The Last Word with Lawrence O’Donnell, Transcript 10/2/17 Las Vegas shooting

Joe Fryer, Buzz Brainard

Date: October 2, 2017
Guest: Joe Fryer, Buzz Brainard

RACHEL MADDOW, MSNBC: My colleague Lawrence O`Donnell picks – we`re also
posting all this information online at

But our coverage is going to continue not just through the evening, but
through the overnight as well. My colleague Lawrence O`Donnell picks up
our coverage now, Lawrence.

LAWRENCE O`DONNELL, HOST, THE LAST WORD: I appreciate it, it`s another
tough day, sorry to see you here –


O`DONNELL: But there was Senator Chris Murphy who emerged on this issue
after Connecticut was hit so badly at Sandy Hook and surely more will
emerge from Nevada –


O`DONNELL: Because of this same situation. We are going to go – thanks
Rachel, I`m going to have to come back and talk a little later.

We`re waiting for the news conference to begin here live in Las Vegas. We
expect an update on the shooting, it is starting now, let`s go to the press

METROPOLITAN POLICE DEPARTMENT: Search warrant at the home of Stephen
Craig Paddock in Mesquite, Nevada, detectives are combing to evidence to
uncover the motive behind the shooting and any other pertinent information
that will help shed light on this horrible event.

We have recovered 23 firearms at Mandalay Bay and 19 firearms at his home
in Mesquite. I want to emphasize we believe Paddock is solely responsible
for this heinous act.

We are aware of the rumors outside of the media and also on social media
that there was more than one assailant. We have no information or evidence
to support that theory or that rumor.

We believe there was only one shooter and that was Stephen Paddock. We are
doing a thorough investigation and only want to provide what is accurate to

We will only give information that we have vetted and know to be true. I
will not be speaking or answering questions on the issues that we do not
have the facts yet.

The latest estimate on the number of injured still stands at 527 which the
sheriff put out earlier this afternoon.

We have 59 that are deceased. Our homicide detectives are working around
the clock to process the scene as soon as they possibly can.

We understand that there are personal belongings that people need to
retrieve from all of the locations, once we come close to clearing that
scene, we will provide more information for how people can get their
belongings and we are coordinating that with the local hotels and with the
venue so that people can get their belongings back.

The family resource center will play a role in that task. We want people
to know that the center is up and running.

At the Las Vegas Convention Center and we are asking families and friends
who live in Las Vegas to physically go to that center which is located at
the Convention Center.

The hotline number has changed due to some technical difficulties. That
new number is 1-800-536-9488. Again, that is 1-800-536-9488.

The number that we gave out previously is no longer in use. However, if
you are a local person from Las Vegas and are looking for a loved one,
please go down to the Family Resource Center in person.

That is the best way to get assistance. I also want to comment on some
steps that MGM Resorts has taken.

They`re coordinating rooms at no cost at the Bellagio for families that are
coming in to town. They`re also coordinating travel through Southwest

They`re coordinating crisis counselors for people that worked as vendors,
employees and guests. And American Red Cross has been given space over at
Circus Circus to establish a headquarters for the local community until
they get some national assets in.

We have had an overwhelming turnout of people standing in line to donate
blood at the United Blood Services and at UMC, but they cannot take any
more people right now.

We are asking that you not go down there until at least tomorrow afternoon
if not the next day. They have enough supply to last them for the
foreseeable future.

People are also donating food in large amounts while the gesture is
appreciated, Metro does not have the ability to coordinate delivery or
distribution and we`re asking that if you are going to donate food, do so
with either bottled water or sealed food to the Red Cross at 1771 east

There have been remarkable amount of support from our community, we have
been asked by concerned individuals from near and far asking how they can

At this time, the Go Fund Me page set up for the victims by Commissioner
Sisolak and Sheriff Lombardo is the best mechanism to show you support to
the victims.

We do not anticipate having any further updates tonight, when we have
further updates tomorrow, we will send out a press release notifying you
that we will be giving more information.

These past 20 hours have been trying and we know we have a long way to go,
I`m proud of the courage and resiliency displayed by all our first
responders on this event.

I also want to appeal to you and the public and the media, we know of no
known threats in our Las Vegas area.

If we did know of anything that could harm the safety and security of our
citizens, we would tell you that and our department would act upon that.

Please allow our department the ability to do what they do the best;
investigate crime and keep you safe.

With that, I will turn it over to Commissioner Sisolak who has a few words.

words I`d like to say. Again, it`s just – had several of these today and
it`s been a long day for a lot of us.

But I just left Mr. Jim(ph) and I want to have a special thank you to two
groups that we had our first responders, obviously, our medical personnel
responded, but for the fact of the great work done by the men and women of
Metro and the security at Mandalay Bay, we would have lost hundreds if not
thousands more lives.

I mean, they were able to triangulate and locate their room and get people
in there and saved countless lives.

And for that we will be eternally grateful for the work that you did and in
conjunction with MGM. We did set up with the sheriff to Go Fund Me
campaign and I appreciate Todd saying something.

