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Transcript: The ReidOut, 9/16

Guests: Anna Eskamani, Cristina Londono Rooney, Tim Ryan, Sheryl Lee Ralph


Florida Governor Ron DeSantis` decision to ship migrants to other parts of the country draws widespread criticism. New reporting reveals how Trump`s team grossly mischaracterized the nature of the documents to the National Archives that he was keeping at Mar-a-Lago. Actress Sheryl Lee Ralph of "Abbott Elementary" discusses her Emmy win. Ohio Congressman Tim Ryan discusses his Senate campaign.


ARI MELBER, MSNBC HOST: To connect with me and get my writing, go to Ari or @AriMelber.

And call this a super tease. Early next week Tuesday night, I`m going to make an announcement here about a new project that can involve all of you, but I don`t have time right now.

So, stay tuned for "THE REIDOUT." Keep watching MSNBC. Keep watching THE BEAT. I will be back Monday.

And "THE REIDOUT" with my friend Joy Reid starts now.



UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: These are human beings who were deprived of basic human rights.

To the people who find themselves -- these wonderful people who find themselves plain wrecked on our island, I have a message for all of them. You are not alone. We have your backs.


REID: The grotesque and cynical politics behind the Florida governor`s migrant stunt. And just like the racist Reverse Freedom Rides of the 1960s, these migrants were lied to every step of the way, so DeSantis could own the libs.

Also tonight, new reporting from "The Washington Post" on how Trump`s team grossly mischaracterized the nature of the documents that he was keeping at Mar-a-Lago when the National Archives first asked for them back.

And what a way to end the week. Fresh from her triumphant victory at the Emmy Awards, actress Sheryl Lee Ralph from "Abbott Elementary" joins me tonight.

But we begin with the Freedom Riders, the group of white and black civil rights activists who rode buses across the South in 1961, with the goal of integrating public transportation and bus terminals. One of the original 13 Freedom Riders was the late great John -- Congressman John Lewis.

It was a bold act of resistance to challenge the nation`s segregation laws and the riders encountered violence, beatings, and jail time. The very first ride was firebombed by a white mob in Alabama. The riots, however, would go on to transform America, setting the stage for the Civil Rights Act of 1964 and the Voting Rights Act of 1965.

Change is often met with resistance, which is why, the next year, white segregationists concocted a viciously racist plan, offering black people one-way tickets to the North or to the West with the promise of a better life. These bus trips were dubbed Reverse Freedom Rides.

Here`s Betty Williams on how her mother was lured onto one of them in 1962.


BETTY WILLIAMS, DAUGHTER OF REVERSE FREEDOM RIDER: My mother was told she was going to have better everything. She was going to have a job and she was going to be able to support her family, and her children was going to be able to get an education, be able to go to school.

That alone was not the truth.


REID: Betty`s mother was Lela Mae Williams of Arkansas.

And those weren`t the only lies that she was told. The segregationists promised Williams a presidential welcome in Hyannis Port, Massachusetts. Here she is. Notice her outfit, the dress, a triple string of pearls, a white hat, the outfit that she changed into because she was told president John F. Kennedy would be greeting her upon arrival.

When she arrived, he wasn`t there. There was no job or housing, nothing. Southern segregationists hatched this plan to be cruel, for certain, but also to retaliate against Northern liberals, whom they believed would be unable to accommodate their new black residents.

It would expose them as hypocrites. This was how owning the libs looked in 1962.


GEORGE SINGELMANN, REVERSE FREEDOM RIDES ORGANIZER: The Northern liberals and the NAACP, Urban League and people like that, especially, they have been crying the sing-song on behalf of the Negro throughout the nation.

And, of course, now when it comes time for them to put up or shut up, they have shut up.


REID: That was George Singelmann, a Reverse Freedom -- Reverse Freedom Rides organizer 60 years ago, but sounding almost exactly like, well, a modern-day Republican, using people, human lives as pawns to make a political and, let`s face it, a racist point, sending people of color fleeing political and economic turmoil to the North to stick it to progressive policies.

Where have we seen that before? Oh, right, in every headline that we have seen for the past two days. In what`s being called an inhumane political stunt, Florida Governor Ron DeSantis sent planeloads of mostly Venezuelan asylum seekers to Martha`s Vineyard on Wednesday.

The migrants came from Texas, landing without warning on the island south of Cape Cod in Massachusetts. Texas and Massachusetts are states that Florida Governor DeSantis does not currently govern, but DeSantis is central to this spectacle, telling the Republican Party`s top donors last weekend that he was considering transporting to places like Martha`s Vineyard.


