Show: MTP DAILY Date: June 20, 2017 Guest: Jim Galloway, Steve Stivers, Eli Stokols, Ramesh Ponnuru, Ruth Marcus, Mark Warner, Aditi Roy
CHUCK TODD, MSNBC HOST: Hi, Nicolle. Happy -- it`s my Monday, your Tuesday.
NICOLLE WALLACE, MSNBC HOST: Happy your Monday. We`ll live on your schedule. That`s fine.
TODD: Fair enough. Thank you.
If it`s Tuesday, somebody`s voting somewhere. Ah, the music. And tonight, that somewhere could have major national implications.
(voice-over): Tonight, ticking down to the final buzzer in Georgia.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
JON OSSOFF (D), GEORGIA CONGRESSIONAL CANDIDATE: I`m feeling pretty good about the outcome tonight.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
TODD: Will Democrats finally put a win on the board in Georgia`s special election or will Republicans and Lucy hold the football again?
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
KAREN HANDEL (R), GEORGIA CONGRESSIONAL CANDIDATE: Special elections are called special elections for a reason. This is essentially a jump ball.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
TODD: Plus, exactly how widespread were Russia`s hacking attacks? The top Democrat on the Senate Intel Committee wants to know and wants all of us to know.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
SEN. MARK WARNER (D), VIRGINIA: So far, only two states have come forward.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
TODD: I`ll go one on one tomorrow with Mark Warner ahead of tomorrow`s new round of Russia hearings.
And later, American Otto Warmbier died due to his treatment in a North Korean prison. What should the U.S. do to retaliate?
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
DONALD TRUMP, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: It`s a total disgrace what happened to Otto. That should never, ever be allowed to happen.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
TODD: This is MTP DAILY and it starts right now.
(on camera): Well, good evening. I`m Chuck Todd here in Washington and welcome to MTP DAILY.
Voters are headed to the polls right now in the highly anticipated historically expensive special election. It`s a very special election in Georgia Sixth Congressional District between Democrat Jon Ossoff and Republican Karen Handel.
The victorious candidate will become a member of the U.S. House of Representatives and his or her party will score a major victory. The other party will receive a loud wake-up call and the issue of health care will be shaken up regardless of who comes out on top.
So, let`s run through the stakes. If Ossoff falls short of flipping this seat, Democrats will see their best chance of a special election win slip through their fingers probably for an entire calendar year. It will mean Democrats couldn`t beat a non-incumbent candidate in a highly-educated district where Donald Trump struggled in November. And that was before he was officially under investigation.
Democratic donors who will likely be livid (ph) at wasting millions and a losing effort, they could exasperate the ongoing ideological fight within the party. A more progressive wing may object to another centrist-backed candidate by the party establishment, losing what appears to be a winnable race.
Now, if Handel loses, Republicans are going to the 2018 mid-term elections with a bitter taste in their mouths from the close loss and without a certain political strategy. A Handel loss could also be seen as a tangible rebuke to the Trump presidency and it would be another negative headline to heap onto the Russia investigation and the party`s legislative challenge.
But perhaps the biggest ramification of today`s race could be on the fight over health care. A Handel win would embolden Republicans, keep their foot on the gas on health care and get the bill through the Senate before the recess. Whatever it takes.
If Ossoff wins, you could very well see Republicans start tapping the brakes on health care and becoming more vocal on how uncomfortable they are with not just with the bill but with the process. We already saw John McCain complain about it earlier today.
The two candidates laid out their final arguments in the last 24 hours and took a couple of shots on each other. Ossoff has said Handel is an establishment politician and for her history of being against Planned Parenthood. But he`s also attacked her for supporting the House Republican health bill.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
OSSOFF: It`s bad for women. It`s bad for older Americans. And it`s an example of what happens when career politicians in Washington are more concerned with partisan objectives than serving the public interest.
This bill which my opponent, Karen Handel, supports is deeply unpopular in this district. And folks want to see the parties work together on some solutions that are going to make health care more accessible and more affordable.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
TODD: But Handel told Breitbart health care, quote, "hasn`t been that much of an issue on the ground. For voters in the Sixth District, the biggest issue is that Jon Ossoff is from outside the district." I`m guessing that`s probably not the number one issue in this race but we see where the messaging is there.
