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Breonna Taylor TRANSCRIPT: 6/10/20, All In w/ Chris Hayes

Guests: Ashish Jha, Stephanie Innes, Stacey Abrams, Heather McGhee, David Cicilline


CHRIS HAYES, MSNBC HOST: Tonight on ALL IN. NASCAR bans the Confederate flag and the president defends the Confederacy. It`s America 2020. The Coronavirus still raging, 21 states now seeing a surge in cases, and Trump`s own task force raising new alarms. Dr. Ashish Jha on the pandemic that hasn`t gone anywhere.

Plus, Stacey Abrams is here on Georgia spectacular voting failure and what Americans should be worried about in November. And Heather McGee on the seismic shift and America`s views on racism when ALL IN starts right now.


HAYES: Good evening from New York. I`m Chris Hayes. The Coronavirus has not gone, and worse than that, in some places, it looks to be roaring back. Now, things have gotten much better in places like New York and New Jersey, among others, but in many other states, things have gotten much worse. And you wouldn`t know that if you listen to the White House.

I mean, Donald Trump does not like any bad news. He doesn`t like to confront reality, which is why he chose the cases with just across two million, we`re going down to zero. And crucially and perhaps more importantly, Donald Trump just has a painfully short attention span.

We`ve talked about the fact that the President just abandons any pretense of caring about the spread of the virus of the tens of thousands over 100,000 deaths. He got bored a month ago when he could no longer use coronavirus briefings as kind of political rallies. And just as he does with most things, he just slid it on to the next thing. You see it in everything he does.

Just today, amidst all of the unrest, crisis, he was complaining Fox News cut away from a congressional hearing he was watching at 11:00 a.m. on a weekday. This afternoon, he tweeted, "Together a truly bizarre argument against renaming military bases that are named for Confederate generals highlighting the history of winning, victory, and freedom, all attributes typically not associated with the Confederacy."

Donald Trump has the attention span of a fruit fly. But the thing about it is the virus is still there. It`s not gone. There is still a pandemic to manage and things are getting worse in parts of the country and nobody at the Federal level appears to be managing it.

Remember Dr. Anthony Fauci the character in the first season they just kind of got rid of? Yesterday, he popped up to say, hey, it isn`t over.


ANTHONY FAUCI, DIRECTOR, NATIONAL INSTITUTE OF ALLERGY AND INFECTIOUS DISEASES: Now, we have something that indeed turns out to be my worst nightmare. If you just think about it, In a period of four months, it has devastated the world, like, oh my goodness, when is it going to end? It really is very complicated. So we`re just at almost the beginning of really understanding --


HAYES: We are almost the beginning of really understand the virus. Meanwhile, the CDC, Centers for Disease Control, one of the most august, revered bodies of disease-fighting in the entire world, is just totally absent as far as we could tell at this time of need.

Earlier today, I had to stop and think very hard, concentrate even to remember the name of the man who`s supposedly in charge. His name is Robert Redfield. When was the last time we saw him, heard from him?

Now, NBC News reports the White House Coronavirus Task Force continues to fade as a second wave of the virus is emerging. "In recent weeks, the group has met formally just three times. Its members have begun drafting a final after-action report -- After action, as if the action is over -- highlighting the President`s response is expected to be completed in the coming weeks."

The job is not done. The action isn`t finished. There is no after because the pandemic has not gone. New cases are skyrocketing in Arizona after the state reopened without a pattern of declining cases and without falling the White House`s own CDC recommendations.

Arizona`s former health director who was on this show last night warn the state could need a new stay at home order less than a month after reopening. But Arizona is not the only state where the pandemic is still raging.

This is what new cases look like in Texas. The Washington Post reports "the state has seen a 36 percent increase in new cases since Memorial Day with a record -- and this is key because this takes out the testing question, right, a record 2,056 current hospitalizations as of early Tuesday afternoon.

It`s actually the largest spike in the country. Right behind it, though, is North Carolina with the news case trajectory looks like this. This right here is the day where the state relaxed its stay at home order and it did not look like a great idea even then.

Today, North Carolina again had a record-high Coronavirus hospitalization with more than 1,000 new cases. And as Dr. Anthony Fauci referred, there is still so much we don`t know about how the virus behaves. There`s so much we`re learning. We know it is highly contagious, but certain situations that seem doomed for disaster have also turned out OK.

Think of this. We all saw this footage, right, of people crowded into the swimming pool in Lake of the Ozarks in Missouri. And that seemed like a recipe for disaster, especially after it was confirmed at least one infected person was there. But somehow there appear to be no new confirmed cases from the Lake of the Ozarks crowds, which is deep breath. That`s good.

In Springfield, Missouri to hairstylist at a hair salon tested positive for the virus exposing nearly 140 people to it. But none of the 46 people who took test tested positive. And it is possible that it is because the salon, to its credit, require people to wear masks and use other preventative measures such as separating salon chairs and staggering appointments.