The plan was met with thunderous applause. Migrants in the group told "The Miami Herald" that they agreed to fly to Massachusetts, on the promise of jobs and assistance, but didn`t realize that they were bound for Martha`s Vineyard.

Three migrants told NPR that a woman named Perla approached them outside of shelter in San Antonio and lured them into boarding a plane, saying that they would be flown to Boston, where they could get expedited work papers. She provided them with food.

And: "Perla offered us help," one person said, help that never arrived."

According to attorneys, no one on the island knew they were coming, leaving locals to scramble to meet their needs. Immigration attorneys are now working around the clock to understand their legal situations.

Here`s what one of them revealed last night.


UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: They were lied to again and again and fraudulently induced to board the planes. They were told there was a surprise present for them and that there would be jobs and housing waiting for them when they arrived.

This was obviously a sadistic lie.


REID: Joining me now is Democratic Florida state Representative Anna Eskamani, Glenn Kirschner, MSNBC legal analyst and a former federal prosecutor, and Cristina Londono Rooney, Telemundo senior Washington correspondent.

And, Cristina I know that you are not on Martha`s Vineyard, but not far away. And I know that you have talked with some of these migrants. So I want to start with -- the part I think that, for me anyway, that is interesting to get to the bottom of is the Texas portion of it.

The people that you spoke with, did their journey originate in Texas? And did they explain to you how they got from Texas to Florida, before being flown to Massachusetts?


Good evening.

They told me that they were in Texas. They were kicked out of a shelter because they started charging them $85 a day. So they got kicked out. And a woman approached them and told them that she would help them out. They moved to a hotel. And one moment to the next, she tells them, get on these buses. I am going to help you out.

This is what they said to me. They were driven to an airport, saw the planes, and were told to get on flights because they were going to be given shelter, they were going to get food, including prepaid credit cards. They were even going to get a surprise on the plane, and they were going to have a chance of starting a new life.

Some of them say that the plane -- the two flights -- it was two flights. They stopped in Florida briefly. Even Florida Governor DeSantis recognized that those flights stopped in Florida, and then they came to Martha`s Vineyard.

REID: And just to be clear, the people that you spoke with, they`re mostly Venezuelan and Colombian. And I have just to clarify you`re in Cape Cod, where the migrants are now. They have been moved to Cape Cod. And that`s where you are.

Had these families presented themselves as asylum seekers in Texas?

LONDONO ROONEY: Yes, they had.

And that`s one of the things that they`re very adamant about. They are angry that they`re being called undocumented immigrants or illegals. They can`t stand the word, because they say, as soon as they got to the United States, they turned themselves into immigration officials. They were given paroles. We saw the documents that they have, so that they`re here in a legal -- fighting for legal status, and they`re trying to do it the right way.

REID: And one more question. Did this woman, who we have just been told the name Perla. Perla is the name that we have been given? Did they mention that this woman showed them any form of I.D. to identify what organization she might have been with?

LONDONO ROONEY: They didn`t mention her name to me. They did not know any organizations. They say that they were gullible. They were vulnerable. They were hungry. They didn`t have money. They`re at the border, and somebody is offering them a flight out. They`re offering them jobs, security, shelter for their children.

So they decided to take the opportunity. They were put in a hotel. They were fed. So they saw these promises coming true. So that`s why they decided to follow her. All of them, not a single one of them told me that they knew they were coming to Massachusetts. Not a single one of them told me that they knew what Martha`s Vineyard was.

They said they couldn`t even locate it on the map and they didn`t even know it existed.

REID: Cristina Londono Rooney, excellent reporting. Thank you very much. Much appreciated.

OK, I want to turn to you, Anna Eskamani. You heard all of that. You are a state representative, a government representative of the state of Florida. What you heard there sounds to me like a story that was about a Texas -- a group of people who presented them cells legally in Texas as immigrants, not as undocumented people, but as asylum seekers, did everything they were supposed to do, and were taken through Florida.


Is there anything in the law that was passed in Florida that allocated $12 million to do these removals that says that Texas asylum seekers may be moved using Florida money? Because $12 million was an allocated for this, and $615,000, per "The Miami Herald," were spent on these flights. That is about $12,300 per migrant.

STATE. REP. ANNA ESKAMANI (D-FL): Well, Joy, first of all, I am filled with righteous anger about this action by Governor Ron DeSantis.