As when I walked in here, we received an excess of 30,000 donations
exceeding $2.2 million. When we started it, we set the goal at $500,000,
we got to $100,000 and one individual called and said I will get you to
your goal.

And he donated $400,000. That individual was anonymous until now, he has
said that we could release his name, it was Stephen Cloobeck donated
$400,000 to support this community.

We ask you all to support our community. And again, I`d like to ask you
next time you see one of our first responders, whether it`d be Metro or it
be fire or what have you, tell them thank you because we owe them an
eternal debt of gratitude for what they did.

And I`ve got some – Congressman Titus and I know they have a few words to
say, Senator, go on.

REP. DINA TITUS (D), NEVEDA: Well, thank you very much. This horrendous
act of evil happened right in the heart of District 1 which I am honored to

The whole day is revolved around that act. There`s been police briefings
and talking with the FBI, visiting hospitals, all of the things that kind
of are associated with an act of war.

But we also heard stories of individual heroism, people helping others
through the gate, over the fence, shielding their bodies, standing in line
for blood.

Those are the kind of stories that we need to focus on. And it was so
appropriate that we`ve ended the day with (INAUDIBLE) church service on the
strip where we gathered to grieve for the fallen, to thank our wonderful
first responders who have done so much in coordination with each other.

And just to hold hands with family and friends, to cry and to recommit
ourselves to do all that we can so that this never happens again.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Sure. It has been a long day as you can imagine for
everybody here, and like my colleagues and everyone here in Southern
Nevada, I have to thank the first responders, our law enforcement, the
medical community here, our EMTs, everybody who ran into the face of danger
to save lives.

Many lives that families now are concerned about, those who have been
injured, families now who are dealing with loss of loved ones.

I, too, had a niece there last night at the event, she was one of the lucky
ones who made it home. But there are many who are still injured and who
did not.

And now, it is time for all of our community to come together to bring
comfort and relief to these families.

I know for all of us, this week is going to be about those families, those
who have been injured and how we can do everything in this community
continue to support them.

As well as supporting the ongoing investigation that needs to take place,
independent, let them do their job, there will be plenty of time to second-
guess, there`ll be plenty of time to play politics.

But right now is the time to come together as a community and support and
comfort one another.

GOV. MARK HUTCHISON (R), NEVADA: Good evening, I`m Mark Hutchison;
lieutenant governor of the state of Nevada.

And on behalf of the state of Nevada, I want to thank everyone who has
already been thanked repeatedly today and we`re going to continue to thank
them over and over again.

Everyone who ran towards the bullets when everybody else was running away
from the bullets, those who met the victims at the hospital.

I spent most of my day at the hospitals and in an effort I just came from
sunrise. Sunrise took care of 214 of the victims and performed over 90
emergency surgeries, just extraordinary efforts on behalf of our medical

They handled this tragedy with competence and character, and we`re very
proud of them as Nevadans. I told you last time that UMC and Spring Valley
both performed admirably.

I spent some time there as well. If you arrived at any of those facilities
alive, you continue to be alive, I confirmed that again this afternoon.

It`s just the best of the Nevada spirit, the best of our community. Las
Vegas has been my home, born and raised here, raised six children here.

And what we`ve seen today at the close of this day is the best and in the
highest traditions of Las Vegans and Nevadans and Americans.

You`ve heard story after story when you meet with these families about
their guardian angels who were at that tragic site.

Who carried them out of harm`s way or found vehicles and took them to the
hospital and it`s just inspiring in a day that has been depressing and

It`s inspiring to see what Americans do for each other. And so, to all of
those who have helped today, I say God bless you and we`ll get through this
together with our faith in God and the American and Nevadan spirit that we
have. Thank you.

FASULO: I`ll take a small number of questions and then we`ll end it for

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Mr. assistant sheriff, you mentioned 23 guns, are they
all rifles? And how do we explain the difference from submarine?

FASULO: Well, Ken, like the sheriff explained earlier today, and as I
explained moments ago, our information is the investigation continues can

We put out the information that we have at that moment in time, and
sometimes those numbers will change, but there are 23 firearms at Mandalay
Bay and 19 out of his house.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: What`s in the investigation, is it a homicide
investigation or are detectives involved? Is this case putting a strain on
your man-power?

FASULO: So I can tell you that it`s a homicide investigation, and homicide
is investigating that specific aspect of the crime.

We have every resource available on our agency working. And I can assure
you that the sheriff has made a point that we have resources both in the
neighborhoods and around the community as well as Las Vegas Strip and
downtown that has not diminished, it actually has increased.


Hold on, one at a time with this.


FASULO: Pardon me?


FASULO: I have not personally gone through the entire list of victims, so
I can`t answer that question for you right now.


FASULO: Hold on.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: The majority of the people in the world are not trained
like yourself to know what to do when gun fire, you know, happens.

If last night, Jason Aldean had managed to say to the crowd, take cover
before he run off stage and took cover, do you think it`s going to save

FASULO: I don`t know, I wasn`t there. I don`t know what Jason Aldean was
thinking when he was on the stage.

I do know that a common thing is when people hear gun fire, they run for
cover, right? That`s a natural human instinct.

