PoliticsNation with Al Sharpton, Transcript 10/16/2016

Lis Smith, Susan Del Percio, David Birdsell, Terry O`Neill, Aubrey Hendricks, Marcia Fudge

Date: October 16, 2016
Guest: Lis Smith, Susan Del Percio, David Birdsell, Terry O`Neill, Aubrey
Hendricks, Marcia Fudge


UNIDENTIFIED MALE: The Trump meltdown. Lashing out at his accusers.

DONALD TRUMP, PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: They`re horrible, horrible liars.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: And facing questions of basic decency.

talk about women like this.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: With the final debate just three days away, how low
will he go? How should Clinton respond?


UNIDENTIFIED MALE: And why a republican leader is still standing by Trump,
the election just 23 days away. From Rockefeller Center in New York, this
is “PoliticsNation” with Al Sharpton.

AL SHARPTON, MSNBC ANCHOR: Good morning. I`m Al Sharpton. Three days
before the final debate, Donald Trump`s campaign is imploding. He`s at war
with Hillary Clinton. He`s at war with the GOP. And he`s at war with the
women accusing him of inappropriate sexual behavior. In the face of sexual
allegations, he is defiant, denying any wrongdoing.

TRUMP: I am being viciously attacked with lies and smears. It is a phony
deal. When you look at that horrible woman last night, you said, I don`t
think so. Your stories are total fiction. They`re 100 percent made up.
They never happened. They never would happen. She`s a liar. She is a
liar. She`s writing a story, check out her Facebook page, you`ll
understand. Believe me, she would not be my first choice, that I can tell

SHARPTON: Trump attacking the women`s claims and apparently attacking
their looks. But the accusers haven`t been intimidated into silence.

JESSICA LEEDS, TRUMP ACCUSER: It was a real shock when all of a sudden his
hands were all over me. He started encroaching on my space. And I
hesitate to use this expression, but I`m going to, and that is he was like
an octopus, it was like he had six arms.

KRISTIN ANDERSON, TRUMP ACCUSER: This is the vivid part for me. So the
person on my right, who unbeknownst to me at that time was Donald Trump put
their hand up my skirt.

SUMMER ZERVOS, TRUMP ACCUSER: I pushed his chest to put space between us
and I said, “Come on, man, get real.” He repeated my words back to me.
Get real. As he began thrusting his genitals.

SHARPTON: The accusations coming days after that 2005 tape surfaced with
Trump`s obscene comments. This past week, Michelle Obama said out loud
what many Americans were thinking.

MICHELLE OBAMA: It has shaken me to my core in a way that I couldn`t have
predicted. Strong men, men who are truly role models don`t need to put
down women to make themselves feel powerful. Now is the time for all of us
to stand up and say enough is enough.

SHARPTON: We`ve never seen a moment like this in a presidential campaign,
and nobody knows what will happen in the third and final debate.

Joining me now is Terry O`Neill, President of the National Organization for
Women. She has endorsed Hillary Clinton. Thanks for being here, Terry.

great to talk with you, Reverend Al.

SHARPTON: What`s your response to Trump`s attacks on the integrity and the
looks of his accusers?

O`NEILL: Well, you know, honestly, that`s not the way to get women votes.
The – what he has done is to further and further and further alienate
women voters. It was bad enough that he`s been running a campaign that is
promoting racist and xenophobic and misogynistic policies. Now we see him
as a misogynistic individual, attacking individual women, bragging about
his ability to sexually assault women and then telling Anderson Cooper at
the second debate that he does not understand that what he was describing
was sexual assault. When, of course it was sexual assault.

Now he stands accused by nearly a dozen women of exactly the same kind of
assault that he bragged about to Billy Bush in the “Access Hollywood”
video. So it`s no wonder that his campaign is imploding. And –

SHARPTON: But while it is imploding, I want to raise another factor in
this to you, Terry, because the national organization of women has started
a petition calling on House Speaker Paul Ryan and the senate majority
leader McConnell to un-endorse him.