And in the state budget, we fought to remove these dollars that Republicans added in an effort to pursue their anti-immigrant and, candidly, just their political partisan agenda to continuously pivot blame of real problems on the backs of immigrants.

There`s absolutely no reason why Governor Ron DeSantis should be doing this to protect or secure Florida, especially when we`re talking about asylum seekers in a different state.

REID: Right.

ESKAMANI: And so it is unbelievable that Governor Ron DeSantis would do this, but also lure and lie to people in a different state to get into a bus, so he can just pursue his greater political ambitions, to the harm of vulnerable communities, including children.

REID: Let me -- I`m going to play -- Donald Trump had this idea first, just to play this. This is back in 2019. This is what Donald Trump had to say about that he wanted to do.


DONALD TRUMP, FORMER PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: They want more people in their sanctuary cities? Well, we will give them more people. We can give them a lot. We can give them an unlimited supply. And let`s see if they`re so happy. They say, we have open arms. They are always saying they have open arms. Let`s see if they have open arms.


REID: Glenn, that is what Donald Trump wanted to do. He wound up instead basically taking children from their parents, some who were breast-feeding children, and moving them around the country, which was despicable and gross, but, technically, that was in the federal purview.

This is now a state that appears to have extracted migrants from a different state and brought them through Florida, and then used this law -- can you put this law back up? This is two again, downtown Sterling Brown, my director.

That says the -- that this allowed, according to their law, the transport of unauthorized aliens from the state to other parts of the country. These were Texas -- people who were in Texas. Nikki Fried, who`s the agricultural commissioner in the state, has called it human trafficking. How do you see it?

GLENN KIRSCHNER, MSNBC LEGAL ANALYST: Joy, I would call it something even simpler. I would call it kidnapping by inveiglement.

Now, inveiglement is a word that we don`t often hear, but it is a federal crime. It`s 18 United States Code 1201. I never go anywhere without my big ugly blue book of federal laws, the United States Code. And I have got it right here.

And the statute -- the federal statute says: "Whoever unlawfully seizes, confines, inveigles, or kidnap somebody and transports them across state lines is guilty of kidnapping by inveiglement," fancy word.

What does it mean? It means to lure, to lead astray, or to entice by false pretenses or deceitful means. Now, when I heard what Abbott and DeSantis were doing, it sounded like it might violate the kidnapping-by-inveiglement statute.

What sealed the deal for me is when I heard some of these asylum seekers, some of these migrants say, we were promised food, shelter, support for 90 days, English lessons, help filling out work permits, and then they were dropped on Martha`s Vineyard with nothing.

That, to me, is enough evidence, adequate predication to open a criminal investigation into federal kidnapping by inveiglement across state lines.

REID: Let me play what Governor Abbott said, because, first, he sort of certain distanced a little bit, but he`s been doing the same thing. Here`s Governor Abbott of Texas.


GOV. GREG ABBOTT (R-TX): I`m the former attorney general in Texas, as well as a former Texas Supreme Court justice. I know the law very well. And what we have done in the state of Texas is follow the law to the T. to make sure that everything that we have done comports with the federal law.

We receive written authorization by everybody that we transport that they agreed to exactly what we`re doing.


REID: That does not sound -- it doesn`t sound like the Biden administration agrees with, Representative Eskamani, because the Biden administration is now discussing a range of options, potentially litigation, to respond to what these governors are doing. It`s Ducey, DeSantis and Abbott.


But for the state legislature in Florida, was there anything in that bill that authorized $12 million to transport people from Florida who they considered to be unauthorized in Florida, to take them from another state, and then cooperate with that other state to move them, promising gift cards, jobs, food, et cetera, as inducements to get people to agree to get on those flights?

ESKAMANI: Absolutely not.

But I want to add that the bill`s original intent was already disgusting and unnecessary and politically motivated and anti-immigrant. And as a daughter of immigrants, I have to remind my Republican colleagues every single day that we are a nation of immigrants, and we should be welcoming those who are tired, hungry, yearning to be free, especially those from communist governments, which, apparently, my governor is so passionate about freedom, and yet here he is stripping away freedom from those who are seeking asylum from the very government that he supposedly opposes.

And so this is not only breaking federal law, but it`s just blatantly offensive, and it`s something that every American should find unsettling.

REID: And the last question here, Glenn, is to you, because other -- they`re doing -- they have been doing this repeatedly. This was their -- they dropped people off in front of Vice President Kamala Harris` house. They have been doing this repeatedly.