This is key. In fact, a new study from the U.K. says that widespread mask- wearing could be a huge part of the answer. "The study found that if people wear masks, wherever they are in public, it is twice as effective at reducing the R value, that`s the average number of people that one person will pass the virus on to, than if masks were only worn after symptoms appear."

If everyone wears a mask, fewer people will get the disease. That appears to be increasingly the case, right? Grounded in the sciences as we`ve learned it, and it just seems really simple. And it`s why it is so crazy, counterproductive, insane, cruel to make wearing masks a cultural war wedge issue.

We should not see these images on the streets of New York. city where the protesters basically all have mass and none of the cops do. Why? The President of the United States should not be mocking reporters for wearing face masks and making fun of Joe Biden for wearing one.

Because not only is the president given up on helping the Coronavirus, he checked out a long time ago. He`s actively making it worse. We`re staring down the first real post-lockdown outbreak right now. Not only is the president completely ignored the virus, he`s discouraging people from taking the concrete steps to protect themselves and the people around them.

And then just tonight, Trump`s reelection campaign announced they`re restarting rallies in states like, get this, Oklahoma, OK, Florida, Texas, and Arizona, which has an outbreak that looks to be spiraling out of control, as well as an event in North Carolina at an appropriate time. States that are not doing so well as it relates to the virus.

But here`s the thing, this is the -- this is the new normal. This is the new normal in terms of virus and in terms of administration we have. We live in a world in which outbreaks are going to happen. We need to ask ourselves how are we going to deal with them.

Here with me now, one of the best-informed people I know about the Coronavirus and what it`s doing around the country, Dr. Ashish Jha, professor of global health, and the director of the Harvard Global Health Institute. And Dr. Jha, I want to start with something you said I think earlier today, your institute in terms of estimates that the modeling that you`re working on suggests we might have 200,000 total deaths, another 90,000 or so deaths by the end of the summer in the U.S., is that correct?

ASHISH JHA, DIRECTOR, HARVARD GLOBAL HEALTH INSTITUTE: Yes. So the best estimates out there, Chris, are that we`re going to hit 200,000, sometime during the month of September. And if you think about where we are, 800 to 1,000 people are dying every single day. That`s about 25 to 30,000 a month. Go out three months and you understand why during September, we will cross that 200,000 mark, and the pandemic won`t even be done by then.

It is unbelievable to me that we have just immune become immune to this level of suffering and have just come to accept it as a reality when it doesn`t have to be.

HAYES: Well, I think part of that though -- I mean, part of it is that when you look at the national data and aggregate it look -- it looks like we`re moving in the right direction. Because so much of the, of the hospitalizations and infections and deaths were driven by the New York metro area particularly, which has spiked and really come down quite rapidly, it can be confusing.

But what do you -- what goes through your mind when you look at Texas and Arizona, particularly Arizona, because that the spike in Arizona looks real bad to me?

JHA: Yes, it looks like exponential growth. And it looks like the kind of thing that if you don`t jump on it very quickly and aggressively, at some point, you`re going to be forced with only one option, which is stay at home, shut the economy down.

So it`s a very scary picture, and that`s what we were able to avoid for the country. But now we`re going to start seeing individual states confronting it, and they`re going to have to ask themselves, do they have an appetite for shutting down again.

HAYES: Well, that to me is a really important question because my understanding of this there`s a sort of containment and there`s mitigation. Containment means you have a small enough number of cases and a capacity enough to test and trace that you can kind of play whack a mole with people that are getting the virus. You can get them quarantined. You can try to keep them away from people.

When the numbers get big enough, which is what the -- what happened in the U.S., in New York, in many countries is you just can`t contain it. You just have to mitigate, which means shut things down. That emergency brake lever doesn`t seem an available political option in these places.

JHA: Yes. And we don`t want to get to a point where that becomes the only option, right? But what happens -- what happens is if the hospitals get overwhelmed, if doctors and nurses start getting sick, if large numbers of people start dying, then that becomes a political option again, right? But who wants to get there? Why do we want that as our strategy?

HAYES: Right. I have to say the one -- the silver lining I keep coming back to as I walk around with my mask, which I don`t like personally, but I wear it all the time is that it does really seem increasingly masks really can be a key here. I mean, when you look at the experience that Japan has had, particularly and Hong Kong and Taiwan and other places where mask wearing is almost ubiquitous, that maybe we -- if we all wear masks, we really can do a lot. By just putting this stupid thing on our faces, we could -- we could have a tremendous effect.

JHA: Yes. You know, the evidence on this has really been changing and it`s getting stronger and better day by day. And what I say to people -- you know, people bring up this issue of, you know, freedom. And I`m like, you know what gives you freedom to go out and get back to life and not get sick and die? Wearing a mask, maintaining social distancing, having testing, and wearing a mask.

And it`s striking to me that we`ve seen freedom as the freedom not to wear a mask, not freedom to get our lives back. And that`s part of what I think mask gets you.