Are you surprised that such republican leadership seems to be sticking with
him through all of this?

O`NEILL: See, I honestly, Reverend Al, I have been trying to understand
why they don`t un-endorse him. If they have any integrity, they would. So
you have to ask yourself, I`ve been asking myself, I`ve been asking my now
leaders around the country, my staff, what is going on in the minds of Paul
Ryan and Mitch McConnell.

And quite frankly what I`m hearing back is, look, these are men that
already have supported viciously anti-woman policies. So maybe it`s not
that much of a stretch for these men to stand next to a man who engages in
this misogynistic and assaultive behavior towards women since Paul Ryan and
Mitch McConnell and Mike Pence have all promoted policies that absolutely
harm women`s well-being and their health and very often their very lives.

SHARPTON: Well, let me bring this up. This data. Because an election
forecast shows if only women voted, Hillary Clinton would sweep the
Electoral College. And if only men voted, Trump would win. We`ve seen
some on the right have jokingly called for the repealing of the 19th
amendment which really gave women the right to vote. What do you think of
all this?

O`NEILL: Well, I loved some of the people on the left mocking the right
wing guys saying, oh, no, we have to repeal the 19th Amendment. Look, I
hope in the next 21 days, the men of this country come to their senses and
vote against Donald Trump as well. And it`s not just because he`s a
misogynist personally and has attacked – allegedly attacked women and his
defenses against it have not been credible.

It`s not just because his policies are viciously as I said racist and
xenophobic and misogynistic. They should vote for Hillary Clinton because
her policies will provide debt free college for our kids and our neighbors`
kids. She will provide an increase in the minimum wage. She`s going to
shore up social security and make sure that it`s there for all of us as we

So there`s a wonderful candidate to vote for, and that is what I hope
obviously the women of this country have already begun to see that and are
– and are flocking to her quite frankly and flocking away from Donald
Trump. I`m hoping the men will get there.

SHARPTON: All right. I`m going to have to leave it there. Terry O`Neill,
thank you, always, for your time.

O`NEILL: Thank you.

SHARPTON: Joining me now are Lis Smith, former deputy campaign manager for
the Martin O`Malley campaign. Obery Hendricks, a professor and senior
fellow from the opportunity agenda of social justice organization. And
republican strategist Susan Del Percio. Thank you all for being here.

SUSAN DEL PERCIO: Great to be here.


SHARPTON: Susan, just as a question of political strategy, was this
Trump`s best option, to attack his accusers` looks?

SUSAN DEL PERCIO, REPUBLICAN STRATEGIST: It absolutely was not. And going
just against, sitting on the strategy for a minute, it makes absolutely no
sense. He made his last few rallies all about him. That`s all he`s
focusing on is trying to defend himself from this. If he actually wanted
to make a difference, he would at least move to a couple of issues and I
believe earlier this week Donald Trump even made a mention that my staff
wants me to talk about jobs and trade.

But I`m here to talk about, you know, what – that these are false claims,
because it`s all about him and this is no doubt a strategy that will only
cause more problems and it may even do something that Hillary Clinton
cannot do, motivate voters, moderate republican voters to actually vote for

SHARPTON: Now, Professor Hendricks, there is questions of decency and
morality beyond the politics. And I think that that is some of what Susan
alludes to with moderate republicans. Do you think even at some point some
of his supporters might abandon him for those factors?

HENDRICKS: You know, from what I`m hearing and reading and what I`m seeing
in the interviews of the supporters, few of them are going to leave.
They`re not really – they might be put off by this, but my opinion, they
stick with Trump because Trump hates who they hate. And Trump will put
down those that they think should be put down. So they`re not staying with
him for reasons. Many of them are not staying him for reasons of decency.
Also, he`s gotten folks so afraid that – with his messianic talk been
afraid that if he doesn`t get in, that the sky is going to fall in. I
mean, it`s – I think it`s really that –

SHARPTON: The fear factor and who they hate and that has them really not
looking at the other things that I would raise or others might raise?