In your view, are these governors -- is this a stunt or is this a potential crime?

KIRSCHNER: It is a stunt.

REID: You laid out the potential crime here.


REID: But who would be the -- who would be the person you would prosecute for this?

KIRSCHNER: Anybody who conspired to engage in this conduct, to deceive people who were here seeking asylum, transport them across state lines, and then not follow through on the promises they made.

Our law books are full of cases...

REID: Yes.

KIRSCHNER: ... that have been affirmed on appeal where there has been kidnapping by inveiglement.

And Abbott brag about his bona fides and his positions all day long, but you know what he doesn`t understand? The Supremacy Clause, because if Texas or Florida passes a law that violates the federal kidnapping statute, guess who wins? The feds.

REID: There we go.

Florida state Representative Anna Eskamani and Glenn Kirschner, thank you both very much.

Up next: new reporting tonight on -- let`s just say it -- the lies that the Trump team told the National Archives about the documents that they stashed at Mar-a-Lago.

Stay with us.



REID: To date, the government has recovered more than 11,000 documents, including more than 300 with classified markings, from Donald Trump since he left office.

While the twice-impeached former president continues to deny any wrongdoing, new reporting tonight from "The Washington Post" shows how the Trump team grossly -- and I do mean grossly -- misinterpreted both the scale and the variety of government documents under -- under ordinary civilian Donald Trump`s control even earlier than we previously knew.

"The Post" reports that the National Archives was told last year that Trump did not possess any classified materials and that he only had 12 boxes filled with news clippings. That`s according to people familiar with the conversations.

"The Post" writes: "During a September 2021 phone call with top archives lawyer Gary Stern, Trump lawyer Pat Philbin in offered reassuring news. Philbin said he had talked with former White House Chief of Staff Mark Meadows, who made the assertion about the dozen boxes of clippings, the people familiar with the call said. Trump`s team was aware of no other materials, Philbin said, relaying information he said he got from Meadows."

As "The Post" points out, this shows that Trump`s former chief of staff was more involved in communications with Archive officials than previously known.

Meanwhile, we are still awaiting a response from the Department of Justice to last night`s ruling by Judge Aileen Cannon denying the agency`s request for access to the classified documents seized at Mar-a-Lago and agreeing with Trump`s legal team to appoint a special master.

It`s expected that the DOJ will appeal the judge`s decision. Now, remember, the rule of law states that no one is above the law. Everyone is to be treated equally under the law and everyone is to be held accountable to the same laws. Well, that`s not what this Trump-appointed judge seemed to say in her ruling, writing -- quote -- "With the principles of equity -- that the principles of equity require the court to consider the specific context at issue, and that consideration is inherently impacted by the position formerly held by plaintiff" -- unquote.

I mean, that sort of does seem to contradict the oath that she took as a judge. And it is just one of several perplexing stances that she took in her ruling. Among them was the claim that there is no identifiable emergency or imminent disclosure of classified information arising from Trump`s retention of the documents that belong to the government.

How could she that, when some of those documents had classified markings dealing with some of this country`s most closely guarded secrets, including human source material, AKA information about foreign nationals inside other countries who are working for us?

This judge has now commanded our foreign intelligence services to wait around for two months before the DOJ can fully investigate what happened with those documents at Mar-a-Lago. What about the 48 empty folders labeled classified? Wouldn`t it be in the interest national security, I don`t know, to be able to investigate what was inside them and where those documents wound up?


Were they handed over? Are they still at Mar-a-Lago? Are they another one of his properties? I mean, this sure sounds like an identifiable emergency to me.

Joining me now, Andrew Weissmann, former FBI general counsel and a senior member of special counsel Robert Mueller`s investigative team.

And, Andrew, I mean, I say this a lot. I`m not a lawyer, but I can read. I mean, this judge is essentially saying, there`s no problem. We can wait until late November. We have national security analysts on this network who are saying people in the national security world are terrified about what could happen between now and November.

We don`t know where this material is. How can a member of the judicial branch command the executive branch to not look at documents it owns?

ANDREW WEISSMANN, MSNBC LEGAL ANALYST: So, Joy, reading her decision yesterday and reading her prior decision, it`s like a greatest hits album.

I mean, it`s hard to know where to begin, because there`s so many things that are so wrong. I personally think the thing you started with about her saying right out loud that she`s going to give former President Trump extra credit and weight here, that violates her oath of office that requires -- I mean, it`s so fundamentally serious.

