer, Officer Thao, in the George Floyd case.
Take a listen.
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PASTOR JOEY CHEN, LEAD PASTOR, SUNSET CHURCH IN SAN FRANCISCO: What really broke my heart last summer what really sparked begin to try and plea and be active was when I saw the Asian-American police officer stand by as George Floyd was being killed. That broke my heart, because basically I saw myself in that passivity, and I realized this is not the way of Christ, this is not the way humanity which ought to be, and I think we should begin to take action to advocate and walk alongside people who feel fear, who feel a sense of loss and hopelessness to provide that sense that we can do this together.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
REID: I loved him because he was talking about solidarity. Some of these attacks have been non-white, Asian-Americans and other non-white people that are involved in the attacks.
How can we create more solidarity across communities?
MENG: This is one of the silver linings that has come out of this past year. I see strengthening and expansion of coalitions. I see communities working together, and it really started in many places with the protests of George Floyd`s murder where we saw diverse communities, including Asian- Americans, show up to Black Lives Matter protests.
And that led to a lot of challenging but important conversations between and with our communities. We can`t just address racism aimed at our communities, we ever to address tolerance that might exist within our own community as well.
REID: Indeed, indeed. Thank you, Congresswoman Grace Meng. Congratulations on the legislation passing. We really appreciate it.
OK. Before we go tonight, we are running out of time, but we have a quick update on the violence that continues to engulf Israel and the occupied territories. Overnight, the Israel military said fighter jets carried out more than 100 strikes on what it claims is a network of tunnels used by Hamas in Gaza. Despite President Biden finally joining international calls for a ceasefire, Israeli Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu has said today that operations against Hamas will continue.
The Palestinian death toll in Gaza is now 217 people, including at least 63 children. According to health officials, the death toll in Israel is now 12, including two children.
Palestinians in Jerusalem, the West Bank and Israel staged a general strike, with shops closing their doors and students staying home from school in a rare joint action against Israel`s air campaign in Gaza.
And that is tonight`s REIDOUT.
"ALL IN WITH CHRIS HAYES" starts now.