I don`t know what he said before he left the stage, but the investigation
will bring that out.



UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: How long did Paddock shoot for? Was it continuous or
did he stop? And I mean, how long do you think the shooting actually
lasted? How long was the shooting at the crowd?

FASULO: We are still putting that time line together –



UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Can you give us a time line about movements? When did
he shoot the security guard and did he continue shooting out of the window
after he shot the security guard?

FASULO: I know that he shot the one security guard up on the 32nd floor.
But I don`t know if he continued to shoot after that or not.


Hold on, hold on.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Details on his movements in 24, 48, 72 hours before the

FASULO: That`s –

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Detail on what he did, where he went?

FASULO: That`s what our detectives are in, our partners are working on
right now. It will be sometime before we are able to give you that, and a
chronological order and with an amount of confidence that it`s accurate.


UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Have you made any progress at all on his motives?
There`s word what he was sending money to the Philippines.

FASULO: So like I said earlier, we`re hunting down and tracing down every
single clue that we can get in his background.

Until we confirm all of those things that are floating around out in the
media and in social media, I can`t comment on that.


UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Two questions. Any timetable for when you are going to
get those hard drives open up and looking into them that you find at

Second question, did he specifically request that hotel room?

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Do you want to answer that?

FASULO: No, we don`t have a specific time line.


FASULO: I don`t know that yet.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Did he have a computer in the room?

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: We did receive – we did see several pieces of media
including a computer.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Have you examined it? Does it give you anything about

FASULO: It`s ongoing.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Especially (INAUDIBLE), one other question. After the
raid in Reno, can you tell us anything about what was taken there?

Is any weapons, explosives, computers or clues that give us something about

FASULO: Nothing that I can speak of and that scene is still being resolved
as we speak.

Let me – let me emphasize something to you that might help. I know that
you are all very eager to find out exactly what his motive was or what was
going through his head or what he was doing up to two weeks ago.

I promise you the sheriff will provide that information when we have
confirmed it. It doesn`t make sense for us to put out information that is
not accurate and isn`t timely and reliable.

So please have some patience with our agency and our partners to get you
that information, I promise you we will provide it to you when the time


UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Can you quickly tell me (INAUDIBLE) –

FASULO: Hold on –

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Got into your hotel?

FASULO: What was your question, sir?

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: What time exactly did his room get breached?

FASULO: I don`t have – do you guys have that?


FASULO: We have a time log of everything that we do. And that`s what the
detectives will be putting together as part of their investigation, is from
start to finish and including that entire time line.

So we`ll probably have more information on that probably tomorrow. So I`ll
take two more questions and then we`re going to be done for the night.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: (INAUDIBLE), the resources that are being provided
for them.

FASULO: They can go there for help and resources, OK? If they`re looking
for a loved one or a friend and they`re in town, they need to go there at
the Convention Center or the ones that are coming in, they can go there as

They also have that 800 number that they can call ahead of time if they
need to find out a piece of information in the back.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Specifically about that search warrant, the
additional one that you guys allocated today, you were originally saying
northern Nevada, can you not confirm about what`s in Reno?




FASULO: No, but I can tell you that that`s part of our investigation of
determining just that. Obviously, every hotel has video, I`m sure that
we`re going back and reviewing every ounce of that. So –

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Did you detectives find any more guns as part of this

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Agent, is that possible that that number will go up
any further?

FASULO: I would say that in the areas that we`ve been so far, I would say,
no. But until we`re done with the investigation, I`m not going to marry to
that number.



FASULO: OK? Last one, Ken –

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Any other rooms at the hotel?

FASULO: Not other than what the sheriff put out today at 4:00 or 3:00.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Affirmative we`ve got all the guns out of the suite for
the two rooms where the – from which shots were fired?


UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Are you confident that you have all the guns?

FASULO: I am confident in the number that I gave you of what we have


FASULO: All right, that`s it, thank you.


O`DONNELL: That was assistant Sheriff Todd Fasulo updating the media with
the latest numbers, especially the increasing number of weapons that have
been found in the possession of the shooter both at the scene and at his

He also updated us on the most important number, that is 59 dead, and 527
injured. Those are the latest horrible statistics coming out of this mass
shooting here in Las Vegas.

We`re joined now with the latest by Nbc`s Joe Fryer who was in the Mandalay
Bay Tower right behind us last night as this shooting happened.

JOE FRYER, NBC NEWS: Yes, we happened to already be here because of the
O.J. Simpson release, so that`s why we were already in the Vegas area.

It`s hard to imagine that just 24 hours ago, this was a very different
scene. Behind us, thousands of people had come from all across the country
for the third and final night of this route 91 harvest music festival.

That`s when gun fire erupted not just for a few seconds but for several
minutes. Right now, we want to take a look at how the night unfolded.



FRYER: In a matter of seconds, a country music festival turned tragic. A
storm of gun fire raining down upon an innocent crowd.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: He was shooting everybody, and there was dead people
everywhere, and I don`t even know what was happening.

There was just – he was just shooting randomly.

FRYER: It started at 10:08 p.m., the first reports of shots fired as
singer Jason Aldean performed. Initially, there was confusion, many
wondering if the sounds were part of the show.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: It`s fireworks! stop, what is the matter?