And then your second point is, this is not something where it`s like, OK, she violated her oath, but there`s no real harm here. I mean, the amount of harm that she just cavalierly throws off is -- I mean, it`s completely shocking.

I have been in the intelligence community. It is beyond belief that she could take the position that she did. And that`s why we`re all sitting here on tenterhooks waiting to see the Department of Justice to appeal. I`m confident that they will, and we will see that at some point today.

REID: A couple questions.

So, question number one, to go back just for a moment, reel back a little bit to the Mark Meadows piece, we now know that Mark Meadows -- the Trump team was representing to the National Archives that all Trump had were 12 boxes of newspaper clippings. We don`t know whether they knew that was a lie or whether they were being misinformed by Trump or et cetera, but that seems really important, right, that they`re not -- they`re not being straight with the National Archives from the very beginning, to the point where, clearly, the National Archives had to keep coming back and coming back, and finally get a subpoena and get a judge to give them a subpoena, to give the FBI a subpoena.

What do you make of that fact, that it doesn`t appear that everybody was being straight from the beginning? Does that indicate to you that maybe Trump wasn`t being straight with Mark Meadows?

WEISSMANN: So, Joy, this is how criminal investigations work.

We`re getting to see it up on the outside. But this is clearly Pat Philbin going, hey, I`m not going to jail over there. So, Pat Philbin, the lawyer...

REID: Right.

WEISSMANN: ... is like, hey, that`s what I was told. And I`m going to tell you exactly what I was told. And I believed it. But don`t look at me. Look at him.

Well, now that hot potato is -- Mark Meadows has it. And he`s -- Mark Meadows is going to have to decide, is he going to own it, or is it going to go to who told him that there were only newspaper clippings? At some point, let`s get real. I mean, we`re not dealing with an absentee landlord.

I mean, this is a micromanager over 18 months, meaning it`s Donald Trump, at the end of the day, who`s going to be holding this hot potato.

REID: Yes.

WEISSMANN: And Mark Meadows is going to have to make a lot of decisions about which side he`s going to be on.

And we used to refer to that in the government as which side of the V do you want to be on? Do you want to be on the United States` side, or do you want to be on the defendant side in the United States vs.?

REID: Easy call. Easy call.

WEISSMANN: Right. Exactly.

REID: This special master, Raymond Dearie, he`s now called for a preliminary conference. And he wants them to appear before him on Tuesday, September 20 -- at least that is soon -- and directing them to submit letters outlining the matters they wish to discuss in the conference close of business Monday.

Give me your level of trust here of this person, Mr. Dearie, that he will expeditiously give the government back control. I still am stunned that a set -- I thought we had co-equal branches of government. I didn`t realize the judiciary could say, you can`t look at your own stuff. Sorry, FBI, no - - I know it`s government stuff. But you can`t look at it.

But, OK, what`s your level of trust in what he`s going to do and also on the 11th Circuit? Because there`s a bunch of Trump judges on there too.


So, the 11th Circuit, let`s leave that to the side for the moment, because the one really good thing and a positive note for the viewers on a Friday afternoon and evening is, we`re really fortunate that Judge Cannon is a chicken and has decided that she`s not going to roll up her sleeves and do her job and is going to subcontract that to Judge Dearie, because, after all, she could have just decided, I will do the review.


I mean, but, instead, she has got another federal judge doing it. This is where -- like, I know Judge Dearie. Lots of people here now Judge Dearie.

Joy, I could tell you could not ask for a better selection.

REID: Yes.

WEISSMANN: He is the epitome of what you want a judge to be. He is smart. He is fair. He has wonderful interpersonal skills, which I think is going to come in really handy in how he deals with Judge Cannon.

And I think he will be very good at making her understand sort of how to behave and sort of why he`s making the decisions he`s making.

REID: Yes.

WEISSMANN: So, from the DOJ perspective, the good news is, they know their backup is, no matter what happens to the 11th Circuit...

REID: Yes.

WEISSMANN: They should be able to prevail there. But Judge Dearie is somebody -- I always just say what you want from a judge is, when you`re right, you will win, and, if you`re wrong, you will lose.

REID: Yes.

WEISSMANN: And that`s all you can really expect. And you will get that from Judge Dearie.

REID: I`m going to take it, because I will take any good news at this point.


REID: Andrew Weissmann, thank you very much. I`m wrapping that up in a bow and taking it home.