Handel announced that Republican groups threw the kitchen sink at Ossoff in this race, tying him to Nancy Pelosi, Kathy Griffith, anarchists, Osama Bin Laden. And they`re trying to make the carpet bagger label stick here at the end.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
HANDEL: The people of the Sixth District want this to be about the Sixth District. They are not interested in Hollywood and California coming in and buying this seat. And they are very concerned about an individual who does not even live in this district.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
TODD: President Trump echoed that attack this morning on Twitter. Democratic Jon Ossoff, who wants to raise your taxes to the highest level and is weak on crime and security, doesn`t even live in district.
Ossoff says it is not a priority for voters. Folks, the only prediction we can make right now is that the race is going to be very close. But the time for moral victories is over for Democrats. They need a victory to show any signs of this resistance showing political life.
And Republicans need a victory to give them a little bit more cover if they`re going to get health care through the Senate and back through the House again without any Democratic consultation.
One party will walk away unhappy. And we`re just a few hours away from knowing who that will be or I kind of think we`re probably 12 hours away.
Joining me now is Jim Galloway, political insider at the "Atlanta Journal Constitution" and the expert on Georgia politics.
So, Jim, good to see you, sir.
JIM GALLOWAY, "ATLANTA JOURNAL CONSTITUION": Great to be back, Chuck.
TODD: All right, we know there`s a ton of money. We know that turnout is high. All of those things. So, what this race -- regardless of the victor, and there`s going to be a lot of reinterpretations in Washington. From your standpoint, what has this race been about?
GALLOWAY: Well, number one, this race is about Trump. Don`t let anyone fool you about that. And what`s strange is neither Handel or Ossoff want to say that. They can`t say that because they`re after the moderate Republicans who, in a Trump centric race, probably would disappoint both of those.
But I do take your point about health care. I think this is a very, very important election as far as the health care bill goes. This is Tom Price`s district that we`re talking about.
And Tom`s wife, Betty, has a state House district in Karen`s -- in the heart of Karen`s political base. So, she can`t walk away from that House bill. And she has had to do this dance where she defends it and yet wants to distance herself from it.
There are 14,000 medical workers with jobs in the Sixth District, 25,000 medical workers work in John Lewis` fifth district next door, but I bet you half of them live in the sixth.
TODD: Who is the swing voter? Is it the moderate Republican you just outlined?
GALLOWAY: I think so. I think -- I think the swing voter is female, moderate, and conservative on social issues, maybe a little bit more moderate on fiscal issues. She has, you know, kids in college, doesn`t like the gun debate, and I think some of the excesses of the Trump -- the Trump administration make her very nervous.
TODD: It seems as if both candidates have flaws. And I`m wondering, do you think they cancel each other out or will these flaws be extra highlighted if they lose? With Ossoff it`s inexperience and youth. With Handel, it`s the idea that she`s a retread. Which has been the harder issue to overcome for the -- for the two of them?
GALLOWAY: I would think the Handel`s experience, she`s got a lot of -- this is her, I think, third try for a big office without -- and she has yet to succeed. She ran for governor and she ran for Senate. And this is kind of her last shot on this.
And I think there are for -- there are internal Republican forces that aren`t completely dedicated toward her re-election -- toward her election. And I think that could have some bearing.
TODD: How long of a night do you think we`ll -- do you think we`ll know before midnight or do you think we`ll have breakfast with results?
GALLOWAY: I think we`ll know before midnight. But I will tell you, Chuck, it is -- I don`t want to be a weatherman, but it is pouring here. We`ve -- we`re in the middle of a deluge, two to four inches, weather flooding advisory until 10:00 p.m. And that is -- that could affect your Karen Handel voter.
TODD: Do you think that hurts Handel more than Ossoff?
GALLOWAY: Well, Ossoff --
TODD: Because it`s Election Day.
GALLOWAY: -- built his campaign around early voting. I think he pulled 48 percent in that April vote. But he pulled 62, 63 percent of early voters. So, Handel`s voters -- Handel`s voters are the ones who show up on the day of voting.
TODD: And one more thing you didn`t think you needed to worry about in the spring-summer that the weather playing this kind of an impact. Anyway, Jim Galloway, always a pleasure, sir. Thank you.
GALLOWAY: Thank you.
TODD: Enjoyed this.
Let me turn now to the Republican in charge of winning races like this for the GOP, Ohio Congressman Steve Stivers. He`s also the -- he`s the chair of the National Republican Congressional Committee.
Congressman, good to see you, sir.
REP. STEVE STIVERS (R), OHIO: Good to be on.
TODD: So, let me get you to -- you heard Jim Galloway there. He says neither candidate wants to admit it but this race is about Trump. What do you say about that? Do you agree with him?
