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Transcript: All In with Chris Hayes, 5/14/21

Guests: Sarah Longwell, Jose Pagliery, Olivia Beavers, Rep. David Cicilline, Perri Klass


Elise Stefanik today was elected to replace Congresswoman Liz Cheney holding the number three spot in House Republican leadership. Rep. Matt Gaetz`s associate, Joel Greenberg, agreed to plead to six of the 33 charges and they include fraud, identity theft, and sex trafficking of a minor. Congresswoman Marjorie Taylor Greene of Georgia had aggressively confronted Congresswoman Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez of New York outside the House chamber, yelling and chasing her down the hall. Democratic Congressman David Cicilline of Rhode Island is now circling a resolution to center those Republican House members who continue to defend the attack on the Capitol. Asymptomatic infections do occur and the new science is looking at whether people who are fully vaccinated and who get those asymptomatic infections are shedding much virus from the mouth and nose.


UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Sadly, these -- get to articulate that even propaganda to narrative of their assaults on our life. But the myriad of social media footage has been proving to us that it is not self-defense to bomb residential neighborhoods, media buildings. It`s not self-defense. I think context matters here.

JOY REID, MSNBC HOST: We`ve got to go. My time is over. I have to go into the next show. Mohammed el-Kurd, thank you very much for being here, Rula Jebreal. That is tonight`s REIDOUT. "ALL IN WITH CHRIS HAYES" starts now.



REP. ELISE STEFANIK (R-NY): We are unified in working with President Trump. My job representing our Republican members, the vast majority, we look forward to working with President Trump.

HAYES: How Donald Trump`s takeover of the Republican Congress just ended generations of conservative rule. And what we should expect from the bipartisan commission to investigate January 6?

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Should Kevin McCarthy be willing to speak -- testify before that commission?

REP. LIZ CHENEY (R-WY): He absolutely should. And I wouldn`t be surprised if he were subpoenaed.

HAYES: Plus, Matt Gaetz`s buddy Joel Greenberg admits in a plea agreement that he and other adult men engaged in commercial sex acts with a minor. So, what does that mean for Matt Gaetz?

Then, new calls for action as video of the QAnon Congresswoman shaking down AOC surfaces.

REP. MARJORIE TAYLOR GREENE (R-GA): You need to stop being a baby and stop locking your door.

REP. ALEXANDRIA OCASIO-CORTEZ (D-NY): This is a woman that`s deeply unwell and clearly needs some help.

HAYES: And a day after the CDC`s big announcement on masks, growing questions about what that means for kids and school when ALL IN starts right now.


HAYES (on camera): Good evening from New York, I`m Chris Hayes. Leadership votes within a political party are always going to be a kind of test of party loyalty, but also a way for the party to send a message on how infused itself, to structure itself, what it operates and orbits around.

And I say this because well, we all knew the outcome, right, of today`s leadership vote going into it because we all know what this Republican Party is.

Today`s vote featured two people vying to replace Congresswoman Liz Chaney of Wyoming as chair of the House Republican Conference. Texas Republican Chip Roy, well, he`s a pretty conservative guy. Political organizations rank politicians. He has a lifetime rating of 96 and 95 from two of the right-wing think tanks that score this kind of thing.

And then there was Congresswoman Elise Stefanik of New York. She`s a Harvard graduate who made her name in the Republican establishment and who used to brag about how much she was a moderate. Well, her conservative voting score shows that she`s only about as half as conservative as her opponent, though in terms of party loyalty and party leadership.

Think about this. Republicans had one big legislative accomplishment to show for the Trump administration. The thing they are proudest of, the one thing they passed in 2017, and that, of course, was the tax cut for the rich, right, the big cut to the corporate tax rate and the top rate and all that.

And when they did that, the one big legislative accomplishment, they only lost 10 Republican votes in the House in a party-line vote more or less. Elise Stefanik was one of them. Think of that, one of the people that cross party lines on their big signature accomplishment. Could you imagine elevating a Democrat to leadership after they voted against ObamaCare?

But that vote, that legislative accomplishment, that big thing they`re so proud of, that`s not what matters anymore. And Congresswoman Stefanik knew this which is largely why she went after this position. What matters, and she understands this, is of course her zealous defense of Donald Trump which started with her performance on Fox News ripping his impeachment as nothing more than a political weapon.


UNIDENTIFIED MALE: At least a dozen of your fellow Republicans will join the Democrats and vote to impeach the president. You, however, will not be on the list.

STEFANIK: That is correct, Steve. This is a snap impeachment. This is what Democrats have been focused on frankly since the president was elected in 2016. They are still focusing on impeaching him even after the 2020 elections.


HAYES: That was the second impeachment, by the way. Stefanik sort of made her name during the first impeachment. That was her big sort of coming out of the party, her heel turn, her opportunity to go on Fox News and defend the president.