FRYER: But they quickly realized what was happening.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: We have an active shooter! We have an active shooter
inside the fairgrounds!

FRYER: A gunman perched on the 32nd floor of the Mandalay Bay Resort had
opened fire on 22,000 concert goers.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: We got about 40 to 50 people who were pinned against
this wall.

FRYER: All of them scrambling to find shelter wherever they could.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Got down and then one after another, and we were
laying down on the floor, I didn`t know whether to get up, to run, to stay,
to duck.


UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Get down, get down.

FRYER: At 11:20, an hour and 12 minutes after the shooting began, the SWAT
team busted into the gunman`s hotel room.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: All units on the 32nd floor, SWAT has explosive
breach, everyone in the hallway needs to move back. All units move back.


FRYER: Inside, they found 64-year-old Stephen Paddock dead and sheriff
says he killed himself. Authorities initially sought Paddock`s girlfriend
Marilou Danley, but quickly learned she was out of the country saying she
was not a suspect.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Right now, we believe he is the sole aggressor at this
point in the scene this static.

FRYER: Law enforcement officials believe Paddock fired out of two
adjoining rooms using a device similar to a hammer to smash the windows.

Authorities say they found more than a dozen weapons inside those rooms.
As the chaos unfolded, our team was actually staying in the Mandalay Bay
Tower under lock-down.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: There are flashing red and blue lights everywhere as
this area has been flooded by police and emergency responders.

FRYER: We were six floors above the gunman who was on the 32nd floor of
the hotel firing across Las Vegas boulevard towards the concert.

The stage 400 yards from the hotel where the crowd gathered in front, many
of them fleeing to the festival`s main entrance.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: It was very scary at the time, and then I got my wife
up. As I got her up, two guys came running by that were carrying a girl or
somebody that was all bloody and it looked like they had been shot.

FRYER: In the end, a massive loss of life and hundreds injured in the
worst mass shooting in modern American history.


O`DONNELL: Joe, how long did it take you to realize what was happening
when you were inside the hotel hearing this?

FRYER: You know, so I wasn`t in that one room where we were hunkered down,
I was actually across the hallway facing sort of the other way.

I was asleep at that time, honestly did not hear the gunshots, but our
producer who was in that room was sleeping, heard the gunshots, like so
many people, thought it was part of the concert, thought it was something
to do with the concert – you know, it sounded like gun fire.

The concert is very loud, it must be something to do with that, and then
eventually it started to realize what was really going on because it was
directly below us, we couldn`t see what was happening so it wasn`t until
later, we heard it was at the 32nd floor, we knew it was below us and then
we eventually realized it was really directly below us.

O`DONNELL: And joining the discussion now, Buzz Brainard, who was a
witness to this. Buzz is the host of “The Highway on Sirius Xm” radio.
Buzz, you were there, what was it like to your just now watching the video
that we just showed?

BUZZ BRAINARD, RADIO HOST: You know, every time I see something new from
that, it just starts to bring back the gunshots, the noises is what gets

That`s something I`ll never forget because pop like he said at the
beginning, we weren`t sure. It was our last performance of a three-day

People thought maybe fireworks, but the second time, we were walking out to
see what was going on, somebody said maybe it was something to do with the
power lines and by the third time, the third set, we knew, and we were
right by the stage, going near the artist area.

So we were lucky because we have the stage, we had tour buses, we were at
the – dive under those, we could see the dirt flying up because of the
bullets coming in.

So we stayed there for a while until security asked us to leave.

O`DONNELL: So that – you went yourself under a bus to hide from the

BRAINARD: I had my son in town who is 19 years old in L.A., I brought him
out to hang with his dad for the weekend. I grabbed him, I tackled him, I
put us both under a bus, we were all under the tour buses.

At the time, Jason Aldean was coming off stage with his very pregnant wife.
They had shielded – and one of the buses was the bus where we ran to.

I think they just went straight on, that`s where we all were. Eventually,
we didn`t know if they were coming toward us, we didn`t know if they were
stationary, but security on hand said let`s go, so everybody had to run.

And our only escape was to run across that stage.

O`DONNELL: Yes, how much time was there between the different bursts of
gun fire?

BRAINARD: It was just seconds. It was like pop-pop, going to be a few

O`DONNELL: And the first one – what did you think the first one was? You
didn`t think it was gun fire?

BRAINARD: Nobody did.

O`DONNELL: No one.

BRAINARD: We were all in the tent – we were – you know, we were
celebrating. We had this great festival, nobody thought that was gun fire,
it took a little while.

O`DONNELL: So then the second one happens –

BRAINARD: Second one –

O`DONNELL: Did that change your thinking?

BRAINARD: Yes, that`s when we went outside of the tent –

O`DONNELL: You want to see what this is?

BRAINNARD: We want to see what`s going on there, so we`re not sure.

O`DONNELL: Did you then understand right away what it was?

BRAINARD: It was almost immediate for everybody that was back there, at
the same time, everybody realized something was going on.

