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All In with Chris Hayes, Transcript 08/21/15

Guests: McKay Coppins, Tara Dowdell, Sam Seder, Tera Dowdell, MckayCoppins, Ricardo Aca

CHRIS HAYES, MSNBC HOST: Good evening on this Friday night. I`m Chris Hayes. And right now, we are awaiting what is widely expected to be the biggest event yet of the 2016 campaign. It`s a rally for the current Republican front runner, a man by the name of Donald J. Trump you may have heard of. And it is held at 43,000-seat football stadium in Mobile, Alabama. People started lining up hours ago in 90-degree heat to get in and to get a spot. And if the crowd size fulfills Trump campaign`s expectations, it will make up more than one fifth of the entire population of Mobile. Joining me now live from Donald Trump`s rally is NBC News correspondent Katy Tur. She has been following the campaign and there all day. Katy, who`s coming to this rally and why? KATY TUR, NBC NEWS CORRESPONDENT: Well, a lot of people are coming to this rally. First up, they were hoping that 36,000 would come. They said they had upwards of 36,000 RSVPs. The stadium holds 40,000 people, but as you can see, it`s about less than half full at the moment. So far, though, there are a lot of people are coming to hear his blunt talk. They are excited to hear what he has to say. They`re excited to hear what they may not expect to have him to say because he is always a bit of a loose cannon. So far, though, the people there, here say they are not necessarily all decided that they are going to vote for Donald Trump, but they do believe he has a chance for their vote. They are going to come out and hopefully, in their words, be convinced by what he is offering the country, especially, the immigration plan. Out there, people here are hot on the issue of immigration. Back in 2011, Alabama passed the strictest immigration law in the country. One where it even made it illegal to give a ride to an undocumented immigrant in a car be it to school, work or just down the street. Most of that law was struck down by the courts. It`s no longer in the books. This is also home to Republican Senator Jeff Sessions who helped Donald Trump frame his immigration policy. Also, the state`s governor endorsed John Kasich just a couple of days ago. So, Donald Trump is no doubt going to come out here and say even though your governor endorsed somebody else who I can bring out to see me. Look at the crowds I get. Kasich isn`t getting as much. Look how far down he is in the polls. I`m leading everyone. Expect to hear him talk very bombastically about what he can do and how smart he is and how far ahead he is than his opponents at the moment. HAYES: Katy, your Trump impression and your predictions of the speech are getting pretty good the longer that you are riding along with him. I think all those safe predictions. We will check back with you throughout the evening. All right. Joining me now at the table, McKay Coppins, senior political writer for "BuzzFeed", Democratic strategist Tara Dowdell, Sam Seder, MSNBC contributor and host of "The Majority Report". OK. So you, listener, viewer, hi. How are you? Happy Friday night. Here`s what we are going to do. We`re going to try something tonight. A special enhanced viewing experience. Here`s the thing, Donald Trump right now, by any journalistic standard, is the number one story in the campaign. There`s no way around it. I mean, the bump that he`s had in the polls far surpassed the merry- go-round bumps that we saw in 2012. There`s comparisons with Perry and Gingrich. He`s outlasting them. He`s led in the last 28 polls. Recent Rasmussen polls shows among Republican voters, 70 percent expect him to win the nomination. Here`s why it is an important number. The best predictor of victory in an election isn`t people saying who they will vote for but who they expect to win. In fact, that question is one of the most effective predictors of who wins in general presidential elections. So, that is important for this polling data -- 28 polls in a row in which he has led. He is polling 30 to 15 ahead of Bush in the state of Alabama. He has fairly depthless resources, right? So, this is not someone who`s going to run out of money, OK? He has weathered already four or five media storms that people predicted would be his demise. He has completely untethered from much of the orthodoxy of the Republican Party, even the conservative movement, particularly that hoisted by the donor class that ends up being a political liability. He is a real, genuine phenomenon. I was among the people who are skeptical in the beginning. McKay Coppins I believe, you are among the skeptical. Sam, you are a less skeptical. SAM SEDER, MSNBC CONTRIBUTOR: I don`t think I was skeptical at all, frankly. No. I think -- listen, they have been building Donald`s shadow, Donald Trump for 20 years. It`s just they didn`t expect that real Donald Trump would show up. I mean, honestly, I think there was a suit they were creating, the CEO president, the guy who wasn`t going to take guff, who could talk tough, and he showed up at one point, and he`s got a lot of money. That`s the big problem too for the Republicans. HAYES: He`s got a lot of money and there`s a variety of things happening here. One is, we heard for so long how strong the Republican field was. People have been writing this story forever, forever. I read it 600 times, so strong, deep bench, all these people. Look at all of these people. Well, this guy is trouncing all of them. So all the articles about how deep bench, about how great the candidates -- I`m sorry, Jeb Bush maybe you think he was a great governor, maybe you think he`s a bad governor, maybe you think he`s good politics, maybe you think he`s got bad politics, has not been particularly impressive on the trail so far. That`s not a substantive judgment, it is a purely performance politics judgment, not super impressive. OK? Donald Trump will tell you that, by the way. OK? But this is -- this is where things now stand. I have -- you know, the old Keynes line, when the facts change, I change my mind. What do you do? I have