What mattered above all else, what has mattered is her willingness to frontally assault American democracy. And she did that by voting to overturn the 2020 presidential election and not ceding Joe Biden`s electors. Congressman Chip Roy, with all of his concerns bonafides, he did not.


REP. CHIP ROY (R-TX): I can tell you that I was not going to and I will not be voting to reject the electors. And that vote may well sign my political death warrant but so be it. I swore an oath to uphold the constitution of the United States. And I will not bend its words into contortions for personal political expediency.


HAYES: Down from Mar-a-Lago, President Donald Trump made his choice very clear, of course, can you imagine. It`s not even a choice. He made his choice clear. He endorsed Elise Stefanik. And today, she was elected to replace Congresswoman Liz Cheney holding the number three spot in House Republican leadership.

That`s really the issue here, that vote. That vote to seat the electors, the fidelity of a Republican to those anti-democratic forces, the willingness to throw out an election to seat the loser over the winner. That is the defining feature. That`s the big vote. That`s the litmus test. That`s their version of the Affordable Care Act, nothing else.

And next to that of course is loyalty to a man, an individual, a guy who`s been de-platformed from social media, a one-term, twice-impeached president, who according to recent analysis, was outrun by Republicans in open House races in 2020 by an average of 1.4 percentage points -- meaning, he did worse than them -- and a significantly larger 5.5 percent by Republican incumbents. He was a drag. He ran behind them.

That`s the guy to whom they are swearing their loyalty, their president, the loser, the guy who lost by seven million votes who in a single term watched Republicans lose both the House and the Senate. The guy who has been essentially exiled to Mar-a-Lago whose last job approval rating was 34 percent. That guy controls one of the two major parties in America.

But here`s the thing, again. At some level, that guy is much creation of the weird psychology of the conservative base and its media consumption as anyone else. Donald Trump is a Fox News creation. He started calling into Fox and Friends and next thing you know he`s a Republican nominee. The tail is wagging the dog here.

A recent study by Public Religion Research Institute shows that Republican media consumption is what determines belief system about the legislative legitimacy of the election. Nearly 90 percent of Republicans who got their news from Fox News believe the presidential election was stolen. And if they watched other far-right news sources like Newsmax, nearly 100 percent of them believe the big lie.

Yesterday, Congresswoman Liz Chaney tried desperately to pierce the disinformation bubble that is Fox News.


CHENEY: We all have an obligation, and I would say Fox News especially. Especially Fox News has a particular obligation to make sure people know the election wasn`t stolen.

BRET BAIER, FOX NEWS ANCHOR: And we`ve said that numerous times.

CHENEY: Fox News -- Fox News -- Bret, I`m going to answer your question. Fox News needs to make sure that the American people -- they need to make sure that the American people --

BAIER: No, but if you`re mentioning Fox News, you have to know that this show had said that numerous times.

CHENEY: Bret, you`re doing the interview, I`m answering the question.

BAIER: Congresswoman.

CHENEY: We need to make sure that the American people recognize and understand that the election wasn`t stolen, that we shouldn`t perpetuate the big lie.


HAYES: This show -- this show has said it numerous times. The question of what is conservative right now is a strange one to attempt to answer, right? I mean, it clearly has nothing to do where candidates are on the issues.

Sarah Longwell is the publisher of The Bulwark, executive director of the Republican Accountability Project and Benji Sarlin is a policy editor for NBC News whose latest piece which gets at how the Republican Party`s thinking has fundamentally changed is called "What do Republicans want on the economy, they`re not sure anymore."

Benjy, I want to start with you because to me the kind of -- there`s the -- there`s the kind of psychodrama of Trump`s hold here which we`ll get to in a second. But the total abandonment of any kind of ideological coherence, the sort of like rebuke to the club for growth and the heritage is amazing to watch happen for anyone that has covered Republican politics which has - - which has been gone along on this sort of purity test, RINO kind of sort of vendetta for so long.

BENJY SARLIN, MSNBC POLICY EDITOR: Yes, Chris, this is kind of the less discussed other half of the story of how the party keeps drifting back into Trump`s orbit and the issues that he wants to talk about which are mostly related to his election lost, which is the theory for a lot of Republican leaders probably including Kevin McCarthy after January 6 after Biden took office was, look we don`t need to try to purge Trump from the party because once Biden starts proposing trillions of dollars in spending and proposing major tax increases, these are the issues that have always animated our voters and they`ll get riled up opposing those just like they did in 2009 with Obama and they`ll come back to us. They`ll stop paying attention to Trump.

That`s not what happened. What they`ve underestimated is how Trump`s presidency and the decades preceding it have kind of systematically undermined the old Reagan-era model of conservatism of small governments, of the idea that taxes should be low, on fairness grounds, on efficiency grounds, on fears of inflation.