That`s when we scattered, people started taking cover, we were lucky we had
cover. The people in the middle there – I had just left the stage – you
know, introduction and I was watching the 22,000 people that – a sea of
people I couldn`t see the end of them.

Those people didn`t have the cover that we had. They didn`t have tour
buses or speakers or a stage to hide under.

O`DONNELL: And so did you just – how did you stay with your son? Did you
just lock arms?

BRAINARD: I grabbed his hand –


BRAINARD: And we ran, you know, he`s 19 years old but I grabbed his hand
because he`s my little boy still.


BRAINARD: And we ran and ran, and we crossed the street right here behind
us, and gun fire the whole time, people were running into each other,
trampling each other and of course the injured.

So just running too fast to really know what was going on, and we sprinted
as far as we could. We got to the Tropicana here where we thought it would
be safe.

O`DONNELL: Right across the street.

BRAINARD: I was still holding his hand, I think I held for another half an
hour after that.

O`DONNELL: What were you saying to your son as you were running along as
this was happening?

BRAINARD: It`s almost going to be OK, I said follow me, follow me, I got
you, I got you, it`s going to be all right. He`s having a hard time with


BRAINARD: He`s having a real hard time with it.

O`DONNELL: Everyone there certainly would be having a hard time. It is
unforgettable experience.

BRAINARD: Yes, it was scary.

O`DONNELL: And what about – did you have other friends there that you`ve
talked to afterwards?

BRAINARD: Our whole Nashville community was in town, so it`s interesting
because back home, everybody was on social media and letting everybody in
our community, the Nashville community, the management, the record labels,
the artists, everybody who was involved in this, we all were able to find
out that we were all accounted for, so we`re OK.

So we`re such a tight-knit community in Nashville, Tennessee, and such a –
this country music family is a family, so we`re looking out for each other.

O`DONNELL: How are you feeling now?

BRAINARD: I`m sad and I`m – I don`t know what`s going to happen in the
future for what we do. Can we do this? Can we continue to do this?

I mean, I don`t think that could have been stopped. I don`t know how we
could stop something like that. So where do we go now as a community, as a

What do we do next? I know we`re strong and I think we can get through it
because we are a one big country family.

It`s going to be hard, but I don`t know how we do this again, certainly not
right away.

O`DONNELL: Buzz Brainard, thank you very much for sharing that experience
with us tonight. Joe, thanks for joining us, really appreciate your
reporting on this – invaluable.

Coming up, what investigators know about that giant stack of guns that this
shooter brought into that hotel right behind us here.



fire on a large crowd at a country music concert in Las Vegas, Nevada. He
brutally murdered more than 50 people and wounded hundreds more. It was an
act of pure evil.


LAWRENCE O`DONNELL, MSNBC ANCHOR: That was the President addressing the
nation this morning and calling for unity and peace after the Las Vegas
shooting. Both the Whitehouse and Congress observed moments of silence in
honor of the victims of the shooting. President Trump will visit Las Vegas
on Wednesday to meet with law enforcement, first responders and the
families of victims. Here`s the Whitehouse Press Secretary on whether the
shooting will have any impact on the President`s position on gun control.


tragedy. Today is a day for consoling survivors and mourning those we lost.
Our thoughts and prayers are certainly with all of those individuals.

This is – there`s a time and place for a political debate but now is the
time to unite as a country. There`s currently an open and ongoing law
enforcement investigation, a motive is yet to be determined and it would be
premature for us to discuss policy when we don`t fully know all the facts
or what took place last night.


O`DONNELL: We`re joined now by MSNBC`s Rachel Maddow and Chris Hayes. It
is about day for thoughts and prayers.


CHRIS HAYES, MSNBC CONTRIBUTOR: Well there`s something – I mean, watching
Sarah Huckabee Sanders say that I`m taken back to Orlando and the horrible
trauma of the aftermath of the pulse shooting and watching then candidate
Trump the day after rthat shooting call on a ban of a full million people
from coming to the country. ..

Now there was no sense then it was too early, if there was a day for
consoling victims. If there`s an ongoing law enforcement investigation
that we need to get the facts. All of the - and some of those should be
clear are totally reasonable things to say particularly about the fact
there`s an ongoing law enforcement –


HAYES: let`s – but that is a standard act to say. It`s most kind of
maddening actually to watch that because there`s a standard this extremely
unevenly applied by this Whitehouse which is jump out to call things like
Egypt Air flight terrorism that turned out not be. that has run with the
first reports of all sorts of things when they thought they could have
points on the board politically and very different Sarah Huckabee Sanders.

MADDOWS: So you`re saying they`re happy to acknowledge there are
appropriate policy responses to mass shootings and massacres except when -

HAYES: Right. When it didn`t fit – doesn`t fit into the sort of box that
they have. And we have seen it time and time again and it`s been a really -
- to me unnerving tendency of the President to Tweet about things happening
that appear to be x by say ISIS or jihadist or some sort minutes into it,
an hour into it while people figuring out what happened.


HAYES: You see all of a sudden this restraint now. That doesn`t -

MADDOWS: Because it`s – and it`s because it`s friends and only apparent -

HAYES: Right.