Thank you very much. Appreciate you. Have a great weekend.

All right, coming up: Republican Senate candidate J.D. Vance has been awfully quiet on the campaign trail lately. I wonder why? His Democratic opponent, Ohio Congressman Tim Ryan, joins me next.

Stay right there.



REID: Ohio`s J.D. Vance, the Peter Thiel-backed venture capitalist, would like you to think that he`s running for the United States Senate. But I wouldn`t blame you if you can`t really tell.

Vance has sort of vanished on the campaign trail, and, according to reports, doesn`t like to campaign on weekends, which tend to be the best time to campaign. Heck, he`s not even in Ohio. He spent the past two days shaking down Republican donors in Florida. He`s supposed to be back in the state tomorrow.

And you would think it`s maybe because he wants to catch the Ohio State- Toledo football game, which many Ohioans will be watching. But, nah, nah, nah, he seems -- doesn`t seem to care about that either, since he`s scheduled a rally at the same time as the game with the same ex-president he previously called an idiot and America`s Hitler.

Now, if you take a listen to what Vance has said in the past, you will get a better sense of why he might want you to forget about it.


J.D. VANCE (R), OHIO SENATORIAL CANDIDATE: This is one of the great tricks that I think the sexual revolution pulled on the American populace, which is this idea that like, well, OK, these marriages were fundamentally -- they were -- they were maybe even violent, but certainly they were unhappy.

And so getting rid of them and making it easier for people to shift spouses like they change their underwear, that`s going to make people happier in the long term.

There`s something comparable between abortion and slavery, in that, while the people who obviously suffer the most are those subjected to it, I think it has this morally distorting effect on the entire society.

I got to be honest with you. I don`t really care what happens to Ukraine one way or another.

QUESTION: I asked Vance if he thought anti-abortion laws should include exceptions for rape or incest.

VANCE: Look, I think two wrongs don`t make a right.


REID: So, to recap, Vance wants you to forget that he thinks women should stay in violent marriages, and he couldn`t care less about Ukraine, despite Ohio being full of Ukrainian Americans who can vote.

Oh, there`s another thing old J.D. wants you to forget. He told a right- wing podcast that he supports a national ban on abortion, just like Senator Lindsey Graham. Then he added this part -- quote -- "Well, let`s say Roe v. Wade is overruled, Ohio bans abortion in 2022, let`s say 2024. Then, every day, George Soros sends a 747 to Columbus to load up disproportionately black women to get them to go and have abortions in California. Of course, the left will celebrate this as a victory for diversity.

"If that happens, did it some federal response to prevent it from happening? Because it`s really creepy. I`m really sympathetic to that, actually."

Joining me now is Vance`s opponent, the Democratic nominee for the United States Senate from Ohio, Congressman Tim Ryan.

Congressman, I take it you probably don`t agree with the multipronged conspiracy theory involving George Soros. You get a little antisemitism in there, and you get the anti-blackness in there. You get California in there. Do you agree with said conspiracy theory?


REP. TIM RYAN (D-OH), SENATORIAL CANDIDATE: He has a way of wrapping it all together, doesn`t he, Joy?

REID: Yes.

RYAN: I mean, it`s absolutely incredible to think that this guy wants to be in the United States Senate. I mean, generally speaking, you would say, this is a pretty weird guy, pretty -- this is a weirdo. But it`s so dangerous. That`s the problem that we run into today.

This guy is not sitting on some barstool somewhere. This guy is actually running for the United States Senate. He has a bias towards wanting to control. It`s control women primarily whether it`s telling them that, if they`re raped, they have to have the rapist`s baby and that woman who had been raped has to take care of that baby. He thinks that`s a good idea, no exceptions for rape and incest.

You pointed out, if you`re in a violent marriage, and you`re being abused, that you should be -- you should stay in that marriage for family values? I mean, this is so extreme, not to mention that you forgot one -- one big one that we keep talking about here. This guy started a fake charity to help people with opiates and didn`t spend a nickel on anybody.

He brought in a spokesperson for big pharma, Purdue Pharma, that does nothing but blame addicts: It`s not Purdue Pharma. They weren`t pushing the pill mills. It`s the addict`s fault. It`s the people that got hooked.


So, across the board, this guy is dangerous, and you can`t trust him.

REID: Yes. That is the Hillbilly elegy, apparently.

And, yet -- and, I mean, let`s not forget also that Ohio is a state that the abortion issue is extant. This was the place where a 10-year-old rape victim had to leave and go to Indiana to get an abortion because she had been raped.