had to change my mind. Do I think he could be the next president of the United States? No, I still would bet against that. Do I think he`s gong to be a nominee? No. Is he going to be around, is this an actual thing? Is this more than some like crazy summer flash in the pan, more than a Herman Cain, Michele Bachmann moment that happens five months out? Yes, 100 percent yes. This is happening. SEDER: More than that, he`s not only trouncing them in terms of the polls, he`s basically every single candidate has had to change whatever game plan they had two months ago, the day before he jumped in to this race. Whatever game plan they thought they had has been thrown out the window. Jeb Bush, in the universe where Donald Trump does not run, never says the word "anchor babies." He`s never done, there`s not -- HAYES: True, like he was part of a group that wrote a memo saying not to use it. SEDER: Exactly. (LAUGHTER) SEDER: You have the entire party moving to the right, becoming more and more crazy just to basically get someone to report on them. HAYES: OK. But, here`s the thing -- yes on immigration moving to the right, agreed. But to me what is an important thing to understand about what Donald Trump is doing is that the politics he`s channeling are truer to the base than the ideologically rigid politics of the conservative movement. Do you agree, McKay? MCKAY COPPINS, BUZZFEED: Because he`s not -- because what he is channeling is not actually an ideologically coherent set of ideas. What he`s channeling -- HAYES: It`s not like high excess, than when central planning comes in inevitably, you get risk-taking and cronyism. COPPINS: Right. What his campaign is built on is an attitude and style and channeling the id of the conservative base. And at its core, on the right and left, that is what politics is about. It`s an identity politics that he has mastered. He is a master performer. What is interesting, though, I think, is this has been his style for 25 years. HAYES: Right. COPPINS: It`s just that now he`s reinvented himself as a right wing populist provocateur. And it works very well in that setting. TARA DOWDELL, DEMOCRATIC STRATEGIST: He is the Madonna of politics. I mean, he has reinvented himself. HAYES: That`s a good point. DOWDELL: Because what Trump has over everyone else, particularly the Michele Bachmanns, the Herman Cains, who are flashes in the pan, what he has over them is he understands marketing. So, I worked on campaigns, but I also run a marketing firm. And he understands that marketing is connecting what matters to people, speaking to that and connecting with them emotionally and the Republican Party fear is a primary driver of that. Donald Trump has tapped into that, tapped into those fear, also some of those aspirations. HAYES: Yes. DOWDELL: And that is what he is exploiting. HAYES: Let me tell you something, I spent most of today listening to Trump speeches, OK, preparing myself for tonight`s live fact checking, which we`re going to try to pull off. Don`t go anywhere. SEDER: You can`t fact -- they are not there. HAYES: Here`s a few things I learned -- do we have -- can we play the flag petting? Do we have the flag petting? I want to show that. Here we go. This is him. That`s him the other day. Him petting and giving thumbs up to the American flag. OK? Now, yes, there we go. Cuddling with the flag. Can we show him talking about the bible? Someone held up a book and this is him talking about what he thinks about the bible. Take a listen. (BEGIN VIDEO CLIP) DONALD TRUMP (R), PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: Hold that book up, please. OK. One of the great books. That`s my second favorite book of all time. You know what my first is? The bible. (APPLAUSE) Nothing beats the Bible. Nothing beats the Bible. Not even "The Art of the Deal." Not even close. I will go so strongly against many things that when they take away the word Christmas, that offends me -- I go out of my way to use the word with Christmas. I`d have some people that do this very professionally, they say, oh, don`t mention the word Christmas. I said, like hell I`m not going to mention. I`m going to mention, I get up there, I mean Christmas before I start speaking. So, there`s a great assault on Christianity in so many ways. (END VIDEO CLIP) HAYES: Why did I play those three things. That one of the myths that developed in the two months of the Donald Trump campaign is he is a straight shooter. That he`s just saying whatever. The guy is pandering in the most focused way imaginable. He comes out, he pets the American flag. He tells people the bible is the greatest book. He says he goes out of his way to say Christmas. He talks about Christians that are being beheaded by ISIS. He`s in front of New Hampshire, and he says, people in New York are like, what are they alike, and I tell them, they are great hard working people, OK? That is like, oh, he`s not a politician, that is the most lowest common denominator, obvious pandering a person can do. So, that is one thing to understand about what a person is doing here. Not only that -- his shtick has gotten much more on message. So, he is improvising -- believe me, I listen to five speeches today, back to back to back. The themes are always the same. He`s doing the thing that effective politicians do. He comes back to the same things. He`s not freelancing all over the place. SEDER: Right. He`s got macros and I would imagine to a certain extent that it`s not -- he is not just concocting this. I think he probably does watch FOX News on a fairly regular basis. I mean, that`s where his friends are. Even if he`s in -- HAYES: He watches it all the time. He live sweet tweets it. SEDER: He`s just basically regurgitating what he`s seeing on FOX and he`s found it to be a very effective and frankly, it makes sense he would win that battle at FOX. Everyone thought this is FOX versus Trump. FOX is going to win. No. No, they didn`t. DOWDELL: To your point, if you watch him when he makes a speech, when he seems -- he feels he`s losing the audience, he goes to those things that he knows are going to resonate, he knows will get the