HAYES: We should say that this study says that we could -- we could be looking at reducing infections by, you know, getting our beneath won, right, which is the key if you just have 50 percent of people wearing masks.

I guess the last question for you is about the President`s rallies. Obviously, we`ve seen huge protests across the country. A lot of mask- wearing, but not always. It`s outdoors as opposed to indoors, but people are pretty packed together. There`s lots of concern about what that means. What do you think about a big indoor rally, particularly if it is the case that not wearing a mask becomes a kind of performance of one`s political identity?

JHA: Yes. So you know, in terms of the protests, while I support the protesters and what they`re protesting, I`ve been worried. But they do have the advantage of most people wearing masks, it`s outside. And I think being outside is probably also a really big benefit. Large indoor rallies without masks, like, I just feel like they`re asking for more outbreaks and really big ones. And I don`t know why the President would subject his own supporters to this.

HAYES: Yes, it`s madness. I guess there`s some option. I know they have done outdoor rallies in the past. So outdoor rallies with masks is way better than indoor rallies without masks if you`re going to have rallies, but we`ll see whether they actually do that. Dr. Ashish Jha, thank you for making the time.

JHA: Thanks, Chris.

HAYES: Of all the states facing spikes, this chart from Arizona tells quite a story. The curve there was never really flattened. In the past two weeks or so, Arizona`s daily tally of new cases spikes so high the state sent hospitals a letter urging them to activate emergency plans.

Joining me now is someone who has been doing great reporting and following the situation in Arizona, Stephanie Innes. She`s a healthcare reporter for The Arizona Republic. First, just give us a snapshot from where you stand of what the discussion is in the state right now about what is happening with the virus in Arizona?

STEPHANIE INNES, HEALTH CARE REPORTER, ARIZONA REPUBLIC: Well, I think first of all, my colleagues and I first started noticing spike a couple of weeks ago. And we`ve been trying to get the state to say that there is an increased community spread. We`ve been able to get some experts to say that. So far, the Arizona Department of Health Services has not actually said that. They`ve been telling people not to panic, but to practice social distancing and other measures.

However, the state`s largest health system has started to take a lead in this role. They held a press conference on Friday and said, you know, some of these numbers are really concerning and people need to wear masks and do not get complacent about social distancing.

HAYES: That`s interesting. So you`re talking about -- there`s the public health apparatus for the state of Arizona, and then there`s a private hospital system, right. I mean, our health providing system. And it`s the latter that has sort of called the press conference to say we`re worried?

INNES: They did. And also, the Maricopa County Department of Health also called a press conference. They both did that the day after Governor Ducey and our state health department had a press conference, which I think that Banner Health and Maricopa County didn`t feel answered all the questions that they had and all the messaging that they wanted to get out.

HAYES: One of the things we`ve seen, it happened in China, it happened in the U.S., it happened in New York to a certain extent, and it`s happened in a lot of places is political leaders want it to not be the case that there`s an outbreak. They send the message sort of down the chain, that it`s not that bad, it`s going to be fine until it`s too late. We`ve seen this replay over and over.

I mean, I guess what`s the tenor of the message from the governor, and the folks in sort of political leadership about where this state is at? Is it don`t worry, this isn`t -- this is under control?

INNES: Yes, that`s the message that I`m hearing from the state health department. And I know Ruben Gallego, who`s one of our congressmen, he just sent a letter to Governor Ducey saying, look, you`ve got to -- you`ve got to have more leadership on this. You`ve got to tell people what`s going on because we don`t feel like we`re getting enough direction.

And he pointed out some of the numbers from recent days, which you know, today we had 1,500 new cases, which was the second-highest daily new cases that were reported. So there is some of that going on. I mean, this was the first letter I`ve seen, but I get the sense from the state, they`re saying you know, don`t panic. And even the letter that Dr. Chris, our state health director sent on Saturday, they said to me, well, that was really a reiteration of what we sent in March and we weren`t sending it from a position of panic.

HAYES: So, just to be clear on the data here, because there`s some states where testing capacity has increased tremendously, and Texas for a while has sort of said, look, we`re testing a lot more. That`s why you`re seeing more cases. Arizona has a bunch of metrics, not just new cases, but the positivity rate, hospitalizations. I mean, all the numbers appear to line up to show that there is -- there`s an outbreak happening.

INNES: Sure. And when you see increase positive cases, that could be due to the fact that we`re doing a lot more testing. It was really hard to get a test in Arizona at the beginning as it was in many parts of the country. But a lot of the indicators we`re seeing are not just because of increased testing.

When you have -- you`re reaching record levels of people in the hospital for suspected and confirmed COVID, that`s not due to increase testing. When you`re seeing increases in the percent of positive cases, that really -- that trench should be going down. It should not be going up regardless of how much testing you`re doing.