All of these items have just been systematically undermined. Trump never really talked about these kinds of aspects of conservatism. And Republicans kind of convinced themselves well, his administration mostly follows this philosophy. You know, you`ll usually have someone who`s, you know, very favorably cited by say the Heritage Foundation running his actual policies in his cabinets.

But I think what they meant what they underestimated how many of his own voters have just become disconnected from this kind of thinking that was, you know, really reached its peak in the 80s and 90s and has not been replaced with any coherent alternative.

And so, polls show over and over again there`s just lack of Republican opposition. And even just widespread indifference to what are pretty significant, even generational uh progressive policies that Biden is putting out that you would have expected. You know, even just a few months ago, voters to scream bloody murder over on the right.

HAYES: Sarah, to me the -- so, the contrast between that vote on the tax bill which again, that`s the one big domestic legislative achievement. Like, that`s it. That`s the one big one you got, right? That you`re going to put someone on leadership who is one of the 10 votes against it, right? But that`s not the litmus test vote. The litmus test is seating the electors and Roy was on the wrong side of that. And that to me is scary.

SARAH LONGWELL, PUBLISHER, THE BULWARK: Yes, I mean, what`s interesting to me about what Benjy is saying which is totally true is that these voters, they don`t really care that much about policy anymore. It doesn`t matter if you`re a rock-ribbed conservative like Chip or like Liz Cheney. What matters is how loyal are you to Donald Trump. And it`s because that is where the voters are.

Look, I talk to Republican voters all the time. What they tell me is they don`t really talk about what they`re for, they talk about what they`re against. They`re against the media, they`re against the Democrats. They believe that the election was rigged. They believe that uh what happened on January 6 wasn`t that big a deal, that the media has totally overblown it.

And so, Elise Stefanik, what she`s doing is really going where the voters are. And you`re absolutely right. There`s this toxic relationship between right-wing infotainment media and the voters and the politicians and they`re all in this kind of toxic feedback loop. And that`s where you get them almost living in their own alternate reality.

HAYES: Yes. I mean, I have this saying I use a lot, Benji. I often use about cable news but it`s true here which is that plants grow towards the light and Elise Stefanik is, you know, she`s a plant growing towards the light. Like, she`s over here. She`s got her little like -- she`s thinking, I`m going to be this bipartisan moderate person in this district.

But she -- that`s where -- Donald Trump is the light. That`s where the voters are. That`s where the future the Republican Party is and that`s where she`s going to go.

SARLIN: Yes. And Stefanik, in her case, she`s really talked about this. How she was very influenced by just seeing how energized her own constituents were by Donald Trump in 2016. That was a big influence in her own evolution. You know, a lot of people were surprised when she started drifting towards Trump this way.

But yes, you`re really starting to see the kind of unmooring from policy. And one example, there was a poll by YouGov just this month that found about three-quarters of Republicans who were under age 45 favor more government spending to create jobs and boost the economy even if it means higher taxes.

The numbers were almost perfectly reversed for Republicans over 45. About three-quarters said they prioritize lower taxes at all costs. What you`re seeing is the difference between people who are in Ronald Reagan`s orbit, who have a vision of conservatism that they`ve had a long time, and people in this trump era where it`s just not connected to a coherent economic argument anymore.


SARLIN: Stefanik`s vote on tax cuts is just not relevant to that framework.

HAYES: My favorite detail here, Sarah, is that -- you know, again, these score cards are somewhat arbitrary so, you know, they`re all grain of salt. But they say something and -- the Club for Growth gives Stefanik a lower lifetime rating at 35 percent and they give Ilhan Omar clocking 38 which just says something about like how orthogonal to actual scoring of conservatism whatever the club for growth is doing.

LONGWELL: Yes, well, yes, I don`t know about that. But the only score that matters anymore -- you can throw out all the American conservative union and Heritage Foundation scorecards, they don`t matter anymore. The only grade that matters is if Donald Trump give you an A, do you get his endorsement.

That is you know -- ever since the Republican Party put out their platform in 2020, and it said nothing other than the party stands for Donald Trump, that was when it stopped really mattering where you were on policy and it became all about Trump. Although I`ll say what`s crazy is that you think that after January 6, that would be over, that we`d be done with that. But instead, Donald Trump is actually stronger. His grip on the party is actually firmer.

HAYES: Sarah Longwell, Benjy Sarlin, thank you so much for making time tonight.

LONGWELL: Thank you.

SARLIN: Thanks, Chris.

HAYES: All right, some news. Congressman Matt Gaetz`s home state wing man has agreed to plead guilty to sex trafficking a child. Joel Greenberg claims other men were there and he`s cooperating with authorities. And there is brand new reporting for the Daily Beast that involves matt Gaetz and an escort and a government job. That story in the reporter who broke it next.