MADDOWS: I mean -

HAYES: The only thing we know for sure.

MADDOWS: And the thing that seems different about this, I mean different
even compared to Pulse, different even compared to Sandy Hook, different
even compared to Virginia Tech, is that this killer appears to have put
together an arsenal that is – seems to have been sort of maxing out what
you can do with legal weaponry.


MADDOWS: AND we still don`t know the question of automatic weapons fire.
We still don`t know. But we have lots of suppositions in terms of hands on
an automatic weapon or whether he modified semi automatic weapons to make
it fire like an automatic and what that means. But the sheer number of
guns. I mean what just got at the press conference, right?

O`DONNELL: They updated the number, yes.

MADDOWS: In the hotel room 23 guns, at his property in Mesquite another 19
guns. And we are told through other reporting sources that those were all
long guns. It was all rifles there. If he was using weird aftermarket
modifications on those guns, one of the problems for that for somebody who
wants to create maximum mayhem using those drum magazines or those other
modification is that they make your gun glitchy

Well you can solve that if can have 20 of them because then as soon as one
misfires you another, grab another. So if one misfires you grab another.
That makes the financial aspect here very interesting. It makes
technological aspect here very interesting in terms of what kind of weapons
he had access to and it makes the policy question very, very clearly guns
even before we know about his motivation or any connections to anybody
else. And we as a country decided to not talk about guns at least at the
Federal Level and so it leaves us mute in terms of whether or not we will
have a practical discussion.

O`DONNELL: Well then politically now the one thing other thing Republicans
anyway in Congress don`t want to talk about is silencers. They were moving
legislatively possibly as early as next week toward deregulating silencers
to make this worse because we heard Buzz Brainard saying they didn`t think
it was gunshots at first. It took a long time to realize it was a gunshots.

If there had been any kind of silencing capacity on this, what would it
have taken? They would have to see the bodies be falling before they will
have a sense of it at all. But the Republicans are pulling down that effort
to deregulate the silencers so that`s some movement.

MADDOWS: There`s been a lot of disinformation, not just misinformation but
disinformation about that today we ended up. When the NRA saying stuff
about how silencers wouldn`t have made a difference in terms of finding the
shooter. We ended up calling gun ranges and people who deal with, you
know, the kind of exotic weapons that you can pay money to shoot around
here. We just called people locally and talked to them about that. And
everybody told us, you can put silencers on that weapon and it would have
made a huge difference. Why you need silencers in this country instead of
just ear plugs to protect your hearing it means something that –

O`DONNELL: Yes, Chris?

HAYES: There`s a – Rachel and I have been talking about this. There`s
just an inscrutability in this. I mean you know the mental categories that
we have erected that we have now come to apply to events like this which
happen with the frequency in the United States and nowhere else in the
world have certain boxes that is we look for. So you know the idea that it
would be a terrorist attack from ISIS, that the idea of mentally disturbed
or if you had red flags or social media posts or some process of sort rage
filled dissent that happened and we`ll learn more.

But there is at one level there`s a desire to understand the motivation to
make - to make sense and some level there`s an essential inscrutability
about whatever the motivation will be. Standing here and looking at this
person did is so ghastly and so horrible and took such a combination of
planning and malevolence without any apparent animating reason that it is -
that we know of.

MADDOWS: At least that we know it.

HAYES: That we know of, yes. At least at this point it feels like it
plummets my capacity to because that`s –

O`DONNELL: Yes, one of the people on the stage yesterday and last night
was Caleb Keeter, one of the musicians in one of the bands. He today has
said I have been a lifelong proponent of the 2nd amendment, a strong
supporter. He said I cannot – these are his words. I cannot express how
wrong I was. He has completely reversed himself on this 2nd amendment
publicly today. And what`s really surprising about that is we normally
don`t have something like that to report after one of this event.

HAYES: No one ever changes their mind.

O`DONNELL: We can`t bring you the prominent person or the person involved
who changes their mind about it. It`s just an amazing thing.

HAYES: There was a man trying to murder a dozen Republican members of
Congress several months ago and there was no – I mean, they were on the –
they were there. They were on the receiving end of this, almost murdered,
one of the prominent Republicans in congress and nothing like that. And the
thing that Keeler said that`s key here, also, is one of the most perverse
notions in this conversation, taking aside all the policy rationals, the
legal questions, the 2nd amendment is some notion that if people have guns
then they will stop things like this.

MADDOWS: That if there had been more guns, that is a – he addresses that.

HAYES: Specifically to say -

MADDOWS: there are people who have concealed carry licenses, guns on our
tour buses all useless to us because of the insane amount of fire power
that he was able to put together. This is technology story and it – if
it`s going to be – going to be anything other than usual impotence on the
story it is a discussion about the technology that made this possible at a
policy level. And we forego that here at a moment like this.

O`DONNELL: Rachel, Chris thank you very much for doing this, really
appreciate you joining the discussion. Thank you very much. Thank you for
being here. Coming up, another survivor of what happened here will join
us and tell us what he experienced.