HAYES: Final question, I guess, you know, you talked about Banner Health which is a private health care provider sort of sounding the alarm. I mean, how much are you hearing alarm or worry from hospitals protect, particularly ICUs, things like that medical providers?

INNES: Well, Banner Health has really been a leader on that. They`ve been very candid with the press anyway, telling us what their capacities are. They actually reached capacity on ECMO on Saturday, which is the external lung machine. And it`s really helping us as the press try to tell the public what`s going on. So that`s been really helpful that they`re doing that.

HAYES: Yes, that`s interesting. Private data, a sort of bedrock here of trying to get our hands around the shape of the epidemic. Stephanie Innes who`s been doing fantastic work along with our colleagues, thank you very much for making time for us.

INNES: Thanks for having me.

HAYES: Up next, Stacey Abrams on the election night catastrophe in Georgia, what it pertains for November and what can be done about it right after this.


HAYES: This morning, the day after Georgia`s statewide election which had been delayed, they had some time to prepare for it, this was the front page of the Atlanta Journal-Constitution, "Complete Meltdown." Voting machines were not working, polling places opened up late, people waited in line for up to seven hours to vote. Some voters just gave up and went home, one could hardly blame them.

At one point a dry erase board in the Secretary of State`s office showed 20 separate counties in Georgia where judges had to step in to extend voting hours because the lines were so long. LaTosha Brown, the co-founder of Black Voters Matter was in Union City, Georgia and tweeted that the last voter walked out at 12:37 a.m. Then they call the police on us but we told them we were not leaving until everyone voted.

Voting delays were so bad yesterday in parts of Atlanta, particularly in predominantly African American precincts that people on line were organizing themselves.


UNIDENTIFIED MALE: They said that they`ve escalated this particular issue to the Secretary of State`s office, but we know how that goes. So what we need you to do in the meantime, because this is what we got voter suppression, we need you out to call Election Protection Hotline. You may get a voicemail when you call. Please leave a message.


HAYES: Georgia`s Republican Governor Brian Kemp has so far stayed silent on the recent problems with voting according to the Associated Press. The Secretary of State for the state put the blame for yesterday`s issues on local officials. Even though Georgia under the previous Secretary of State, a guy by the name of Brian Kemp who`s now the governor, has been notorious for making it more difficult to vote, so much so it`s led to multiple lawsuits.

In fact, the organization that sued the state was founded by someone who ran against Kemp for governor in 2018, Stacey Abrams, the founder of Fair Fight Action, author of the new book, Our Time is Now: Power Purpose on a Fight for Fair America. And Stacey Abrams joins me now.

It`s great to have you and I thought maybe we`d start with your own story. I saw that you had your own story of voting and the difficulties of it yesterday. Can you tell us what happened to you?

STACEY ABRAMS, FORMER GUBERNATORIAL CANDIDATE, GEORGIA: Absolutely. So because of the pandemic, because we were encouraging people to vote by mail because that was the safest way to vote not only for the voter but also for voters who didn`t have a choice, I attempted to vote by mail. I eventually got my ballot. I filled it out. And when I got ready to put it in the return envelope, it was sealed shut.

I then attempted to steam it open because I`ve watched too many mystery shows. It did not work. And so yesterday I went to stand in line with fellow Georgians to cast my ballot.

HAYES: This is -- there`s been -- it`s been remarkable Kemp has not said anything about this. And the line from the Secretary of State has been this was on the -- this was on the various precincts, it was on the counties, they all screwed this up. I want to read you a quote from someone named Gabriel Sterling, who is the statewide voting implementation manager who said the following.

"We have reports of poll workers not understanding setup or how to operate voting equipment. While these are unfortunate, they are not issues of the equipment but a function of counties engaging in poor planning, limited training, and failures of leadership." What do you think about that?

ABRAMS: That he misunderstands or deliberately is indifferent to the needs of voters. The Secretary of State decided to purchase $107 million worth of new equipment. He was responsible for the implementation of these changes. In fact, he used $400,000 that was allocated by the federal government to help with the implementation of elections. And he used it to do an advertisement about how good he was because he got these machines.

The Constitution of Georgia puts the responsibility for the administration of elections on the Secretary of State. The counties are the local instruments, but the Secretary of State is responsible. And even the challenge of implementing new equipment isn`t new. In 2002, Democrat Kathy Cox had the same responsibility. She provided staffing, training, mailed instructions to every single voter, had emergency standby, had 100 extra Secretary of State staffers ready to help.

None of those things were available and instead, what we saw were inoperable machines, miscommunication, failed training, and failed direction all of which lies squarely at the feet of the Secretary of State.

HAYES: There`s a question here about incompetence versus malice, obviously. And there`s a long history here both in Georgia in recent memory going back to a very, very long time back to reconstruction. The Brennan Center has studied this issue. It shows that long wait times disproportionately affect black and Latino voters.