HENDDRICKS: Exactly. Because he`s actually made people forget about what
democracy is. It`s not about justice anymore. It`s just about just us and
that`s his appeal, I think.

SHARPTON: You know, Lis, he`s even appeared to go after Hillary Clinton`s
looks. Listen to this.


TRUMP: But I`m standing at my podium, and she walks in front of me.
Right? She walks in front of me. You know. And when she walked in front
of me, believe me, I wasn`t impressed. But she walks in front of me.


SHARPTON: I mean, do these kind of arguments do more harm than good?

you know, Susan is a republican. I`m a democrat.

SHARPTON: I mean, how do you take that seriously?

SMITH: I know and –

SHARPTON: Aside from it being so denigrating.

SMITH: If he`s trying to attract any women voters he`s going about it all
wrong. Attacking a woman`s looks, bringing up and blaming Hillary Clinton
for the sins of her husband, you know, doing that and that spectacle he did
before the last debate, I think makes her very sympathetic figure. And
will help rally women of all political stripes around her.

And frankly, we did see this happen in the late `90s when these things came
up. So it`s – I don`t think that he`s very strategic in doing this. I
think he`s just throwing out there, what he wants to throw out there. It`s
very offensive and it`s not going to win over –

DEL PERCIO: That`s the interesting point. You know, we talk about when
Trump started to close the gap a little bit, he`s always been behind. But
he was up to getting 90 percent of republican voters. After this, we`re
going to see him and we saw it in previous months, he will now go back down
to getting about 75 percent of republican voters.

SHARPTON: Which is not enough.

DEL PERCIO: Which is not even close enough. And then we`re not even going
to talk about Hillary Clinton`s gains with independents. So this strategy
is about Donald Trump. He simply does not care about the party or the
country or what`s going to happen afterwards. He will move on. And he`s
trying to probably define himself for his next gig, whatever that may be,
instead of focusing on –

SHARPTON: But it goes back to what you said, professor, because we`ve had
some Trump supporters come on MSNBC. I want to play you some. And they
back his accuser`s story and they`ve been backing him and they push him
back against the accuser`s story. Watch this.


JOE SCARBOROUGH, MSNBC ANCHOR: Do you believe these women are lying or
not? Nobody is trying to paint you as a bad guy. We just want an answer.
Straight talk.

BEN CARSON, RETIRED NEUROSURGEON: It doesn`t matter whether they`re lying
or not.

KATTY KAY, BBC PRESENTER: Of course, these are allegations that have been
absolutely discredited. The woman, for example, misleads, who talked about
being groped on a plane by some man that she sat next to in first class.
I`m sure you probably know that armrests don`t go up in first class.

A.J. DELGADO, FORMER MEDIAITE COLUMNIST: These allegations are decades
old. If somebody actually did that, Chris, any reasonable women would have
come forward and said something.


SHARPTON: They`re pushing back on this. These are his supporters. These
are Dr. Ben Carson. These are people that are in politics, and very
prominent in some circles.

HENDRICKS: You know, they suspended reason. And one has to ask, why would
so many people become so irrational? And it has to do with the rationality
of his appeal. He is appealing to the very lowest denominator in terms of
political acumen, but also in terms of decency in the American people and
that`s very frightening that this man can get so many people to follow him
that he could shoot down Fifth Avenue, and kill someone and they still
follow him. That does not all go well for our democracy.

SHARPTON: But, you know, when you see this, Lis, and you see the pushback
of some of the more well-known supporters, and you hear the supporters that
I played, Trump seems to like – he seems in many ways enjoy or feel that
he has all of the support of his people that this doesn`t faze him.

SMITH: Right. And, well, this is the thing. This is who these appeals
appeal to. It`s people who are motivated by bloodlust against the
Clintons, people who are motivated by their own Clinton derangement
syndrome and it`s been going on for 20 years. Remember this from the `90s.
And – but this is it. It`s just – it`s a small group of people and it`s
not going to help him expand his base.