HAYES: There is of course a lot of ongoing turmoil in the Republican Party that dominate the news. There is another huge story that just keeps getting worse and worse. And that of course is the story of Republican Congressman Matt Gaetz of Florida.

Today, the Congressman`s former associate, Joel Greenberg, who is facing 33 federal charges, is now pleading guilty. In documents filed, he agreed to plead to six of the 33 charges and they include fraud, identity theft, and sex trafficking of a minor. Details in the plea match reporting we`ve already seen including from the Daily Beast last month said that Greenberg had paid a then 17-year-old $300 over the pay app Venmo and labeled the Venmo as food.

Also some upsetting new details in the plea including "that other men who Greenberg introduced the minor to engage in commercial sex acts with the minor in Greenberg`s presence when the minor was under the age of 18 years old.

In addition to pleading guilty to six charges including the sex trafficking of minor, Greenberg has agreed to, and I quote the agreement here, "cooperate fully with the United States in the investigation and prosecution of other persons."

Remember, the investigation into Joel Greenberg is what led authorities to Congressman Matt Gaetz who is reportedly under investigation by the Department of Justice for the sex trafficking of that same minor. Congressman Gaetz was not implicated by name in the plea deal. He has not been charged with anything and Congressman Gaetz continues to deny any wrongdoing.

With this new plea of a potential key witness, Congressman Gaetz should probably consider keeping his lawyers very, very close by.

Joining me now, political investigations reporter for The Daily Beast, Jose Pagliery, who has a new piece out tonight on the Matt Gaetz investigation. Jose, let`s start first with what`s in the plea and then I want to move to your reporting. The plea details are not great.

I mean, they`re -- you know, this is a minor who was being paid for sex. There`s this part of it too, Greenberg would often supply the minor and others with ecstasy which Greenberg would take himself as well. Oftentimes, Greenberg would offer to pay the minor and others an additional amount of money to take ecstasy.

It seems like there`s a bunch of other people implicated just in the way this is discussed in the plea. What is your take on it?

JOSE PAGLIERY, POLITICAL INVESTIGATIVE REPORTER, "THE DAILY BEAST": Absolutely. And look, let me tell you, reading this plea agreement today, I was happy to see that it squared with all of our reporting so far. And the reporting we`ve done does indicate that there are lots of other people.

Apparently, at these parties, there were lots of power brokers in Central Florida, other politicians present. Sources of course have repeatedly indicated that Matt Gaetz was present there and said that Joel Greenberg was his go-to person for arranging pay for sex encounters.

And so this plea agreement really is the beginning of a difficult road for Matt Gaetz because up until now it really was up in the air whether or not Greenberg was going to absolutely turn on his former friends and colleagues and rat them out. And this says that he`s absolutely going to do it. And some of the reporting that we had today indicates just how far he`s going to go.

HAYES: So, you`re reporting today, can you take me through the story that you just published and what you found.

PAGLIERY: Definitely. Thanks, Chris. So, here`s the thing. We`ve all heard about the parties that Matt Gaetz attended with Joel Greenberg and others. But this is the first time that we are actually identifying Matt Gaetz at a specific place, specific time, with a specific woman and drugs.

And this all relates to a GOP fundraiser in Orlando in October 2019 where multiple sources are telling us that Matt Gaetz after delivering a speech where he was very proud to be the Trumpiest congressman in Congress, retired to his hotel room with his friends and then had a paid escort who had an ongoing transactional relationship with him, prepare lines of cocaine in the bathroom counter where multiple people there did it including the congressman and this escort.

And the witnesses that we`ve spoken to again identified her repeatedly as someone who this congressman had a transactional relationship with. This wasn`t the only night that he was with her.

Now, there`s a second thing that we also identified in the story which is that Greenberg will positively identify this woman as one of more than 15 young women that the congressman paid for sex including those that he paid Joel Greenberg to pay them for sex.

And there`s another reason why we zero in -- zeroed in on this particular person which is that this escort landed a no-show job in Joel Greenberg government office. We`ve talked to financial auditors who`ve taken a look at this, employees at that local tax office who tell us that this person didn`t do work. She landed a contract for anywhere from seven to $17,000 and she didn`t actually do the work that she was paid to do. And so, we`ve got taxpayer funds involved here too.

And let me just put the icing on the cake here. We also, in the course of reporting this, discovered that that hotel stay was a campaign expense for Matt Gaetz, and so donors to him picked up the tab.

HAYES: So, my -- again, this is -- I want to uh stress here that we at NBC have not confirmed this reporting. This is The Daily Beast reporting, that we don`t have this, right? But your reporting, what you were reporting is that there was a fundraiser for Donald Trump in 2018 in Mar-a-Lago -- in Orlando. Gaetz spoken -- I think Johnny Damon was there.