Latino voters wait on an average 46 percent longer than white voters. Black voters wait on average 45 percent longer than white voters. And Jamal Bouie a New York Times columnist put it this way I thought succinctly, "An election where people are waiting for seven or eight hours to cast a ballot is not a free and fair election." Do you agree with that?

ABRAMS: Absolutely. We know that in the state of Georgia, you do not have the right to pay when you are voting. They have to let you go and vote but you do not have the right to be paid, which means people sacrifice a day`s wage to try to cast the vote. And these are largely communities that are working class, working poor. They`re not making a lot to begin with. And to simply cast a ballot, they have to sacrifice their -- it`s a poll tax.

But we know even more that -- I mean, you raise the question of incompetence versus malice. In Georgia, it`s both. There`s a malfeasance that is permeating the entirety of our voting system and it`s exacerbated by the incompetence of the leadership that refuses to number one, do its job and two, doesn`t seem to understand what the job is.

That`s what we face in Georgia. But let`s be clear, this didn`t just happen in Georgia. It also happens in South Carolina and Nevada, to a lesser extent, and certainly without the clownish behavior of the Secretary of State. But across the country, we are seeing this combination of incompetence and malfeasance putting voters of color at risk of not being heard in our democracy.

HAYES: There`s also been -- Iowa, I think the Iowa State Senate Republicans today wanted to block the Iowa Secretary of State, the Republican, from mailing out absentee ballots to all the voters, something that`s happened under the Republican Secretary of State in Ohio and the Democratic Secretary of State of Michigan. It`s not a partisan issue.

What do you make of this increasingly partisan attack on vote by mail particularly -- I mean, right now, we -- our first block of the show was the pandemic hasn`t gone anywhere, and we`re not in cold and flu season, and we`re not in the fall when people expect to be worse.

ABRAMS: We know that it`s going to be worse. We know that people want to be heard. We are in the midst of a public health crisis, an economic collapse, a deep distrust of our justice system, and we have a voting system that Republicans are doing their level best to make as unusable as possible.

Republicans have been fighting across this country to fight back against expansion or at least access to voting rights. But we also know that Republican leaders know better. They use absentee ballots. They know that vote by mail works. They are not concerned about fraud with vote by mail. They`re concerned about participation.

And the reason we see people pushing back Is that in the state of Iowa, there is a real strong likelihood that Democrats are going to outperform Republicans, and so this is the best way to constrain their participation. What we saw happened in Georgia was that more Democrats voted in this election than had voted in previous primaries, including in 2016.

HAYES: Interesting.

ABRAMS: And this record turnout looks different, looks like disaster for them. And so they`re going to do their level best to limit who can actually have a voice in our election.

HAYES: Well, you raise -- you raise -- the turnout yesterday was very high because Georgia has a very strange situation this year. It has two contested Senate seats, it had two contested Senate primaries yesterday along with the presidential primary which have been delayed.

And when people talk about -- I mean, there`s polling right now showing the President and Joe Biden essentially tied in Georgia or around there that is within striking distance, Election Day in Georgia is going to be bonkers just at a turnout level, two Senate seats and also the presidential. You got to imagine that any competent administrator would have to be planning for an enormous turnout in November.

ABRAMS: Which is why it`s so dangerous that Brad Raffensperger is denying responsibility. The resources for scaling up our elections, both in Georgia and around the country, will have to come from the Heroes Act, it will have to come from the federal government. But if the Secretary of State is not intending to use those resources to help the local officials actually meet the moment, then we know that our elections are going to collapse. And we have seen what voter suppression can do in Georgia.

And I know that the turnout in this upcoming election is going to dwarf the record turnout that we had in 2018. In 2018, we have the single largest turnout of Democratic voters in Georgia history. That number is going to be much higher in 2020 because recovery from the pandemic, recovery from the systemic injustices that we saw that took the life of Ahmaud Arbery, that took the life of George Floyd, and Breonna Taylor.

Those issues are going to be on the ballot and people know that if we don`t solve this problem and this election, we do not have a future for many people in this country.

HAYES: Stacey Abrams whose new book again is called Our Time is Now, thank you so much for taking some time tonight.

ABRAMS:  Thank you for having me.

HAYES:  Coming up, as George Floyd`s brother testified before congress today, there were growing calls for action in another police involved death. Tonight, a pretty stunning development in the killing of Breonna Taylor. That`s next.


HAYES:  Today, police in Louisville, Kentucky finally released an incident report from the fatal shooting of 26-year-old Breonna Taylor way back on March 13. It`s a four-page report. It is almost completely blank, and it lists Taylor`s injuries as none despite the fact she was shot at least eight times by police.

Justice for Breonna Taylor has become a rallying cry for protesters around the country as the nation grapples with the aftermath of three high profile killings of African-Americans in recent months, one by vigilantes in Georgia -- Ahmaud Arbery, one by police in Minneapolis -- George Floyd, both of which were captured on tape; and one that was not captured on tape, and that`s Breonna Taylor in Louisville.