SHARPTON: Susan, let me ask you, we have a debate in three days. Final
debate. Is this going to get ugly in your opinion?

DEL PERCIO: I don`t even know if this country can handle a third debate.
I really don`t. It will most likely be one of the – ugliest to date. If
it`s possible for things to go worse and be more aggressive on Donald
Trump, it will. Unless Donald Trump does something and surprises us all.
I mean, I don`t expect him to. I think it will be again very hard for
Hillary Clinton to manage to come out of this a little more likable, which
is always her goal, but if Donald Trump is left up to his own devices, I
think, you know, she`ll win by default.

SHARPTON: Lis, Obery, Susan, stay with me. We`ve got a lot more to talk

Up next, republican leaders getting called out for letting Donald Trump

BARACK OBAMA, UNITED STATES PRESIDENT: They`ve been riding this tiger for
a long time. They`ve been feeding their base all kinds of crazy for years.

SHARPTON: Also, Trump`s dangerous claim that the election is being stolen
from him. And why the final debate in Las Vegas could be the most
explosive yet.


BARACK OBAMA: Donald Trump didn`t build all this crazy conspiracy stuff.
And some republicans who knew better stood by silently and even during the
course of this campaign didn`t say anything because it was a way to rile up
their base.

SHARPTON: President Obama accusing republican leaders of standing by and
letting Trump happen. This past week, he also had tough words for
republicans who condemned trump`s language against women. But refused to
un-endorse him.

BARACK OBAMA: The fact that now you`ve got people saying, well, we
strongly disapprove, we really disagree, we find those comments disgusting,
but we`re still endorsing him, we still think he should be president, that
doesn`t make sense to me.

SHARPTON: He`s probably talking about people like Speaker Paul Ryan who
slammed Trump`s comments but did not withdraw his endorsement. Trump
wasn`t happy with Mr. Ryan.

TRUMP: I think we should get support and we don`t get the support from
guys like Paul Ryan. Look, I don`t want his support. I don`t care about
his support. I wouldn`t want to be in a foxhole with a lot of these
people, including Ryan, especially Ryan.


SHARPTON: Again, Trump`s attacks are aimed at a man who is still endorsing
him. And that`s the problem for republicans. Trump`s implosion is
threatening to wipe out GOP majorities in both the house and senate. And
GOP lawmakers don`t know what to do about it. Several have endorsed Trump,
then unendorsed him, then re-endorsed him, despite the allegations and
accusations swirling against him.

Joining me now is Congresswoman Marcia Fudge, democrat from Ohio who was at
that rally in Cleveland with President Obama. Thank you for being here,

Thank you so much for having me. It`s my pleasure.

SHARPTON: President Obama accused republicans, congresswoman, of standing
by while Trump gained influence. Let me ask you, when you talk to your GOP
colleagues in congress, do they – do you sense that they`re finally aware
of their own role in this?

FUDGE: Reverend, I will tell you, they`ve been aware of it for some time.
If you look at the numbers of my colleagues who refuse to even come to
Cleveland for the republican convention, you can tell very, very clearly
they wanted to have nothing to do with the mess they had made. So they`ve
known for some time. They`re just afraid of their right flank, or they`re
afraid of being attacked by Donald Trump and so they say nothing and they
do nothing.

SHARPTON: Well, let me be more direct. Let me ask you about people,
republicans, like Speaker Ryan, who has said he condemns what Trump says,
yet he`s still endorsing him and still saying he`s going to vote for him.
I mean, how do you deal with that?

FUDGE: You know, it`s the same kind of hypocrisy we deal with every day in
the House of Representatives. They will say one thing and do another.
They`re hypocrites. All of them. They understand how devastating and
detrimental it would be to have a Trump presidency. But because they have
decided that they want to put party over patriotism and they have decided
that under no circumstances will we continue the legacy of President Barack
Obama, they`re willing to do everything, I say that they`re willing to sink
the entire ship just to take down the captain.