LAS VEGAS SHOOTING SURVIVOR: They cut the music and everyone said drop and
everyone dropped and then everyone just got up and they said run and
everyone started stampeding and charging and knocking over grills, jumping
over fences, getting out.

LAS VEGAS SHOOTING SURVIVOR: Clip after clip after clip, bullets flying
everywhere. Everybody running. It was really, really bad. We were the
furthest VIP stages away from Mandalay Bay and they were ricocheting
everywhere where we were. They were firing from somewhere high and they
were unloading clip after clip after clip after clip.


O`DONNELL: joining us now is Ken Dilanian, Intelligence and National
Security reporter for NBC news. Ken, what are we learning about this
arsenal, the numbers have been updated tonight, about just how much
weaponry this shooter had?

KEN DILANIAN, NBC REPORTER: That`s right, Lawrence. The authorities
updated it to 42 guns in total that Stephen Paddock allegedly purchased
including 23 that seized in the hotel and 19 in his separate house. And
you know, just stepping back, we have learned a lot of new facts today
about Stephen Paddock and much of what we have learned is utterly
confounding because while there is no one pattern of mass shooters, things
that we are learning about Stephen Paddock are completely different from
anything before. Starting with the fact according to his family he`s
wealthy and maybe worth as much as $2 million,

They say he`s been making his living as a professional gambler, a college
graduate. He had jobs as an auditor. He was living in a retirement
community with his Asian American girlfriend who he may have met at a
casino. And there`s no known criminal record, no known extremist beliefs.

Obviously were missing a big chunk here which is what authorities are going
to find on his computers and what he was up to. But we know that he was
living a life much more high functioning than many mass shooters we see and
he sort of brought a level of diabolical competence to this act with all
these firearms and also, you know, as Rachel and Chris were saying, the
automatic weapons question.

We don`t know yet whether he acquired a machine gun because you can
purchase a machine gun legally in Nevada if you register a pre-1986 machine
gun. Machine guns have been banned since 1986. But There are some that are
grandfathered in.

Secondly, you can get a semiautomatic weapon and modify it using things
that you can purchase over the internet for little as $50. We don`t know
yet whether he did either of those things but almost every expert we talked
to today said there was clearly automatic weapon fire in that recording.
And clearly that was of a key factor in the casualties here just the amount
of bullets this man was able to rain down on the crowd.

So a high functioning competent potentially well think person here,
gambling. Tens of thousands of dollars because of cash reports that casinos
were filing that the FBI had seen. But the key question is we don`t
understand are his state of mind, Lawrence.

O`DONNELL: And, Ken, for those of us who don`t own any guns, these numbers
sound extraordinary. But for collectors, and gun dealers, they – some I
have talked to, gun dealers, they deal with people who collect dozens of
guns, that they never use in any sort of dangerous way. And most of the
guns they never use at all. There are things that they just have kind of
on display and never bring to the range.

DILANIAN: You`re absolutely right. That is great point. But his brother
said in an interview today that Stephen Paddock was not a gun collector
that he knew of. He knew him to have a couple of handguns but not any real
experience with long guns.

No military experience so it does raise a question of whether he assembled
this arsenal purely for this act. And you know his wealth comes into play
here because these guns can cost hundreds or more than $1,000 and if he had
42 guns in total, it required a lot of financial resources to put that
arsenal together leaving aside the ammunition and other factors.

O`DONNELL: Ken, how helpful is the federal component of this

DILANIAN: Well, it`s crucial, Lawrence. I mean, in this kind of
situation, the Federal Government pulls out all the stops and this is a man
who lived in multiple states and has relatives around the country and the
FBI has been interviewing them and trying to put together a picture of what
may have led this man to do it. The mystery here, obviously, not
necessarily what happened and how it happened. That`s pretty obvious.

The mystery is why. And then I would say the secondary issue is, what gun
laws are implicated here with the automatic weapons issue? Did he acquire a
machine gun either legally or illegally? Did he modify a semiautomatic
legally or illegally? That`s a question going forward, Lawrence.

O`DONNELL: Ken, going forward, what is your sense of a timetable here?
What do you think we`ll know by the end of the week, by the end of next

DILANIAN: Well, you know, you and i were both watching that news
conference that authorities just had and conducted a search of a property
that the suspect had near Reno and you`ll notice they didn`t answer
questions of what they found there. They were asked what did you find on
his computers that shed light on motif ? They were coy and it suggested to
me they know some things they`re not prepared to say tonight but that in
the next day or maybe two days to learn a lot more about what was driving
this man.

O`DONNELL: Ken Dilanian, thank you very much for joining us tonight.
Really appreciate it.

DILANIAN: Thank you, lawrence.

O`DONNELL: Up next, another survivor of this horrible massacre will join


O`DONNELL: We`re joined now by Alex Rasmussen. He and his wife were
sitting about 50 feet from the stage when the gunfire erupted at that
concert in Las Vegas last night. Alex, thank you very much for joining us
tonight, really appreciate that you could do this for us. Tell us what you
experienced and when you realized this was shooting?

were right there close to the stage and the first set of gunshots went off
and to me, they sounded like gunshots. But no one really reacted in that
moment. The band continued to play and there was an assumption possibly
that maybe they were fireworks.