applause. He does it all the time. But, actually, it is like a break in his chain of thought. You can tell it is obvious he pivots right to those applause lines. COPPINS: I can say -- I saw him speak in New Hampshire at the beginning of 2014 and he was nowhere near as good as he is now. I mean, he had a very untethered speaking style where he was bobbing from one thing to the next and he was trying to use -- when he felt like he was in trouble he would go to his TV catch phrase. He would tell a story about firing someone, right? That was his way to get the audience back, but he was all over the place. And you are absolutely right that he has perfected his performance, his campaign persona and it is very effective. His press conference this week was very, very good. HAYES: Let me just say this, you are seeing right now, that is the football stadium in Mobile, Alabama. If that looks familiar, you are right, that`s where the bowl is played every year, if that is what is ringing in your ears. The capacity there is 40,000 people. Katy Tur said it was half full when we last checked in. Trump`s folks say they expect as many as 36,000. It`s a big crowd either way in the town of Mobile. It`s a big thing happening on Friday night. We are going to monitor this and we`re going to take a quick break. When we come back, we will keep our eye on that screen. We have our fact checkers, our crack team of producers at the ready. I have subjected the entire staff to hours of Donald Trump speak in preparation for you. Trump check live when we come back. Don`t go anywhere. (COMMERCIAL BREAK) HAYES: If there`s a core to the message Donald Trump has been giving and a core to the mess and resonating in what football stadium down there in Alabama, one of the most restrictive unconstitutional immigration laws in the country. It is very extreme. At times, just ugly rhetoric about immigrants and immigration. Well, it turns out Donald Trump is a sprawling business empire and in some of those buildings and hotels and construction sites and restaurants in those hotels there are immigrants and undocumented immigrants working with in them. One of them has come forward and he`s going to join us here to give his message to Mr. Trump ahead. Don`t go anywhere. (COMMERCIAL BREAK) HAYES: All right. We are -- we are monitoring the crowd in the stadium in Mobile, Alabama, where Donald Trump will speak in just a bit. I told you we would be bringing on someone who works in a Trump building, who is himself an undocumented immigrant. We`re going to do that in just a little bit. We think that Trump might be taking stage fairly soon here. Here at the table, I have McKay Coppins, senior political writer for "BuzzFeed", Democratic strategist Tara Dowdell, also formerly a contestant on "The Apprentice", and Sam Seder, MSNBC contributor and host of "The Majority Report". So, I was giving the bullish case, OK, the bullish case of take this seriously. This is going to stick around. This is not the sort of flash in the pan I thought it was or the stunt I thought it was in the beginning. What`s the bearish case? What`s your case for -- what is the kryptonite here? COPPINS: Yes. Well, I think we all -- I was certainly wrong thinking Trump was going to flame out by the end of the summer. I think it`s clear he will stick around longer than that. I think that when you look -- you mentioned a bunch of poll numbers that help him a lot. One thing that really hurts him and that could prove detrimental to this whole thing is his unfavorable rating among Republicans. It`s the highest -- HAYES: You think it might hurt in a Republican primary. COPPINS: Well, who knows he could overcome it. Look, it is highest among anyone in the field, it`s at 43 percent. They don`t like him. They have unfavorable opinions of him. And they haven`t broken it down as much as I would like to see, but my guess is among the 43 percent are millions of devout conservative Christians. I mean, there are a lot of people on the Christian right turned off by Donald Trump. Not just his whole attitude and his performance, but I mean -- he as a long, illustrious career of alleged philandering, of having basically violating every value that conservative Christians have. HAYES: It is clearly not a devout -- COPPINS: Not a person of faith. HAYES: He`s not a person of faith. I mean, he`s not devout. I don`t know his personal views but you were around him a little bit. DOWDELL: Yes, I was around him on the show. HAYES: This is not someone who is like quoting a scripture line. DOWDELL: No, I never saw him quote, reference anything, cross nothing. So, this is definitely something that is -- HAYES: I`m not saying -- he strikes me as a resolutely secular individual. SEDER: But, with that said, let me just offer a counter-argument there. His unfavorability ratings have dropped precipitously since he entered the race. HAYES: That is true. SEDER: He also remains the top choice to the extent that there`s, in terms of plurality. He remains that top choice of even self identified Christian conservatives in some polls I have seen. You know, it seems like -- intuitively you would imagine he would be rejected but I also thought he would be capped from being from New York, because there`s some measure of hostility that comes -- that doesn`t seem to be holding to logic. COPPINS: But so far he`s -- I mean he`s wall to wall on every TV channel, right, but still largely controlled his message. There`s not been a single ad run against him. Not a single -- the rest of the Republican field for the most part is trying to catch up with him. They are not viciously, rigorously going after him. HAYES: Rick Perry did. I mean, Rick Perry did. Lindsey Graham did. Rand Paul did. (CROSSTALK) COPPINS: That is the very bottom of the polls, right? DOWDELL: Four people that Republicans don`t like. John McCain going after you, Lindsey Graham going after you, Republicans have a problem with them. HAYES: By the way, as we watch this crowd file in, we should say this about the crowds. The record crowd so far in this election is held by Bernie Sanders, 28,000 in Oregon. Sanders posted numbers