SHARPTON: Now, we are – have a lot of focus on presidential campaign, but
the down ballot races will determine the senate and the congress. And you
have any number of members of the house republicans where you serve as a
democrat that have endorsed him, un-endorsing him, trying to make their
distance from him, but at the same time try not to offend some of the Trump
supporters. I mean, what do you make of this?

FUDGE: I tell you, reverend, the only way to make sense out of it is to
know that the American people see what is going on. I think that they have
miscalculated that we will stay at home, or that we will be so turned off
that we`ll just do anything that they want us to do. I think what is going
to happen, reverend, is that we are going to take back the senate. I
believe that we have strong candidates and we have candidates of conviction
and honesty and courage, unlike their candidates.

SHARPTON: Let me press you right there, congresswoman. Because some
democratic candidates have kind of tried to do exactly what you`re saying
in the ads. Let me show you this.


UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Is this our next president?

TRUMP: I just start kissing them. It`s like a magnet.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Lloyd Smucker thinks so.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: On the day we saw the real Donald Trump, Darrell Issa
decided to join Trump`s campaign.

TRUMP: When you`re a star, they let you do it, do anything.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Would you point to him as a role model?

KELLY AYOTTE, AMERICAN POLITICIAN: Absolutely, I would do that.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Congressman Hurd waited until it was too late to speak
out about Donald Trump.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Mike Gallagher still says we have to support Donald
Trump. No, we don`t. We don`t have to support Mike Gallagher either.


SHARPTON: So we`re seeing some democrats in ads saying, wait a minute, and
tying the candidates on the down ballot kind of races, senate and congress,
right back to Donald Trump.

FUDGE: Absolutely right. And I think that they should well tie him to his
– to their candidate. When you have a standard bearer like Donald Trump,
again, where are the standards? He has no standard. He has no standard of
decency. He has no standard of respect. He has no standard of even
understanding how this country runs or even wanting to understand. And so
I think they should be tied to the candidate they`re supporting. Just as
we, for many years, the last eight at least, been tied to our president,
who, by the way, has one of the highest approval ratings of any president
in history.

So, yes, they should tie him to it, but I do want to say to people, do not
be discouraged. I understand that it looks dark now, but things are going
to get better if we get out and do what we know we need to do to make this
country the kind of country we all want to wake up and say we live in on
November 9th.

SHARPTON: Congresswoman Marcia Fudge, thank you for your time this

FUDGE: Thank you so much for having me. I appreciate it.

SHARPTON: Still ahead, is Trump trying to convince people not to accept a
Clinton victory?

TRUMP: We have to make sure that this election is not stolen from us.

SHARPTON: Also, the first two debates have been shocking. And historic.
So, what should we expect from this week`s final debate?


TRUMP: I just hear such reports about Philadelphia. And we have to make
sure we`re protected. We have to make sure that this election is not
stolen from us and is not taken away from us.

And everybody knows what I`m talking about.

AL SHARPTON, MSNBC ANCHOR: Donald Trump trying to incite fears that the
election will be stolen from him. In recent weeks he`s repeatedly called
on supporters to become poll watchers. It`s interesting what he says, but
also where he says it.

TRUMP: Go pick some other place and go sit there with your friends and
make sure it`s on the up and up. Go and watch these polling places, make
sure it`s on the up and up.

SHARPTON: That was in Michigan, it`s 73 percent white. It`s just a half
hour drive from Detroit, which is 90 percent black or Latino. It would
sure be easy for someone to go with their friends to be a trump poll
watcher in Detroit. Here`s another one.

TRUMP: You got to watch your polling booths, because I hear too many
stories about Pennsylvania. Certain areas. I hear too many bad stories,
and we can`t lose an election because of you know what I`m talking about.
So go over and watch. And watch carefully.

SHARPTON: That was in Manheim, Pennsylvania. It`s 88 percent white. One
of those certain areas that Trump is talking about is Philadelphia, it`s
less than an hour and a half away, and 55 percent black or Latino. Trump
knows what he`s doing. He knows how his comments will be interpreted. In
fact, he wants people to sign up to be, quote, “election monitors” right
there on his website.