And yet, and yet, Tim Ryan, the polls have you essentially tied, if you do margin of error. It`s J.D. Vance 47, Tim Ryan 44. That`s the average. That`s the RealClearPolitics average.

To -- yes, Rob Portman, the incumbent, won by like 20 points. So that`s not like a normal Republican spread there. But why do you think he`s still getting support?

RYAN: Well, we`re continuing to make the argument. I have seen a bunch of polls to that have had us up three, five, seven, nine points. So we -- this is neck and neck.

It`s going to come down to the wire, which is -- of course, we`re asking everybody for help and support. Go to and chip in a few bucks for our campaign. I think people are learning more and more about J.D. Vance. And they`re learning that he`s dangerous. He`s funded by two people. He`s funded by a Silicon Valley billionaire, and he`s funded by Mitch McConnell.

So all of the jobs, we have lost, Joy, that you have talked about over the years, as well as I have, he`s being funded by the very people who outsourced these jobs, who sent these jobs to China and made sure that we didn`t have a middle class here in Ohio for such a long period of time.

So that`s who he`s being funded by. That message is starting to stick. We have a lot of Republicans. Former Senator Portman -- Senator Portman`s former chief of staff has endorsed us. Senator Portman`s former legislative director has endorsed us. We have a number of Republicans coming on board.

So I think, over the last 50 days, we`re going to close this deal out and we`re going to win this race.

REID: I still remember -- I remember coming in to Ohio in 2016 and interviewing a bunch of union workers who used to be a solidly Democratic group. And they were -- that man of steel ad that was literally on local -- I watch local news when I get to these states.

And it was on every minute, this man of steel that made Trump sound like the savior of the working man. That worked. How do you win back that union voter that went to Trump?

RYAN: Well, because -- because J.D. Vance has personally invested into companies that have benefited from outsourcing in jobs in China.

J.D. Vance has given up on us. Not only did he leave for California, but he said very directly, if you`re a 55-year-old worker in Dayton, Ohio, you need to just come to grips with the fact that you`re never going to have a good job again.

That`s not the kind of person that runs for the United States Senate and wants to fight for somebody`s future. So he has no connection to the workers here in Ohio. He says he`s not even comfortable in Ohio. He`d rather be drinking wine and eating cheese out in San Francisco and visiting art galleries. These are his words.

So, I`m a scrapper from Ohio. I`m from the Mahoning Valley. I know how to fight. I know how to scrap. This is about our people who have been wrong. They`re white. They`re black. They`re brown. They`re men. They`re women. They`re in manufacturing. They`re in service.

I`m going to go to mat for them. We don`t need another millionaire in the United States Senate that`s funded by billionaires. People are connecting with this message. They know I`m about Ohio. They know I`m about the future of Ohio. I want to lift everybody up.

The more they hear about that, the more they learn about me, the more certain we are that we`re going to win this race. And he`s probably going to end up moving back to California and drinking wine and eating cheese.


REID: And crudites, apparently. That`s a thing among these guys that are running on the other side.

RYAN: That`s a thing for them. That`s a thing. You`re right.

REID: They love the crudites.

Ohio Congressman Tim Ryan, who I doubt will be having crudites this weekend, thank you very much. I appreciate you.

"Who Won the Week?" is still ahead.

But, first, I`m going to be getting my fangirl on with Emmy Award winning "Dreamgirl" Sheryl Lee Ralph.There she is.

Hey, Sheryl. Hang on while we pay for all these lights and cameras.

We will be right back.



REID: At this week`s prime-time Emmy Awards, one moment stood out as the moment.





REID: Yes, that was the amazing, incredible Sheryl Lee Ralph winning her first Emmy on her very first nomination for her role as kindergarten teacher Barbara Howard on the great series "Abbott Elementary."

It`s just a small acknowledgement of her unbelievable career as a screen actress since the 1970s and as a Broadway legend since the 1980s, famously originating the role of Deena Jones in the original Broadway production of "Dreamgirls."


And Sheryl Lee Ralph joins me now.

I`m so excited. I have to say I don`t know if I`m more excited or my executive producer and my senior producer, who are just giddy, giddy, giddy over you being on, are more excited. We`re all competing to be the most excited.

Hello, soror, and congratulations.


SHERYL LEE RALPH, ACTRESS: Hello, soror. And thank you so much.

REID: I am excited.