around 27,000, 28,000 a few times, 27,000 in L.A. He has been drawing the largest crowds of the -- you can see there`s a bunch of empty seats in the back there. Not that Mr. Trump is all for the game of expectation setting. Folks in Trump t-shirts and mobile for Trump signs there. That is something to keep in mind in terms of energy and whether energy -- the connection between energy in crowds and polling and broad sort of applicability. What do you think of the idea that I have, which I`m sort of obsessed with, about the message being unimpinged by the obsessions of the oligarchs in the Republican Party? I want to play part of the interview he did in Alabama where he got a question about the deficit. Take a listen to this. (BEGIN AUDIO CLIP) HOST: What do you do here to attack the deficit? Do you shrink the size of the federal government? Do you raise taxes? Do you -- how do you attack this? TRUMP: No, we`re not raising taxes. HOST: Will you take a pledge not to raise taxes? (CROSSTALK) TRUMP: -- nation in the world. What we`re going to do is shrink government, but we`re also going to bring back jobs. Look, China is taken all our jobs. Other countries, not just China. I`m using them because they are number one abuser, OK? They abuse us because our politicians are stupid people. (END AUDIO CLIP) HAYES: See, this is the thing. He doesn`t spend a lot of time on the deficit. He doesn`t spend a lot of time in shrinking government. He got a question about the deficit and he went right to his -- right to nationalism, nationalism first, national second, nationalism third. What are you going to do about the deficit, we will shrink government and taxes but it is really about Chinese taking our jobs. What are you going to do about X? Well, really, we got to get some good negotiators in so we get this. So, you know, we take oil from Iraq. Everything comes back to this put me the tough, strong guy in charge, reclaim American greatness, and I think that`s actually a more appealing message than telling people you`re going to cut Social Security. SEDER: Of course, of course. And I would say, the third one is not nationalism, because he`s also -- that projects on to what a lot of conservatives perceive is a sort of like attack on their world view by other Americans, right? By gay people, by Muslim Americans, by feminists. I mean, it goes on and on. You can just listen to Limbaugh for two weeks and get the list. You can probably do it in two hours. And he refuses to take guff from anybody. That`s like the fantasy version of themselves. COPPINS: I think it is useful to compare him to Mike Huckabee right now. Huckabee is the other Republican in the race who has an aversion to this small government entitlement slashing idea that`s taken hold in the conservative base -- conservative movement. HAYES: You can see individual in a blazer and a red hat there. That is Donald. COPPINS: The iconic image. HAYES: The iconic Trump. He seems to be enjoying himself amongst the denizens of Mobile, Alabama, as he makes his way towards, wherever he is going to be delivering. It`s in the middle of this crowd. COPPINS: What I was saying is I think Huckabee has taken a lot of guff from conservatives commentariat, this kind of Tea Party groups for not being in line with them. When he talks about it he talks in a conservative Christian compassion that doesn`t necessarily translate. Whereas Donald Trump, he has a great line, when he is asked about cutting Social Security, he said we don`t have to cut Social Security if I`m president. I am going to make the country so rich. HAYES: Exactly. Why go around telling people -- here he is. Trump check live begins now. We are at the ready. Battle stations. TRUMP: Thank you. That`s so beautiful. (CHEERS AND APPLAUSE) You know, now I know how the great Billy Graham felt because this is the same feeling. We love Billy Graham. We love Billy Graham. You know, this all started -- we had a hotel and we were going to have 250, or 300 people and the hotel was great. They called and said something is happening here. We can`t hold this. This is crazy what`s going on. And then we went to the convention center and they have 10,000 people and we are all set and excited and the next day they said too many people. We can`t put them in. So, we came here. We came here. (CHEERS AND APPLAUSE) You know, today if you notice, we have a stock market not doing so well. We have a country not doing so well. We have been saying it for a long time. We have politicians other than a few politicians that are with us tonight, right? We`ll exclude them. But we have politicians that don`t have a clue. They are all talk. They are no action. What`s happening to this country is disgraceful. (CHEERS AND APPLAUSE) And you know when I announced I was running for president, I brought up -- I brought up the subject of illegal immigration. (CHEERS AND APPLAUSE) And I took a lot of heat, that I can tell you. Rush Limbaugh actually said incoming, he got more incoming than anyone I have ever seen and two weeks later, everybody was apologizing to me. They saw I was right. Between what happened in San Francisco to incredible Kate and her family, such an incredible family and Jamiel and so many people have been so badly hurt. The other day in California, last week, a woman, 66 years old, a veteran was killed, raped, sodomized, tortured and killed by an illegal immigrant. We have to do it. We have to do something. We have to do something. (CHEERS AND APPLAUSE) So we`re going to talk. We`re going to have a lot of fun. The weather is a little dicey. That`s OK. Who cares if it rains, right? (CHEERS AND APPLAUSE) Right? You know, if it rains, I`ll take off my hat and I`ll prove -- I`ll prove -- (CHEERS AND APPLAUSE) I`ll prove once and for all it`s mine. OK? So, we`re going to talk about a lot of different subjects and, you know, it`s nice. Friday night, what the heck, right? What`s better? What`s better? (CHEERS AND APPLAUSE) What people, the people that built this country. That`s what we have here. I mean, the people that built the country. Great people. So, we`ll start with a little talk on the