And then afterwards, there was like a just a kind of coke and sex worker party in the hotel that Matt Gaetz was there. You have two witnesses saying doing lines at, and that this -- the sex worker in question or the woman who was paid transactionally for sex was someone who was also given a no- show job at a county tax collection office by Mr. Greenberg?

PAGLIERY: That`s right. And so, like, look, in our reporting, we have talked to dozens of women who are involved in this pay for sex scheme involving these men. And they`ve given us a lot of tips, a lot of background that has helped us zero in on specific people and identify specific instances. And so, this is one that we decided to go ahead and report because it`s so glaring. I mean, we`ve heard the specific details.

And we actually tracked down a third witness who were able to not just place the congressman at the event, but also moving into an elevator with this woman and Joel Greenberg retiring back to their hotel room. And so, we zeroed in on this because of the players but also what they were doing.

HAYES: Yes. It`s all -- it`s all a little overwritten, i got to say. And you know, it also seems to me that should this all be true, it just feels like there`s not going to be a real shortage of witnesses here.


HAYES: This doesn`t seem like -- it has real -- has real open secret vibes to me right now.

PAGLIERY: This was an after-party. We`ve identified at least half a dozen people who were there and saw this take place. And the reason that we decided to break this news and start with this one is that there are lots of other parties like this. There are more young women, more locations, and more actions and bad behavior on the part of Gaetz and Greenberg that we`re going to be exposing. This is just -- this is the start of a long road.

HAYES: It sure seems that way. There`s one detail that I`m going to have you back to talk about. This is called the deep tease. But the whole thing started because there was suspicion that Greenberg was mining Bitcoin on county property. I don`t have time to talk about that now. Just hold that thought, all right. Come back and tell me about that because that really is just a great detail. Thank you so much, Jose Pagliery.

PAGLIERY: I`m happy to do it. Thank you.

HAYES: All right, coming up, Marjorie Taylor Greene`s continued harassment of Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez from her confrontation on the Capitol this week to the newly uncovered video from 2019 taken outside AOC`s office.



UNIDENTIFIED MALE: This is the way you talk to Ocasio right there. This is -- if you want to talk to crazy --

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Yes, you need to go to her level. You`re right.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Yes. If you want to talk to crazy Ocasio, you come to this little thing and you open it up and you whisper into her.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Confession session.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: This is confession.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: This is Ocasio confession right there.

GREENE: Alexandria.


HAYES: The rest of that really, really odd video and AOC`s response next.


CHRIS HAYES, MSNBC HOST: Earlier this week, we learned that Congresswoman Marjorie Taylor Greene of Georgia had aggressively confronted Congresswoman Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez of New York outside the House chamber, yelling and chasing her down the hall.

But turns out it was not the first time that Marjorie Taylor Greene behaved in a menacing way towards Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez, she`s been doing it since before she was a member of Congress.

(INAUDIBLE) KFile got its hands on Facebook live video. It`s since been deleted of Greene visiting the Capitol in February 2019. This is before she was a member of Congress.

In this video, we`re going to play it for you. Greene shows up at AOC`s office along with two men, one of whom would later to go on participate in the January 6th insurrection. And she taunts and menaces the Congresswoman from New York for the mail slot or for office door.



UNIDENTIFIED MALE: If you want to talk to crazy --

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Yes, you need to get down to the level, you`re right.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Yes, if you want to talk to crazy, Ocasio, you come to this little thing and you open it up and you whisper into her.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Confessing session.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: This is confession.

GREENE: So, you need to stop being a baby and stop locking your door and come out and face the American citizens that you serve.

If you want to be a big girl, you need to get rid of your diaper and come out and be able to talk to the American citizens instead of us having to use a flap, a little flap.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: It`s kind of like cruise.


HAYES: What we just played you was an edited version of the video. Marjorie Taylor Greene loiter around AOC`s office for around 10 minutes talking to mail slot and live streaming little time.

Today, Congresswoman Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez was asked about this behavior.


REP. ALEXANDRIA OCASIO-CORTEZ (D-NY): This is a woman that`s deeply unwell and clearly needs some help. I -- you know, I -- and her kind of fixation has lasted for several years now. You know, it`s -- at this point, I think, the depth of that unwellness has raised concerns for other members, as well. And so, you know, I think that this is an assessment that needs to be made by proper professionals.


HAYES: Yes, I mean, I`m not a professional but kind of hard to disagree with AOC here. And it raises a serious question, why hasn`t the head of her party House Minority Leader Kevin McCarthy done anything at all about this?

Well, it turned out the two reporters who covered Capitol Hill, Garrett Haake of NBC News and Olivia Beavers of Politico.

Garrett, I mean, look, I want to give a sense -- we were talking about this last night as well. I mean, that video was from before Marjorie Taylor Greene arrived in Capitol Hill. But it`s in line with basically how she has compared herself as a member of Congress and I don`t -- I don`t think it`s editorializing to say this is deeply abnormal behavior for a member of Congress.