The facts surrounding her death appear to be every bit as outrageous as the ones we`ve seen on video. Breonna Taylor was an emergency room technician. She also worked as a certified EMT. And she was a front line worker facing the beginning of the Coronavirus crisis. And in the early morning hours of March 13, she was at home with her boyfriend Kenny Walker and they were asleep in bed when they heard a loud banging at the door.

Police officials claim the detectives at Taylor`s door announced their presence, but Walker and neighbors say they never heard anyone identify themselves. When no one opened the door, detectives used a battering ram to force their way in, police documents say.

Walker, the boyfriend, called 9-1-1 believing their house was being invaded. And why would he not? Someone had just barged in. And he fired one round of warning to scare away the invader. Well, police responded with a hail of bullets, according to Walker`s attorney, firing more than 22 rounds, at least 8 of which struck Breonna Taylor.

The officers were there to execute a no knock search warrant based on police`s belief that a suspect in their narcotics investigation used Taylor`s home to receive mail, keep drugs or stash money earned from the sale of drugs. Well, no drugs were found in Taylor`s apartment and neither Taylor nor her boyfriend had any criminal history or drug convictions.

The three responding officers are all on administrative reassignment pending the investigation as the officer who requested the warrant.

But Breonna Taylor`s family and activists are pushing for much more action from Breonna who would have turned just 27-years-old last week.


UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE:  She literally was the sweetest person ever. The car rides was fun with my sister. They were like the funnest things ever.

I had friends when my sister passed away they were telling me like they admired our relationship. They wished they and their siblings were like that.

It is so weird that her birthday is Friday and she is not getting on my last nerves talking about does this match, does this look right, am I going to look cute for my birthday, I got a hair appointment this day. You need to do this for me. It`s so weird she`s not here.




PHILONISE FLOYD, BROTHER OF GEORGE FLOYD:  George called for help, and he was ignored. Please listen to the call I`m making to you now, to the calls of our family and the calls ringing out the streets across the world. People of all backgrounds, genders and races have come together to demand change. Honor them, honor George, and make the necessary changes that make law enforcement the solution and not the problem.


HAYES:  That was George Floyd`s brother, Philonise Floyd, appearing before the House Judiciary Committee today. It is the first congressional hearing since Floyd`s killing set off a wave of national protests.

The hearing was designed, in part, to spotlight a police reform bill from House Democrats that would, among other measures, ban choke holds and no knock warrants, like the one used in Breonna Taylor`s case, in drug cases.

Senate Republicans are also reportedly working on a bill led by the Senate`s only black Republican, Tim Scott of South Carolina, who is suggesting his bill will likely not include many of the strongest measures sought by Democrats in the House.

While, the White House says the president may announce measures to address policing tomorrow. Members of his administration today were out in front of cameras denying that systemic racism even exists.


LARRY KUDLOW, DIRECTOR OF THE NATIONAL ECONOMIC COUNCIL:  I don`t think there is systemic racism in the U.S. I`m not going to go into a long riff on it.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE:  You said you don`t believe in systemic racism.

KUDLOW:  I do not.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE:  At all in the U.S.?

KUDLOW:  I do not.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE:  You don`t think there`s any systemic racism against African-Americans in the United States.

KUDLOW:  I will say it again, I do not.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE:   Does the president feel that there is systemic racism in law enforcement?

KAYLEIGH MCENANY, WHITE HOUSE PRESS SECRETARY:  The president has been very clear there are injustices in society.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE:  He doesn`t think there is systemic racism in law enforcement.

MCENANY:  He believes most of our police officers are good, hard working people. There is a lot of evidence of that. And he has great faith in our police department.


HAYES:  I`m joined now by Congressman David Cicilline, a Democrat of Rhode Island. He`s a member of the House Judiciary Committee, which held that hearing today, also the former the mayor of the city of Providence.

Congressman, what was -- what did you view as the goal of today`s hearing?

REP. DAVID CICILLINE, (D) RHODE ISLAND:  The goal of today`s hearing, Chris, was to really lay out the importance of moving forward, some real reforms to improve police accountability, to ensure that law enforcement is working for the people of this country in a fair and equitable way and that we eradicate misconduct and hold police officers accountable when they engage in it.

It was an opportunity, of course, to hear from Mr. Floyd`s brother who gave very powerful testimony about the impact of his brother`s death on himself and his family, and really called us to action and said, you know, his name is well known, your names will be well known too if you move forward with bold action.

And we heard from experts and civil rights advocates and folks who have studied law enforcement in significants ways about what are the best ways to reform policing in this country to help eliminate police brutality and the kinds of things that led to the death of George Floyd.