illegal immigration, what`s going on. We have to stop it. We`re going to build a wall. It`s going to be -- (CHEERS AND APPLAUSE) You know, it`s amazing. The politicians 10, 15 years ago, they all wanted a wall, but it never went. It never happened because somebody didn`t want a wall, probably a lobbyist. All of these guys like Bush and like Hillary Clinton, they are all taking care of -- I don`t know if you know -- (BOOS) No, but when Hillary has $60 million and when Jeb Bush -- when Jeb Bush who`s totally in favor of Common Core, weak on immigration, right, very weak on immigration, wants to let people come in, although now he is using anchor baby. You know, he put out a memo. You cannot use anchor baby. Now because I used it, he`s using it. Politicians -- but when they have in his case $114 million. In Hillary`s case, she`s got $60 million. I don`t know that she will make it to the gate. What do you think? I`m not sure she`s making it to the gate. Some bad things came out today. You know, those classified. You know the word "classified." You know, they have destroyed General Petraeus over less. And nothing seems to be happening here. So, it will be very interesting to see what happens ultimately. But we have right now, and I just got these numbers today. I said what are they? Seven and a half percent of all of the births in this country are illegal immigrants, OK? Can`t afford it. And they are supposed to stay. Now I turned out to be right. The 14th Amendment -- you know I had these guys who were telling oh, you can`t change the 14th Amendment, it`ll take so long. On that I agree. But you know what, an act of congress -- the 14th amendment, I was right on it. You can do something with it and you can do something fast. You can do something fast. (CHEERS) (END VIDEO CLIP) HAYES: Let`s just be clear about the 14th Amendment here, a pet theory has developed in fringe circles recently that some statutory fix could happen to the 14th Amendment, but the vast majority of constitutional scholars I`ve read say that the words in the constitution granting citizenship at birth to anyone born here are exactly what they are and can only be repealed with a constitutional amendment. (END VIDEO CLIP) TRUMP: doesn`t work that way. Mexico doesn`t do it. Other places don`t do it. Very few places do it. We`re the only place just about that is stupid enough to do it. (CHEERS) TRUMP: So, I decided to run. I have gotten an amazing reception. We have to say. Has this been crazy? (CHEERS) TRUMP: Man, I mean, it`s been wild. I`m a nonpolitician. The other day I served jury duty, right? I told you, they had occupation. I refused to put down politician. But I will say this, we have a great politician here. We have a man here who really helped me. He`s the one person sought his counsel because he`s been so spot on. He`s so highly respected. Has anyone ever heard of Senator Jeff Sessions, huh? Jeff, come up. Where`s Jeff? Get over here, Jeff. Look at him. He`s like 20 years old. HAYES: Senator Jeff Sessions of Alabama, who`s probably one of the most sternly militantly anti-immigration members of the United States Senate led the opposition to that comprehensive immigration reform bill that passed with about 70 votes also helped -- that looks like Jeff Sessions making an endorsement I have got to say. And that`s kind of big news. I mean, I don`t think there is a single prominent elected Republican who has endorsed Trump yet. That is what this looks like right now. Let`s take a listen to Senator Sessions. SEN. JEFF SESSIONS, (R) ALABAMA: The American people -- these people want somebody in the presidency who stands up for them. (CHEERS) SESSIONS: Defends their interest and the laws and traditions of this country. We welcome you here. Thank you for the work you have put in to the immigration issue. I`m really impressed with your plan. I know it will make a difference. And this crowd shows a lot of people agree with that. Congratulations. Welcome and god bless. TRUMP: Thank you, Jeff. HAYES: Just a quick correction. Trump said no one in the world offers birthright citizenship. That`s not true. Actually almost every country in the western hemisphere in the world offers birthright citizenship. Very few -- in fact, no countries in Europe do. It is a western hemisphere, eastern hemisphere vibe, but we are not alone. TRUMP: ...including Alabama. We`re leading in Florida. Can you believe it? We`re leading big in Florida. And you know it`s really amazing. I said, well, I love Florida, it is a great place, right, great. But Florida -- we have a governor and we have sitting senator and I`m killing them. Explain that. Obviously they are not doing a very good job because that shouldn`t be happening. But we`re winning in Florida, Pennsylvania, Iowa, New Hampshire, South Carolina, North Carolina, Texas and then nationally, we`re just absolutely way ahead of everybody else. In fact, if this were another country, we could maybe call for an expedited election, right? I`d love one. Can we do that? Can we do that? I`d like to have the election tomorrow. I don`t want to wait. (CHEERS) TRUMP: So, the reason that I think we see this receptivity is that I know the game better than anybody. I have been on the other side. You know, I was totally establishment, hands millions of dollars all the time to these characters, right. I was like the fair-haired boy. Do I look fair-haired? But I know the game. I understand it. And so many people have come up, lobbyists. I said I don`t want money from lobbyists, but recently last week a man comes up who`s a good guy. I know him. I said, I don`t want your money. I don`t want your money. Because -- I don`t know, maybe, I will rethink it. Should I rethink it? Take it, take it. You know what I should do, how about this? How about if I take his money but in the end I screw him and not do anything for him, is that OK? Can I do that? You know, I built a great business and I feel sort of stupid. I say I don`t want your money, can I take it, please. I promise I won`t do anything for him. I told him, I said, you know I don`t want your money because in two years when you come