GARRETT HAAKE, NBC NEWS CAPITOL HILL REPORTER: I think that`s a fair characterization, Chris. And look, Marjorie Taylor Greene is someone who made herself known as an internet troll. And that is essentially the way she`s conducting herself here.

This is Twitter trolling one on one, find someone with a larger following than you and pick a fight with them and try to get them to engage with you. And that`s what you saw on that tape. That`s the incident we saw earlier this week, with her trying to get Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez to engage with her on a Green New Deal debate.

And that`s largely how she sees her function in Congress right now. Because remember, she has already been stripped of her committee assignments. She`s now a junior member of the minority party who has a reputation as such that no one on the Democratic side is going to co-sponsor a bill with her or work with her on anything substantive.

And I think this is what she feels like is her contribution to this Congress is to be a troll on these issues and try to draw attention to them.

HAYES: Yes, and Olivia, I mean, as I`ve been watching this unfold, I`ve been thinking I think people have -- I imagine people have had the experience where you`re interacting with a person who maybe there`s some conflict, or you have some beef with in some way, and then they start acting away you`re like, oh, there`s something kind of deeper happening here than than what I thought.

And I feel like that`s the feeling in -- clearly, what AOC is articulating, but also sort of a generally held view among Democrats. And I would imagine some Republicans on the Hill.

OLIVIA BEAVERS, REPORTER, POLITICO: Yes, I mean, talking to Republicans, it`s a big headache. And you know, I was talking to one today trying to unravel why she`s behaving this way. It comes after the House (INAUDIBLE) just ousted Cheney, their most prominent Trump critic and put in Elise Stefanik. They`re trying to project this message of unity. They`re trying to project this message of going after the Biden administration.

And yet, the two headlines you really have right now are Marjorie Taylor Greene confronting AOC and Matt Gaetz, and whatever is happening in that investigation.

But what is interesting is one House Republican that I`ve talked to who is very pro-Trump pointed out that Marjorie Taylor Greene raised about 3.2 million, they`re her first three months in Congress, because she got booted off of her committees.

She -- they think that she`s trying to find ways to keep fundraising and what better way to go after one of the most prominent progressives try to, you know, provoke her into a fight. That`s something that we`ve seen her do with David Hogg, who was a Parkland survivor. We`ve seen her do it with other members and even her own staffer is trying to, I guess, provoke and go after Eric Swalwell about him wearing a mask on the House floor. All of this is not typical behavior.

Usually on Capitol Hill, they either have debates about policy and hearings or on the House floor. But you don`t really see these confrontations like this, and it`s certainly not behavior that I`m used to seeing. Usually, if members don`t like each other, they just ignore one another.

HAYES: Yes, I think, Garrett, your point there, I mean, both of you are sort of pointing towards the same thing here, right, which is that to whatever extent this is like an organic expression of how she actually feels of which I can`t tell you. There are tactical benefits to this, from in term the attention economy, and also the actual money economy. The economy, which is that she`s raising money off it.

And she`s been doing this before. I mean, there was the Cori Bush you know, talked about a masksless Marjorie Taylor Greene, her staff parading her in a hallway, targeted me and others on social media.

And then, she did this -- you know, she did this really -- this thing where she went up to Marie Newman, whose daughter is trans, if I`m not mistaken, and who had put a trans pride flag up and she put, you know, she posted this sign saying the two genders male and female and, you know, record it.

And one of the things that`s striking Garrett, when we go back to that livestream video that since been, you know, deleted is, everyone there is it`s all content. They`re all just making content, like they`re posting for a living. And this is the dystopic vision of our political future, which we are now seeing I think.

HAAKE: Chris, it`s a good living. I mean, the number that Olivia throughout there $3.2 million in a quarter is big money in the House, especially for a freshman. I mean, that is a ton of money to raise. So, in some sense, it`s working for her.

And I should point out, there`s a clear through-line here to Elise Stefanik story too. This is part of what the modern has -- actually, the House GOP looks like now, the point is the fight. It`s not about what you`re fighting about. It`s not whether you win the fight or lose it. The point learned from Donald Trump is let`s pick a fight.

Let`s try to own the libs whether you succeed or fail, it doesn`t matter. The -- you know, relative policy elements of it are immaterial. Having the fight is part of it, and that seems to be a lesson that Marjorie Taylor Greene has learned to her enormous profit.

HAYES: Yes, it`s very grim, very grim dystopic stuff. Garrett Haake and Olivia Beavers, thank you so much. Appreciate it.

All right, tonight, we are one step closer to getting answers about the January 6th attack after bipartisan agreement to launch a 9/11 style Commission into the insurrection, the scope of that investigation.