HAYES:  One of the items in your legislation, which I think is most interesting around which there is a little bit of sort of cross ideological consensus is ending qualified immunity as it`s currently been interpreted by the Supreme Court. It`s a doctrine that has been interpreted by the Supreme Court to essentially make it almost impossible to sue a police officer or a department for a conduct even that`s wildly egregious or unconstitutional. How important do you think that is? Do you think that that`s something you might find traction? Tim Scott said today he`s not interested in that, but other Republicans seem to be.

CICILLINE:  I think it is something we should find traction with. This is sort of the centerpiece accountability, police officers who engage in misconduct that resulted in citizens being harmed and sometimes killed, they have to be held accountable. And the way the court has interpreted that doctrine that they essentially created basically immunizes police officers from being held accountable for even gross misconduct. And you can`t have a system that enjoys the respect of the American people if misconduct can occur without any accountability.

And, so, I think that`s an important part of the legislation as well as the banning choke holds, as well as the provisions to end racial profiling, as well as the training pieces, the registry for police officers who have engaged in misconduct. I mean, it`s a very comprehensive -- the most comprehensive approach ever considered by congress on this issue in a generation.

This is a moment that the country expects us to act and enact meaningful reforms that will respond to the demands that the American people are making for real change in our country.

HAYES:  It seems to me there is sort of two conversations happening in America. One is a conversation among I think a majority of Americans of all races about the sort of spectrum of ways of attacking the problem, reform versus more radical solutions. Then there is the president and, you know, sort of the kind of hard core who don`t really want to have the conversation.

Do you see any openness among House Republicans? We know the Senate is working on something, which is unusual for them. Do you see any (inaudible) among your House Republican colleagues to engage on this issue?

CICILLINE:  Well, it`s interesting. The hearing today was really revealing. Many of my Republican colleagues acknowledged the seriousness of this issue, expressed a willingness to respond in a meaningful way and to work with us to move forward with a response. They expressed commitments to Mr. Floyd that they would take this effort seriously.

And, so, you know, I think it shows the power of the people in this country, that people all across America are marching and demanding change - - young people, old people, people of every background. And I think my Republican colleagues are feeling that.

This is a moment, this is a historic opportunity to actually respond to a problem which has existed for generations in this country, the scourge of racism, of disparate treatment in the criminal justice system and policing is really a stain on the soul of our country. And my Republican colleagues I think today at least used some language that shows they`re open to it.

Of course, we are going to mark the bill up next week. And we`ll have an opportunity to sort of test how sincere they are about doing something about this very serious problem in our country by how they vote.

HAYES:  Final question for you. I noticed in my reporting on this issue for years that politicians, particularly Democrat politicians, both African- American, white, Latino, sound very different when talking about the issue when they are mayors and they are running a police force. And it`s very striking.

And you were the mayor of Providence, the Providence Police Force I think it is fair to say, has a very, very spotty, if not ugly, history. Back in 2010 there were people who wanted you to get rid of the chief police Dean Astermann (ph) who is in the sixth year, calling for him to resign, described a force marred by corruption and mismanagement. Do you look back on that time and have regret? Do you think about it differently?

CICILLINE:  Look, when I -- no, not at all. When I took over the Providence Police Department, it was a department that was under a patterns and practice investigation by the Department of Justice. Crime was on the increase. The community was at war with the police, and people had really lost confidence in the department.

I brought in a new chief. We brought down the crime rates to the lowest crime rate in 40 years. We opened nine neighborhood community substations. We went from being under investigation, which I inherited, to a fully accredited police department.

And the police really became fully integrated into the community. They served on recreation boards and housing association boards and we opened nine neighborhood substations.

So I really saw that the ability to transform a department with the community, the community-based police department with extraordinary results. It is hard work, but it is central to what you have to do to make sure cities are successful.

HAYES:  All right, Congressman David Cicilline of Providence, Rhode Island, thanks for being with me today.

CICILLINE:  My pleasure.

HAYES:  Coming up, Heather McGhee on new polling that shows that nationwide protests are having incredible impacts. The stunning announcement, as well, from NASCAR. They`re banning Confederate  flags. We`re going to talk about both of those things next.


HAYES:  This is a live scene in Portsmouth, Virginia. There is a impromptu protest outside of a Confederate monument that is in that town. Virginia is the home to more Confederate monuments than any state in the union. Of course they dot the landscape of America and many U.S. Army bases -- other bases named after them.

There`s something incredible happening with American public opinion in this moment. Just today, NASCAR venerated institution for many rural white American, institution that has struggled with expanding and diversifying its base, announced it would ban confederate flags from its events and property, saying in a statement, the presence of the Confederate flag at NASCAR events runs contrary to our commitment to a welcoming an inclusive environment for all fans, our competitors, and our industry. The display of the Confederate flag will be prohibited from all NASCAR events and properties.

In the wake of the most significant street protest in at least a generation, perhaps longer, public opinion appears to be moving rapidly in the direction of the protesters.