to see me about something I`m not doing it unless it is good and unless it`s going to make America great again, right? Right? But I`m going to have to rethink it. I think I`m going to rethink that because I think I should take a lot of money -- are we allowed to give it to charity or something? I don`t know. Just take it. Just take it. So what happens is these guys come up and I`m lucky -- you know, everybody said he`s never going to run. OK. You know that, right? And my wife actually said, you know if you -- and she knows me pretty well and also sees the reaction and for a long time whether it is Trump "The Art of the Deal" which Obama and Kerry obviously did not read when they did this crazy deal with Iran -- oh, look, "The Art of the Deal." Come here. Give me that book. I love that book. You know, I said the other day -- and it sort of played pretty well, that is my second -- help her over here. Help her over here. give me that book. I said the other day, it played pretty well. That is the second -- help her over here. Help her over here. That is my -- give me that book. Give me that. There`s always "The Art of the Deal." And that`s the real one. That`s the original. That`s when they used real paper, right? I said the other day because so many people they carry around "The Art of the Deal" because they are begging. They are begging their politicians, please, please read "The Art of the Deal" when you negotiate with China and with Japan and with Mexico and with Vietnam and with Saudi Arabia and with everybody. You know, right now we have a problem where North Korea is getting frisky, right? Now, recently I ordered 4,000 television sets. I`d like to order them from here. Like the hats are made in America. Can you believe I was able to find a guy? I had to do that because these hats are hot as a pistol, you know that. and they are made in America. And I`m going to give you your book, believe me, I haven`t forgotten about you, but they are made in America. But the other day -- and now I see today it is sort of pretty hot on the news that our very dear friend from North Korea is acting a little rambunctious again. So I ordered 4,000 television sets from South Korea. Whether it is Samsung, Sharp or LG or any of them. They are all made in South Korea. I paid a fortune. And they are wonderful, they are wonderful people. They are making a fortune. We don`t -- do we have anybody who makes television sets in this country? I almost like I don`t think so, right? So they are mostly made, other than Sony, which has lost its way -- prices are too high -- but they are mostly made in South Korea. Now I see North Korea is acting up. So I see we are sending ships and getting our troops ready. We have 28,000 troops over there and we`re getting ready just in case we`re going to fight, we`re going to protect. We get nothing. We get nothing. What do we get? We get nothing. Saudi Arabia -- and I get along great with all of them. They buy apartments from me, they spend 40 million, 50 million. Am I supposed to dislike them? I like them very much. But you know Saudi Arabia makes $1 billion a day -- a day. In all fairness that`s before the oil went down a little bit, but that`s okay. These are minor details. So now they are making a half billion a day. That`s not so bad, right? We get nothing. And they wouldn`t be there without our protection. Even Germany, Germany is a power. Who has a Mercedes-Benz? Anybody? A lot of people. They are a power. They pay us nothing. We defend the whole world. All you have to do -- and we want to be nice. Somebody said, oh, that`s like the mafia defense. I said don`t worry about it, okay. The mafia is not so stupid, all right. They said that is terrible to ask for money. No, they said it. They said that`s terrible. How can you possibly ask for money to defend a country. I mean, the whole world. All you have to do -- we want to be nice. Somebody said, oh, that`s like the mafia defense. I said don`t worry about it, okay. The mafia is not so stupid, all right. How can you possibly ask for money to defend a country? I mean tell me, how crazy are we? Now we`re sending our ships, we`re sending our everything. I will tell you those 28,000 troops that we have on the boarder between North and South Korea, that`s dangerous territory. They are in harm`s way. They are in harm`s way. And we get nothing. We get nothing other than they are a good competitor. They compete with us. They take our trade. We lose a fortune with them. we lose a fortune with China. We defend Japan. You know, we have an agreement with Japan where if somebody attacks Japan we have to come to their rescue, but if we get attacked Japan doesn`t have to help us. Do you think that is a good deal? That is sort of like Sergeant Bergdahl -- has anyone heard of Sergeant Bergdahl? The traitor, no, no, the traitor. I call President Obama the five for one president. Wwe get Sergeant Bergdahl, a traitor who by the six people, at least, that we know of, six people were killed trying to get this guy back. Six people, they went after him. They wanted to get him back. So we get Sergeant Bergdahl and they get five people... HAYES: All right, just so we`re clear here, Sergeant Bergdahl is not being prosecuted for treason. He is prosecuted for desertion. The army prosecutor is planning on presenting no evidence that six people died in looking for Sergeant Bergdahl, and they of course are the people who have that evidence is a claim that Donald Trump said the other day. TRUMP: New Hampshire was so incredible, the crowds -- you saw it. Every time I go on television it has got to be live. It is live. I said, oh, can I have a rest, please? Tonight it is live on Fox. Who likes Fox? I like Fox. It`s live on CNN. Who likes CNN? All right. And it`s -- and it`s live on MSNBC, right? Well, they are still working with. They are still working. But I said, you know, how come it always has to be live. Why don`t they cover me like anyone else where they go the next day and they show a little clip. Every time I speak it has to be live. It is ridiculous but it`s okay. We have to suffer with it. But look, the reason I