So, for those, the 12 people out there who are not caught up on how fabulous you are, I`m going to just play a quick little scan, a quick scan through your incredible career.

RALPH: Oh, my.


SIDNEY POITIER, ACTOR: A job is like a ball team. You don`t have to like everybody you play with, but you play with them.


RALPH: When a woman gets up at dawn, runs down to the 7/Eleven, plows through eight guys with squeegees yelling, "Yo, baby, can you help a brother out?"...


RALPH: ... honey, breakfast isn`t half-bad. It is the bomb.



REID: I mean, we could have gotten on into the whole hour of that.

I mean, but -- and I have to ask you. You have done so many incredible roles. What has been your very favorite role to play?

RALPH: It has nothing to do with show business. It would be mother to my two children. Second favorite role will be being wife. But that`s the way I looked at it.

REID: Yes. Yes.

And how do you approach just the craft of acting and embodying all of these different women? Like, what is your approach? Is -- do you do, like, the method act of trying to really become this other person? Like, what`s your -- what is your strategery?

RALPH: I have to tell you, for me, it is very simple.When it is on the page and the connection is right between the characters and myself, they literally come alive. They literally come off of the page and in, into me, the vessel, as, I`m just going to give them life.

REID: Yes.

RALPH: And it is as simple as that for me. When it`s right, I don`t have to work at it. I don`t have to make it happen. When it`s right, it is right and it`s just there.

REID: Yes.

RALPH: When I think about "Designing women," and when I played the character Etienne Toussaint Bouvier...

REID: Yes.

RALPH: ... Etienne came to me, and that was her voice. And she was just so much love and light and from the South.

And then when, I played the president of the United States, that was a completely different woman. She didn`t smile very much, and she was always about getting the job done.

And then there was just Deena Jones, who was basically your musical cheerleader with a velvet hammer...

REID: Yes.

RALPH: ... and the voice to match.

So, it`s -- they literally just come alive themselves.

REID: Yes.

Well, the character that you`re playing now, I want to play a little clip. Let me play a very quick clip from "Abbott Elementary," which is the role that won you this incredible award. Take a look.


UNIDENTIFIED ACTOR: We need to just make sure that this is an isolated incident.


RALPH: Sweet baby Jesus and the grown one too. My desks have been desked.


RALPH: Mm-hmm.

UNIDENTIFIED ACTOR: Oh, this is bad.

UNIDENTIFIED ACTOR: Their fault. They went on a desking promotional tour.


REID: There was a moment at the Emmys that I think were not as great, the Quinta Brunson moment, which there was an apology from Jimmy Kimmel for.

But your moment was transcendent. What were you thinking when you got up there and you did that incredible song? Was it spontaneous? Tell me what you were thinking in that moment.

RALPH: It was as if my whole career just came right across me and around me, and I was standing there with some of the best of my peers.

And I was just like, this is the moment. This is your shot right here. Say what you want to say and put your voice where it belongs. And that was it. That was it. Simple.

REID: Yes. Well, you did it. You did it.

Well, stick around, everybody, because this is going to be fun. Sheryl is going to stick around and to help me kick off the weekend with "Who Won the Week?"

You guys are sticking around too? We will be right back in a sec.



REID: All right, everybody, TGIF. We made it to the end of another busy week, which means it is time to play our favorite game, ah, yes, "Who Won the Week?"

Back with me is the great Sheryl Lee Ralph.

Sheryl Lee Ralph, who won the week?

RALPH: You know something?

I walk the red carpet a lot. And I walk it with my husband. But he won the week this week, because he got to the carpet and they said, Senator Hughes, can we get a solo shot?


RALPH: Well, well, well. And there you have it.

REID: Yes. Yes, he did.

RALPH: So, in terms of that, Senator Vincent Hughes won the week.


REID: I love that. That was a wonderful answer. But my husband, I`m going to let him watch that, because then he`s going to be on the next red carpet and he`s going to be going, hold on a second.


REID: OK, who I believe won the week, with -- especially with all the people who are so mad about the black Little Mermaid, I say black actresses won the week.

Sheryl Lee Ralph, you, incredible, Quinta Brunson, Lizzo, Zendaya, Halle Bailey, all of the great black actresses who are out there doing the damn thing won the week.

Sheryl Lee Ralph, thank you very much.

And that is tonight`s REIDOUT, everybody.

Thank you very much, Sheryl Lee Ralph. I love you and appreciate you.

And that`s it. "ALL IN WITH CHRIS HAYES" starts now.