Just look at this graph from The New York Times Upshot, in the past two weeks, support for Black Lives Matter increased by nearly as much as it had over the previous two years. Here to talk about this, someone wrote a book on this topic, has thought a lot about it -- "The Sum of Us" is the book -- What Racism Costs Everyone and How We Can Prosper Together," which is due out next year. She also did a TED Talk last year about how white people understand racism and what it means for them.

Heather McGhee, co-chair of Color of Change, an online racial justice organization.

You know, Heather, I -- there were so much tension and worry in the wake of the protests when they started from people, particularly I think like white liberals who were like oh, god, it`s going to help Donald Trump. Oh, no, you`re going to alienate -- no, no. And it is really -- it`s like a case study in street protests and public opinion. I myself am actually kind of shocked by the data. What do you see happening here?

HEATHER MCGHEE, CO-CHAIR, COLOR OF CHANGE:  Think we see a few things happening. One, we -- I think we were primed for this moment by the Coronavirus, by a lot of the American mythology being laid bare. One the idea that we can sort of be relentlessly upwardly mobile and that white folks have, you know, sort of their grasp on the American dream when the economy shut down and people realized they were two paychecks away from destitution and the government may not be there for them. here was a sense of vulnerability and a physical vulnerability.

And then, as we saw, the Coronavirus made people lean into their neighbors and show so much solidarity and interdependence. Once you tap into that source of vulnerability, interdependence, humanity, and an awareness of the inequality that the Coronavirus has exposed, you`re primed for something big.

And then George Floyd was murdered on video, on top of the videos that we have and videos that we don`t have of so many of the other acts of racism - - Breonna Taylor, Ahmaud Arbery, Christian, the bird watcher in New York. And it was like lightning striking when you feel that electricity building up in a storm.

And so that`s why, I think, we have this incredible thing happening with public opinion, but it`s also because of movements, because movements are powerful, because the movement for black lives has been working on this day in and day out, in big street protests and in small reading circles and in fights online and in calling people in and calling people out since Trayvon Martin was killed.

HAYES:  Yeah, we`re watching it. Just so that people know, we were watching someone take a sledgehammer to a Confederate monument. This particular monument is sort of unnamed Confederate soldiers, many of which have been torn down, they were erected as explicit memorializations of white supremacy and a kind of victory lap over the quality that was pushed through in Reconstruction. And we are watching them come down as a sort of powerful moments of symbolism.

The polling here, Heather, like you`ve got the last few weeks. You`ve also got just if you look back 2011 poll on racism, how big a problem is racism for society? 21 percent of white people saying it`s a big problem. Now you`ve got 60 percent of white respondents.

There`s something happening -- I see people caricature it or they use woke in these sort of like -- in the way they use PC in these like condescending quotation marks, but there is something happening in the consciousness of white people in America about race.

MCGHEE:  100 percent. And we`ve never had an enduring lasting change without this kind of multi-racial coalition.

It`s so important that this consciousness change, because what am I talking about when I say consciousness, I mean our beliefs. What do we believe on a gut level about the different groups of people that make up this country. We`ve seen consciousness change on issues like LGBTQ equality and marriage equality, consciousness changed and then policy changed.

We`ve seen in contrast policy change without consciousness change, and I call to mind Brown versus Board of Education.

HAYES:  Great, great point.

MCGHEE:  Well, you had a policy change that was resisted not 10 years later by the Supreme Court and a backlash that was very much, I think, driven hand in hand with the rise of the new Jim Crow and mass incarceration where the belief in the inherent sort of goodness and innocence of black and brown children has not actually followed, and it didn`t predate the court decision. And we have schools that are as segregated as they were before Brown.

This consciousness change is going to see ripples all over the place. They`re seen with the party in Virginia right now saying it`s time for a new America and that`s what they`re saying.

HAYES:  That is an incredible and illuminating framework, I think.

By the way, I`m watching a black man take a sledgehammer to a monument to white supremacy erected on public land to essentially celebrate the subjugation of African-Americans after a brief taste of equality in Reconstruction and a program for equality. In fact, many of the Confederate monuments -- I don`t know the particular history of this one -- erected throughout the south were erected in the wake of Brown v. Board as precisely this kind of backlash politics.

In the 40 seconds we have left, do you fear the backlash politics? Because in the era of Donald Trump, I think people are scared of it and it always looms large.

MCGHEE:  Yeah, of course there will be a backlash, but here`s the question, are we going to be strong enough to defeat it? And I think we are. I mean, I think you are seeing the longest, most sustained protests in American history. It`s -- there will always be a backlash, they`ll always have a lot of money, they`ll always a lot of the media in terms of the right-wing media, but this moral moment that we are being called to I think is stronger than any backlash.

HAYES:  Heather McGhee, one of my favorite people in the world to talk to always. It`s wonderful to see you. Thank you very much.

Well, long live the Union as that soldier monument comes down. Long live the union.

That is "ALL IN" for this evening. "THE RACHEL MADDOW SHOW" starts right now with Ali Velshi in for Rachel.

Good evening, Ali.