have this really incredible enthusiasm and I really appreciate -- especially with this weather and this heat and everything else but the reason I have it is because I do know what I`m doing. And I don`t say that in a braggadocious way, you people are looking for somebody who knows what he is doing, whatever it is. You know, you know -- thank you, darlings. I`m going to sign her book. I have to get her the hell out of here. She`s so beautiful. I said it the other night, my second favorite book of all time. What`s my first favorite book? CROWD: The bible. TRUMP: The bible. And as much as I love "The Art of the Deal" it`s not even close. We take the Bible all the way, right? OK. Thanks. So, I was saying. So they said I wasn`t going to run. Everybody said he`s never going to run. Never going to run. He`s just having fun. Just a good time. His brand, like I care about my brand at this point. At this point, you know, my brand. I mean, I lose gutless Macy`s because I said about illegal immigration. They dropped my brand and I`m supposed to be -- they are gutless. They are all gutless. I have to sue Univision. Univision, my poor Miss Universe people, these beautiful women, some are girls, but beautiful women and I get dropped by, think of it -- you have these magnificent women that work all their life to be in the Miss USA contest and two weeks before the contest NBC and Univision drop because they thought my tone was a little bit strong. And it turned out I was right. So here`s the good news, I sued them both. And I mean in the case of Univision, I sued them for $500 million. I want that money. I want that money. So I actually put it on the other day, Miss USA I put it on because it was only fair to the people and we had it on a small network and it was fine but who would do that all because they want to be so politically correct. They actually called and said, oh, we will get it back on soon. We will get it back on soon. You know, in a case of a couple, they said Trump loses NASCAR. It was all over the world. A friend of mine called because I opened with a strong statement, meaning illegal immigration. We have to solve the problem. So all one day it was NASCAR, Trump loses NASCAR. I said I don`t have a deal with NASCAR. It turned out that I lost NASCAR. You know what they did, they rented a ballroom at Trump Doral. Can you believe it? That was my loss. They had a ballroom. And by the way, I kept their deposit and rented it to somebody else. The next day, I didn`t even know I had a deal with them. It turned out they had a ballroom in one of my places, Doral. The next day ESPN severs ties with Trump, it`s all over the world. ESPN I had friend called me from Paris. He`s a great businessman. Oh, it is too bad about what happened to ESPN. You know what it was? A golf outing at one of my courses in Los Angeles. Can you believe this? This is my big deal. And this was all over the world. I mean, the press -- I don`t know maybe they didn`t get it. Maybe they don`t get it. I was very disappointed, though, with Macy`s. You know, shirts and ties, not a big deal. But they heard there were going to be three pickets in front of the store. And they called, oh, we`re going to have pickets. We`re going to have pickets. I said, look, in two hours they will be gone. Believe me. They`ll go for lunch. They won`t come back. Don`t worry about it. I`ve been through it. It`s true. But they said oh, this is so bad. Can we sever ties? I said I don`t care, sever ties. I don`t wear ties so much anymore, you know. I didn`t like their ties that much any way, you know why because they were made in China. It always drove me nuts but they were good. HAYES: That is Donald Trump doing the going in on Macy`s part of the stump speech, it has become standard, of course, in the Republican primary getting tens of thousands of people there to cheer him suing people that backed out of deals with him pretty much through the looking glass. We are going to take a break and come back. More with the Trump check live. Do not go anywhere. (COMMERCIAL BREAK) (BEGIN VIDEO CLIP) TRUMP: When Jeb Bush, who`s in favor of Common Core, weak on immigration, right? Very weak on immigration, wants to let people come in. Although now he is using anchor baby. He put out a memo, you can not use anchor baby now because I used it, he`s using it. (END VIDEO CLIP) HAYES: All right, joining me now McKay Coppin, senior political writer for Buzzfeed, Democratic strategist Tera Dowdell, Sam Seder MSNBC contributor and host of the Majority Report. Everything -- first of all, I just want to -- in terms of how we set this up, the pandering thing. I mean, I love you guys in Alabama. Bring the woman up with the book. Like this is all -- you guys like Fox, yeah, we like Fox. I mean, he starts out. First line is Billy Graham, Billy Graham, one of the greatest preachers, one of the greatest. MCKAY COPPIN, BUZZFEED: I mean -- look, everything we said tonight is, I think he`s bearing out. And even building on, right? I mean, I think the most impressive thing that he`s doing tonight is showing that channeling his winnerness, his entire brand which is built on being a tough guy bully who beats people to a pulp, right? HAYES: And screws people, that`s the other thing. COPPIN: In fact you heard him say, this guy, this lobbyist tried to give me $5 million and I said -- no, I shouldn`t have taken it. Maybe I should take it and screw him... HAYES: Crowd goes nuts. COPPIN: And the crowd loves that, right, because what he`s doing is saying I am like this. I will do it what I have done my whole life and I will do it for you. And I`ll do it against all these countries and everyone who is screwing you right now. TERA DOWDELL, DEMOCRATIC STRATEGIST: Exactly. But the irony is that everything he has done tonight, to your point earlier, has been exactly what a politician would do. He is unfettered pandering right now and he`s taking the Republican message, a very -- we talked about this, a simple, crisp, easy to understand message and he has taken it to a higher level. HAYES: Well, or a lower level of lack of... DOWDELL: Right. HAYES: And the thing