Coming up, we`ll talk about how Trump is trying to undermine the legitimacy
of this election. But, first, I want Trump to know that I know what he`s
doing. So nice try. But we got you.


UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: For me, personally, if Hillary Clinton gets in, I
myself, I`m ready for a revolution because we can`t have her in.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: You know, don`t say that.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: If she gets elected, there could be – it could be a
corrupt issue that causes the election that causes her to win.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: I think people are going to rise up because we`re
tired of taking it. We`re all second amendment pros.

SHARPTON: Donald Trump has galvanized some of his supporters into
believing that the left is plotting to steal the election from him. In
many cases, supporters are just repeating what they`ve heard trump say

someone with the temperament of Donald Trump is not in charge of the law in
our country.

TRUMP: Because you`d be in jail.

SHARPTON: A lot of Trump voters are now leaving in a right wing bubble,
filled with anger, conspiracy theories, and the belief that Trump is
winning the election. Let`s bring back the panel, Lis Smith, Obery
Hendricks and Susan Del Percio.

Susan, what do you make of all this talk of rising up with the revolution
if Clinton wins?

happen. And, you know, one thing in this country we do transition power
very well, every four years or sometimes eight years. What you`re hearing
in those clips are people who probably also believe Barack Obama wasn`t
born in this country.

So there is a small minority of Trump supporters who are very vocal who say
these things. It`s really important to recognize that a large majority of
not just voters, but republicans, do not believe this election is being
rigged by Hillary Clinton. They don`t buy into all of these conspiracy
theories. Is it a horrible narrative for the republicans to have out
there? Absolutely. But it`s just not going to be the case.

SHARPTON: Professor, though, Bill O`Reilly`s website, let me go to that.
He asked his fans who he thought – who they thought would win the election
in a nonscientific survey. Trump got 86 percent. They said would win.
Clinton 14 percent. So the right wing bubble has led Trump supporters to
think he will win. What happens if he doesn`t win?

OBERY HENDRICKS, PROFESSOR: That`s the point. I think the difference
between Obama`s election, even though he`s a black man, there was some
pushback, but there was not anyone whipping up the kind of anger and
vitriol and total delegitimation of the government.

SHARPTON: McCain had a much different tone.

DEL PERCIO: But there were people out there who`s certainly –

HENDRICKS: But we`re talking about the candidate. We have a candidate
who`s been on T.V. for years, and he`s flamboyant, he`s known as a
billionaire, I don`t know if he is or not, and he has so much credibility
and visibility with these people, and he`s whipping them up. They`re
stealing from us, taking over the country, there is an international
conspiracy to take it from us and they`re whipping these people up and
listen to them. They`re talking about taking the country over. One guy
said when they – one of the protesters, we might have to kill him next

SHARPTON: But, Lis, that – my point is, he`s not going anywhere if he
loses. And neither are some of the right wing radio and T.V. Are they
going to keep whipping this up and then does this put some of the right
wing and tea party congressmen to where they will obstruct Mrs. Clinton if
she`s a winner, has, like, they`ve Obama because they can`t go against the
noise machine of the right wing? I mean, are we looking for a very
volatile time, no matter what happens in this election?

I don`t think people are going to take up arms, but we do – we have seen
historical precedent for this. And it was what the right wing did after
President Obama was elected where they went, you know, tried every day to
delegitimize him. Look, she`s not black. They can`t go out there and say
that, you know, she was born in Kenya, so what they`re trying to do is
delegitimize her as president by saying that the election was rigged,
before it even started.

The irony, of course, is that if you want to talk about election rigging,
it`s republican governors who are going out there and trying to suppress
the vote, make sure that, you know, people of color, women, low-income
people, disabled people can`t turn out to vote because they can`t get –

SHARPTON: Well, following that up, professor, Trump himself is kind of
defended himself from his accusers by talking of global conspiracy. Watch


TRUMP: I knew these false attacks would come. I knew this day would
arrive. It`s only a question of when. This is a conspiracy against you,
the American people and we cannot let this happen or continue.