HAYES: After long negotiations are somewhat surprising announcement today. There is a bipartisan agreement on the Commission to investigate the January 6th attack on the Capitol.

The chairman and ranking member of the Homeland Security Committee, Democrat Bennie Thompson and Republican John Katko introduced a bill that would establish a 10-person Commission to investigate the "Domestic terrorist attack upon the United States Capitol, as well as the influencing factors that fomented such an attack on American representative democracy."

Speaker of the House Nancy Pelosi says the bipartisan bill will be on the House floor as early as next week. Even though Minority Leader Kevin McCarthy says he has not signed off on it. And the multiple members of Republican caucus keep, well, denying the attack even happened.


REP. PAUL GOSAR (R-AZ): My constituents demand answers, but the truth is being censored and covered up as a result of DOJ is harassing peaceful patriots across the country.

REP. JODY HICE (R-GA): It was Trump`s supporters who lost their lives that day, not Trump supporters who were taking the lives of others.

REP. ANDREW CLYDE (R-GA): LET me be clear, there was no insurrection and to call it an insurrection, in my opinion, is a bold-faced lie.


HAYES: Democratic Congressman David Cicilline of Rhode Island is now circling a resolution to center those Republican House members who continue to defend the attack on the Capitol and he joins me now.

Congressman, what would this resolution do?

REP. DAVID CICILLINE (D-RI): Well, Chris, the truth matters. And when you have members of Congress who are repeating falsehood mischaracterizations about the violent and bloody insurrection that occurred on January 6th, it`s very dangerous. It really emboldens others who might consider doing the same thing if it can be explained the way these things are seeing this sort of misinformation is all over the web.

But we now have members of Congress in official proceedings, making statements which completely mischaracterize these events and deny they happened. The January 6th deniers, and we cannot let that go on accounted for.

And so, we have a responsibility to call it out, to condemn it, to acknowledge what really happened, which everyone saw with their own eyes. They don`t have to listen to Republican lies, they saw with their own eyes. It was a bloody attack on the Capitol where five people died. Significant damage was done to the building, dozens more people were injured. They were there chanting Hang Mike Pence, hunting for members of Congress.

And it`s important that members of Congress not be allowed to completely rewrite history and just wish this away. And there has to be -- there has to be accountability for that. There has to be some action taken by the Congress of the United States to not permit members to engage in this kind of mischaracterization and spreading of lies about January 6th, which are very dangerous.

The truth matters, particularly when it comes to defending our democracy and responding to a violent and bloody insurrection against the government of the United States.

HAYES: I was -- I was a bit surprised about the announcement of the bipartisan Commission today. Do you think there`s actual momentum there?

CICILLINE: Yes, I think it`s very good news. Congratulations to Chairman Thompson and Ranking Member Katko for negotiating this. I think most fair- minded people think it`s very important that we understand how this happened, all of the contributing circumstances, and that we ensure that we do everything in our power to be sure it never happens again, to protect the Capitol, the employees of the Capitol, members of Congress, and most importantly, to protect our democracy.

So, I think this is a really important step. And I think the American people deserve to know all of the facts and circumstances that led up to the violent attack on the Capitol of the United States that killed five people, including one police officer, and this Commission will allow that to happen.

HAYES: I want to play this clip of Liz Cheney talking to Jon Karl about what she thinks Kevin McCarthy should have to say to the Commission, take a listen.


JON KARL, ABC NEWS CHIEF WASHINGTON CORRESPONDENT: Should Kevin McCarthy, be willing to speak -- testify before that Commission? After all, he is one of the few people that we know of that was actually talking to Donald Trump while the attack was taking place.

REP. LIZ CHENEY (R-WY): He absolutely should. And I wouldn`t be surprised if he were subpoenaed. I think that he very clearly and said publicly that he`s got information about the president`s state of mind that day, the elements of that Commission are exactly as they should be.


HAYES: What do you think about that?

CICILLINE: Well, I think the Commission has to be empowered to gather up all of the evidence necessary to make findings and complete their report. And I think there`s no question that Kevin McCarthy has information. I`ll obviously leave it to the Commission members to make that determination.

But we presented that evidence during the impeachment trial and Kevin McCarthy was pleading with former President Trump asking him for help. And he first tried to say oh, those were Antifa people and Kevin McCarthy said no, Mr. President, these are your people and the president -- former president said, well, maybe they just cared more about the election than you.

So, I think there`s a lot Kevin McCarthy has to share with any factfinder.

HAYES: Congressman, before I let you go, obviously, you`re serving the U.S. Congress as the U.S. is involved in negotiations, perhaps for some kind of ceasefire in Israel. The violence there are continuing, the IDF continues to strike Gaza, there are rockets that continue to fly towards Israel.