about politicians, like, that was a big moment. I`ve got to say. Jeff Sessions comes out, puts on the hat for a second and takes it off realizing what he has just done. DOWDELL: He thought about it, right. HAYES: No. Seriously, because I think that counts -- Jeff Sessions it appears just endorsed Donald Trump. That`s the first Republican elected to endorse him as far as I can tell. SAM SEDER, HOST, MAJORITY REPORT: He`s very excited I think about the idea of getting rid of birthright citizenship, and I think for Jeff Sessions. And you know at the very least that`s his like -- that`s his pay back. But I think it has to be said that Trump is just delivering the subtext, all the other stuff that the Republicans say at the end of the day can be boiled down to are you going to be tough? It doesn`t matter. Are you going to make those people pay? Are you going to be muscular in some fashion? So, I think... HAYES: Toughness sells. SEDER: This is about looking at who the Republican Party is. It is about Trump but only to the extent of he is a mirror and that is what he keeps doing, he just keeps mirroring. HAYES: We are going to have a special guest with us coming up in just a bit to respond to Donald Trump who is still going down there in Mobile, Alabama. Mckay Coppins, Tera Dowdell, Sam Seder, thanks so much for time tonight. Really appreciate it. Stay with us. Trump Check Live after this break. (COMMERCIAL BREAK) (BEGIN VIDEO CLP) TRUMP: When Mexico sends its people, they are not sending their best. They are sending people that have a lot of problems. They are bringing drugs. They are bringing crime. RICARDO ACA: I`m an undocumented immigrant. I was about 14 when I crossed the border. (END VIDEO CLIP) HAYES: Joining me now, the man in that video, Ricardo Aca. Ricardo, you work in Trump`s Soho building, right? ACA: Yes, I technically don`t work for the Trump hotel but I do work for the restaurant. HAYES: That is housed in that... ACA: That leases space in that building, but and I still have to go in there and look at his name right up there and have to work under that. HAYES: You came here, how old were you came? ACA: I was about 14 when we crossed the border, and I arrived in Arizona and then we just drove up here. HAYES: What does it feel like to watch this phenomenon happen? he says that Mexico is sending rapists and criminals, that people like yourself, you, literally, who is a beneficiary of DACA, which was signed by the president, it`s the reason that you have some sort of legal status, even though you are undocumented. He wants to deport you, probably wants to deport your family, your friends, round up everybody. ACA: I mean, at first it`s a little of a shock, because he`s a celebrity, so you kind of like in a way grew up watching Miss Universe because Mexico always participates. So then at first it`s a shock, but then... HAYES: So you had sort of warm feelings. ACA: No. At first it was shock, but then I got really angry. But then for me my way of responding is not just by attacking or by offending someone that I personally don`t know and never met in my life. For me I`m a photographer and I wanted to respond doing a photo series in which I had my Mexican community hold signs saying I`m not a criminal, I`m not a rapist, I`m not drug dealer many response to that and a friend of mine asked if he could fill me in on the process and that`s how this video came. HAYES: What would you say -- people that are his supporters feel very strongly that people like yourself, you, your friends, your family, some of your co-workers are taking over. You are coming over with ill intent. You are here to harm people or you`re here to get welfare. What do you want to tell them? ACA: Well, I think with my video, the purpose of it is to show that my daily life I don`t go around looking for crime or selling drugs or raping people I go to my job, from one job to the other, and during my free time, if I can, I get to do what I love, which for me is photographing. HAYES: You work two jobs. ACA: I work two jobs -- well, technically three and one is at a photo studio, yes. HAYES: So you are working three jobs. ACA: Yes, three jobs. HAYES: And what has it men for you to have the president have an executive order, which gives you for the first time some kind of semblance of legal status. ACA: He definitely gave me more opportunities. And now I don`t have to get, paid under the table. I can have a Social Security number and get paid with a check. HAYES: So you have come out the shadows. I mean you quite literally. ACA: Yes, I have finally come out of the shadows. And now I have more opportunities. I can apply for a job anywhere. But I can only dream as far as two years. Like ten years from now, I don`t know if I`m going to be here because if this guy becomes the president he wants to deport me and 11 million other immigrants. HAYES: Is that a conversation happening in the kitchen where you are working, among family members? ACA: I don`t think that anyone in the kitchen talks about it, just because they are very shy about it. They don`t really follow politics that much, but at the same time, I think they will be in fear if they were to lose their jobs or be deported because what are we going to do? I mean, how will he send us back. HAYES: What would it mean for you to have a president -- and Donald Trump, I should say, is -- everyone in that Republican field as far as I can tell says they will repeal the executive order that granted you some semblance of legal authority. What does it mean for you. ACA: It would mean that I will be unable to work. I would end up getting deported and then I will go back to Mexico and my life is not there anymore, my life is over here. So, it will definitely be completely different and then I`ll probably -- I wouldn`t have a good life over there, as good as I have here because where I went to school, this is where my family and friends are. HAYES: Ricardo Aca, thank you very much. Takes some real guts to up here. Thank you. That is All In for this evening. The Rachel Maddow Show starts now. THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED. END