SHARPTON: So now the accusers that have come out on these accusations
against his inappropriate behavior is part of some conspiracy. The
election is rigged. I mean, we`re dealing with a very toxic kind of
environment here politically.

HENDRICKS: Despicable demagogic liar. Let`s put it out there. He`s not
just telling falsehoods. He is the worst kind of liar and he`s even
talking about – he`s going so far, he`s talking about a world conspiracy,
a new world order, but the difference is he has so empowered the white
supremacists and the nuts and saying that it`s okay to be what you are and
they are – they`ve never been this thrilled ever before. And I say maybe
the emancipation proclamation. And now all of a sudden, they`re all
speaking out and they`re coalescing and I think it`s going to be much more
dangerous after the election, no matter who wins.

SHARPTON: That`s my fear. That`s what I`m raising. Susan, in that
atmosphere, what responsibility does Mitch McConnell and Paul Ryan and the
leadership of the Republican Party even in the congress do, do they have
any responsibility to deal with this kind of fervor that`s being whipped

DEL PERCIO: Well, they do to an extent as leaders in the house and in
senate, they`re also worried about keeping their majorities in the house
and the senate. And then going forward, they will have to learn how to
govern responsibly. Right now, it is very likely Hillary Clinton will be
the next president.

And, yes, there will be problems on the right with the freedom caucus and
Paul Ryan. However, there will also be a lot of problems on the left with
Bernie Sanders, our revolution group. They are looking to be an aggressive
left pitch, the equivalent of the right on the left to really stop her and
other –

SHARPTON: So what can Hillary Clinton do, Lis, to fight this battle of
those that are way out there on the right, and maybe even some that Susan
says will be on the left, I don`t hear the same vitriol and the same we`re
going to rise up from them. But what can she do to fight this whole
atmosphere on the right that all of us are concerned.

I`m alarmed for the record, because I don`t know if we can ban any more
obstruction as well as groups, you know, that are talking the way they`re
talking. But what can Hillary Clinton do?

SMITH: Well, I think the right bears a lot more responsibility for how
they conduct themselves after the election. I think what she can do is
make a clear play and reach out across the aisle to Mitch McConnell, Paul
Ryan, and say, you know, realistically, politically, you guys created this
monster, this monster turned on you, I want to work with you, and get
things done. And work with you guys in good faith. I think that`s really
the only thing that she can do. but –

SHARPTON: Sunday morning, you keeping faith and keeping hope alive. Lis,
Obery, Susan, thank you. I`m going to have to leave it there.

Up next, what Donald Trump has been saying about the moderator of the final
debate, it might surprise you.


CLINTON: This is not an ordinary time and this is not an ordinary
election. We are going to be choosing a president who will set policy for
not just for eight years, but because of some of the important decisions we
have to make at home and around the world and the supreme court and energy
and so much else.

SHARPTON: A clip from Ellen that shows how folks probably wish the last
debate had gone. Wednesday night, millions of people will watch Trump and
Clinton square off for the third and final debate. It may be Trump`s last
chance to save his sinking campaign. An NBC poll shows Clinton won the
first debate by 31 points. She won the second debate by ten points, which
explains why Trump has been going after the debate commission itself.

TRUMP: You know that so-called commission on presidential debates, the
head guy used to work for Bill Clinton. Did you know that? I just found
that out. The head guy worked for Bill Clinton. What a rigged deal this
is. But here`s the story. I have no respect for that group, by the way.
I have none.

SHARPTON: It`s true one co-chair used to be Bill Clinton`s press
secretary. But the other co-chair was the head of the republican national
committee. There`s always one republican and one democrat. The truth is,
on Wednesday, trump will have no one to blame for his performance but

Now, let`s bring in our debate expert David Birdsell, Dean of the Austin
Marxe School of Public Affairs at Baruch College. Thank you for being here

COLLEGE: Great pleasure.