So at that moment, I was looking around trying to kind of gauge where the
closest exits were and trying to decide if we were in a good place to be
able to get out of there if something bad went down. That`s when the first
shots rang out. It wasn`t very much longer that the second shots rang out
and I was looking up at the stage and security had come and grabbed Jason
Aldean and pulled him off stage. I immediately grabbed my wife and headed
for the closest exit. So by that time it was just, get out alive.

O`DONNELL: Alex, the video we`re showing beside you on the screen is the
video that you took. When did you turn on the camera? Were you – did you
know you were safe at the point you turned on the camera?

RASMUSSEN: Amazingly enough, my wife took that footage. So we – my only
concern, the only thing I could even think about is getting her out,
getting her out safe and alive. She had somehow had the where with all to
pull out her camera and start recording.

But I was right there by her side. I didn`t realize she had the camera
going. It wasn`t until later on in the evening when we were going back
through the night we realized we even had that footage and went back and
watched it and realized how really quite disturbing it was and how you
continue to hear gunshot after gunshot. I mean, two, three minutes into the
video. This thing went on for what felt like eternity but a good, 15, 20

O`DONNELL: Alex, what did you say to your wife when you realized you had
to get out of there?

RASMUSSEN: It was a let`s go moment. I said we got to get out of here. We
got to go. And the band by that time had quit playing so the third set of
gunshots that rang out were so loud, Lawrence, they sounded like, you know,
you were 10 feet behind me shooting a gun at me. We took cover at that

There were bodies lying everywhere. 40, 50 people piled on top of each
other trying to stay safe. As soon as that gunfire stopped, I grabbed her
and we took off. It was a stampede style environment where people were
running over people, pushing through barriers, knocking things over.

It was the most chaos I`ve ever been part of. She tripped and fell
multiple times but each time I kind of grabbed her, scooped her back out of
there. The video starts once we`re outside of the venue on the backside of
the venue away from the Mandalay Bay. We thought the shooter was in the
park and I know a lot of other people did, too, and I think a lot of people
fled to the gates at the Mandalay Bay in what had to be a massacre scene
over there.

We never saw what happened over there on that side of the stage and on Las
Vegas Boulevard in front of Mandalay Bay. But there were multiple people
shot over on the side we were at. People were fleeing the scene, running,
just trying to get out alive. It was pure chaos, Lawrence.

O`DONNELL: And Alex, at what point did you decide or realize that you
were safe, that you had reached a safety zone?

RASMUSSEN: So we headed back towards the strip and ended up over at the
MGM. We saw people flooding out of the MGM and this is what I really – I
really want to get this out there, Lawrence. We hopped into a cab and
turned on police scanners and there were reports of multiple shooters in
multiple hotels.

There were people fleeing from all hotels in the area. I know this has come
out more and more as we`ve seen the news throughout the day, one shooter
and one person pinned down. But I don`t wholly believe that story. There
was shots coming from everywhere, from all over the place and I know that
because we had made it back up to the strip and there were people running
from the MGM apparently, you know, running from bullet fire or running for
some reason, running for their lives.

So once we got into that cab and had turned around away from the backside
of the MGM and headed up towards Sammy Davis Jr. Boulevard that runs behind
the strip, I felt in that moment we would not be shot or die at that

O`DONNELL: And you got yourself completely out of Las Vegas last night,
didn`t you?

RASMUSSEN: We did, because Lawence again just like I was telling you over
the police scanners, we`re hearing that there are multiple gunmen. There
was a report of a bomb at New York, New York.

So the city of Vegas was chaos in the moment because we were staying on the
strip up on the north end. So all we wanted to do is get back to our hotel
room and bunker down if that was the case that Vegas went on a lockdown but
we got to the room. We immediately packed our things and headed back down
to the lobby, got a cab and headed to the airport. We were able to reserve
a rental car and immediately got in the rental car and drove to Phoenix,
Arizona. We were out of Vegas by midnight last night.

O`DONNELL: And you flew home to Tennessee from Phoenix?

RASMUSSEN: That`s right. So we booked the first flight out of Phoenix we
could get on the way to Phoenix we booked the flights, flew Phoenix to
Dallas this morning and Dallas to Memphis this afternoon and made it home
safely about 3:30 central time today.

O`DONNELL: You had your children waiting for you. What did you tell your
children about this when you got home?

RASMUSSEN: well, you know, my younger children, you know, I want to
answer their question, we have an open, honest household. We`re letting
them know we were in a scary situation and we were running for our lives
and it was something that, you know, that we were trying to explain to them
in the best way possible.

My 16-year-old son was very well aware of what was going on. So we had to,
you know, so I had to talk to him with that. He`s still shaken and upset
about it as you can imagine, as we are, as well.

O`DONNELL: Alex Rasmussen thank you for sharing your experience with us
and our best to your wife and our regards to your family and hope you can
hold hands and get through this. Really appreciate you joining us.

RASMUSSEN: Thank You, Lawrence.

O`DONNELL: Thank You. I`ll be back here live from Las Vegas in two hours,
but right now the 11th Hour with Brian Williams is next


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