A lot of your colleagues have spoken out saying they think the Biden administration should do more to lean on the Netanyahu government in Israel to stop the airstrikes in Gaza? Do you agree with that or do you think the status quo right now is acceptable?

CICILLINE: No, I think it`s very important that we do all that we can to deescalate the violence and the Palestinian authority in Israel. This is obviously a very, very dangerous moment. We ought to be doing everything we can to protect any further loss of life on both sides of this conflict and do all that we can to bring the parties back to the negotiating table to work toward a two-state solution.

But we need to call for a ceasefire, call for a cessation of hostilities, and hopefully parties will quickly do so.

HAYES: All right, Congressman David Cicilline, thank you so much for joining us.

CICILLINE: My pleasure.

HAYES: Ahead, some of the big questions still unanswered about the new CDC masks guidelines. What it means for instance for parents of kids who aren`t yet vaccine eligible, that`s next.


HAYES: We all know this iconic picture from the end of World War II, right? You`ve seen this before. The moment at a spontaneous celebration on V-J Day in New York City of the kiss, capturing this sense of exuberance. The worst was over, let`s party, we did it.

And I think we all kind of want something like that, I mean, updated for the pandemic. It`s been a bit murkier.

Yesterday`s announcement from the CDC that vaccinated people no longer need to wear masks in most situations could have been that kind of moment. But instead, it left a lot of folks with a lot of questions understandably like, well, how will businesses know who`s vaccinated? And what does this mean for kids?

Here to talk through some of those questions is Dr. Perri Klass professor of journalism and pediatrics in New York University, author of the new book A Good Time to Be Born: How Science and Public Health Gave Children A Future.

Doctor, I`m curious as someone who`s been sort of engaged in public communication on health, your reaction to the CDC`s announcement yesterday.

PERRI KLASS, AUTHOR, "A GOOD TIME TO BE BORN": It reflects good news, it reflects progress in the right direction. But I understand that there`s a lot to sort out for individual families, for individual cities and states and businesses, there`s plenty to think about and discuss and clarify.

But I think it`s important to keep in mind that what it reflects is what you started with the idea that we`re making progress, that we`re going in the right direction, that in many -- in many areas, vaccination is progressing really well, that the vaccines work as well as they do, and that we have some new science to suggest that vaccinated people are not likely to be transmitting the virus.

HAYES: Yes, that -- I mean, before we get into the sort of details, my understanding of this, right, is that the vaccine trials tested for people`s contraction of the virus and the severity, and they did not test as the dependent variable in those trials for transmission.

And then, it took some time to collect data and the CDC guidance was basically based on the fact that look, we had no reason to suspect these folks were transmitting. But now, we have data to show that they are not. That particularly in familial settings with vaccinated families, that they`re not getting transmission and that`s what led to the guidance. Is that your understanding?

KLASS: That we have -- well, I think the guidance is connected, as I said, to a number of things. It`s connected to levels of community transmission and the idea that those are falling. It`s connected to the increasing evidence about how good these vaccines are. And it`s connecting to some new science, looking at asymptomatic infections in fully vaccinated people.

And the vaccines do prevent -- they prevent the severe disease, as you said, they prevent most asymptomatic infections. But asymptomatic infections do occur and the new science is looking at whether people who are fully vaccinated and who get those asymptomatic infections are shedding much virus from the mouth and nose.

And again, that`s new information, and we`re going to need more and we`re going to have to understand it better. But that`s all going into the idea of what fully vaccinated people can do.

HAYES: So, my understanding is you`re a pediatrician by training and you write a lot about children, children`s health. And I think a lot of parents are thinking themselves well, you know, if I have a 9-year-old like I do, or 7-year-old, 3-year-old, they`re not eligible for the vaccine. It`s only 12 and older at this point that might come down.

You know, what to do about children? What to tell them and what -- where and when should they be wearing masks? And what is your guidance for parents seeking out advice on that?

KLASS: Well, first of all, that what you just said it`s only 12 and older, that`s brand new, that it`s 12 and older. That`s just this week that we`ve -- that we can -- up to 15-year-old. So, let`s pause a moment and celebrate and let`s get those children vaccinated.

So, I think we start by saying, when we get all the adults vaccinated, when we get 16 to 18-year-olds vaccinated, and now when we get the 12 to 15- year-olds vaccinated. First of all, that`s huge. And it`s also going to drive down community transmission. It`s going to mean there are many more vaccine people in the community and that`s going to make everybody safer.

But then, the next question you ask is what about your 9-year -old? What about your 7-year-old? And for the time being, those children who eligible for the vaccine, we have to think of as unvaccinated and we have to take precautions with them and for them.

HAYES: Dr. Perri Klass, thank you so much for sharing your advice and expertise tonight. I appreciate it. That is ALL IN on this Friday night. "THE RACHEL MADDOW SHOW" starts right now. Good evening Rachel.