SHARPTON: How do you expect Trump to talk about all the sexual allegations
in the debate?

BIRDSELL: Well, I think he`s going to say that he`s being set up. He`s
going to continue the conspiracy theory line. Trump is clearly doubling
down on this notion that he`s a victim and that that victim edge is
identical to the experience of the people who are supporting him who may
have lost jobs and maybe suffering another ways.

So as long as he can put himself out there that seems to be the strategy
that he`s latching onto and I think we`ll hear it on Wednesday again.

SHARPTON: Let me show this to you. He not only has bashed the commission,
he`s actually bashed, well, let me show you what he said about the
moderator for this last debate, Chris Wallace.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: The last one is Chris Wallace, he`s fair, right?

TRUMP: He`s fair. He`s tough. He`s fair. And I don`t mind, as long as
he`s fair and I`ve done a lot of work with Chris, and I`ve never had a
problem with him.


SHARPTON: Now, he`s bashed the other moderators. But he hasn`t bashed
this – the Fox guy. That`s interesting because when I said listen to how
he bashes moderators, I`m talking about the past. He did not do that when
he was questioned about this one and he`s from Fox, Chris Wallace.

BIRDSELL: Well, and we`ll see if that holds up in the debate because he
tends to be angrier with the moderators after the debate if he perceives
there was any unfairness and right now he`s building up a whole narrative
that this entire campaign, the commission itself, debate formats and the
audiences are unfair.

SHARPTON: And the moderators.

BIRDSELL: And the moderators.

SHARPTON: Well, what is Hillary Clinton`s best strategy for this last

BIRDSELL: To try to stay above it all. She quoted Michelle Obama, when
they go low, we go high. She needs to be back in that mode, but also
explaining coherently what will surely be tough questions from Chris
Wallace about the e-mail servers, about her positions on immigration, that
might be problematic with some of the republican audiences who don`t like
Donald Trump whom she would like to have vote for her or stay home. She
doesn`t need to give them more red meat and perhaps push them back into his

SHARPTON: Now, one thing I noted is that the debate audience dropped from
the first to the second. First debate had 84 million viewers, the second
67 million. Does that mean some voter are getting turned off by the ugly
tone this race has taken and especially when you hear the president saying
that maybe that`s Trump`s goal to make people just so disgusted they won`t

BIRDSELL: Well, that could be true. Historically we see the largest
viewership typically in that first debate or a couple of exceptions. So
this trends with those averages. It`s also the case that a lot of people
who saw that first debate began to make up their minds. And so the second
debate became for those who had made up their minds less important, they
know which lever they`re going to pull.

SHARPTON: Each debate seems to get weirder and weirder. Should we be
ready for the unexpected Wednesday night?

BIRDSELL: I think we should be looking for the WWE SmackDown. I think
Trump is going to come out with both guns blazing and it is going to be an
ugly debate. The question is, can he contain himself and continue to make
policy points? Can she stay above the fray?

SHARPTON: David Birdsell, thanks. And remember, watch the debate
Wednesday night at 9:00 P.M. eastern right here on MSNBC.

Up next, are you waiting for Election Day? Well, in a lot of states it`s
already here. We`ll talk about that next.


SHARPTON: A high school marching band in Cleveland, Ohio, out before dawn
to celebrate the start of early voting. I`ve had teenagers. I know how
hard it is to wake them up early. So if the kids in that marching band
could drag themselves out of bed to participate in our democracy, why can`t

Voting has already started in 16 states. A total of 35 states will have
the option of early voting before Election Day. So there`s no excuse. You
need to vote if you want your leaders to focus on the issues that matter to
you. Issues like Haiti. Over a thousand people were killed by hurricane
Matthew. But no one here is talking about it. It didn`t even come up
during last – the last presidential debate. You want to deal with issues
at home, issues like policing which didn`t come up, issues like mass
incarceration, the future of affordable housing. Don`t complain about it.
It`s time to vote about it.

That does it for me. Thanks for watching. I`ll see you back here next



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