STIVERS: Well, I think it`s about more than Trump but, clearly, some voters want it to be about Trump. And it`s about when voters want it to be about. And, in the end, it`s about who they want to represent them in Georgia Sixth District. And I think Karen Handel will come out on top of that, not just because she lives there but because she represents the values of the people of the Sixth District.
TODD: I`m curious, look, win or lose, this appears to be an extraordinarily close race.
STIVERS: I believe that.
TODD: And if you look at the Trump-Clinton number from November, it was one point which was, sort of, a precursor of what we all thought. Well, geez, I guess this will be a close race.
Do you take any comfort in losing by a point and saying, well, we lost a close race by a point but we -- but Republicans didn`t get blown out? We know how to run in this environment. Even though we lost by a point, we`re not going to -- every Democrat that a Republican has to run into isn`t going to have $60 million. Does that --
STIVERS: Well, Chuck --
TODD: -- does that -- do you take any comfort in that if you come up short?
STIVERS: -- well, Chuck, we`re going to win tonight. But I will tell you, the Democrats can`t afford to spend $33 million in every seat. And that`s what the left spent on this race is $33 million. If you multiply that out times the 25 Democrat districts they have to hold and the 45 Republican districts they want to target, that would be $2.1 million -- billion, and they don`t have that much money.
TODD: Yes, elections are getting expensive but I don`t think we`re going to be in multiples of billions for House races yet.
STIVERS: I don`t.
TODD: But who knows.
STIVERS: Right.
TODD: Maybe before our lifetimes end, we might be.
Let me ask you this on messaging. The Democrats seem to have one message they were focused on both -- some form of Trump and health care. If you look at what was coming from your side, and I know you didn`t control all of the messaging, it looked like it was all over the place. Do you accept the idea that this has been a bit spaghetti at the wall and you`ve been trying to figure out what works?
STIVERS: Well, with a candidate like John Ossoff who has kind of a thin resume and even exaggerated parts of that, you do find yourself trying to figure out what you can throw against the wall and what can stick.
But I think, in the end, the people of this district want this to be about who`s going to represent them the best. And I think that`s going to be Karen Handel. I feel very confident that we`re going to come out on the winning side tonight.
TODD: Do you acknowledge that health care is on the ballot tonight or at least a process around it, meaning that many of your -- many of your colleagues, both in the House and the Senate, may be watching tonight on health care. Because that was probably the issue more -- most talked about in this district compared to other issues. Do you feel as if the process of health care this summer how it goes is on the ballot for you tonight?
STIVERS: I think it was one of the things that people talked about and it`s certainly one of the factors in this race. I don`t think this race is all about any one thing, as you said, Chuck.
TODD: Yes. No, it -- let me ask you then specifically on health care. Do you view it as a negative right now for your members because it`s so unpopular in that it`s going to take time to it into a positive? Do you think it is or where do you assess the health care issue right now for Republican candidates thinking about 2018?
STIVERS: Well, I think only in Washington can keeping your promises be called a negative. And, frankly, we campaigned in 2010, 2012, 2014 and 2016 and we`re going to keep our promise.
And by the way, Chuck, the status quo is terrible in my home state of Ohio. Anthem just pulled out of the marketplace. They`re the third big insurance company to pull out. I have four of my 12 counties that have zero insurance companies now in the individual marketplace and four more that have only one and no choice.
So, there`s a huge problem in the status quo. We have to do something to fix health care. And, frankly, I realize that the first bill we passed was not perfect --
TODD: Right.
STIVERS: -- but it was a good first step.
TODD: Do you acknowledge that maybe you guys should be doing this more in public? It looks like you`re hiding for political reasons that it`s -- you know, it`s too painful to talk about the individual aspects of the bill. I get it as a political tactic. Do you think, though, that long term you could pay a price for that?
STIVERS: Well, we had a lot of hearings in the House, and, you know, the Senate is now drafting a bill. It`s hard to draft a bill in public, but they will have hearings. They said they`ll have hearings. And I hold -- I believe that they will have hearings. We`ll see how it goes.
TODD: All right, we`ll be watching for those hearings ourselves. Congressman Stivers, always a pleasure to have you on, sir. Appreciate you coming on and sharing your views and speaking your mind.
STIVERS: Thanks a lot. Thanks, Chuck.
TODD: You got it.
Let me bring in the panel. Ruth Marcus, Deputy Editorial Page Editor and Columnist for "The Washington Post." Eli Stokols, White House Reporter for "The Wall Street Journal." Ramesh Ponnuru, Senior Editor for "National Review."
All right, Eli, first crack at this. What did you learn about Georgia Sixth in the last 10 minutes?
ELI STOKOLS, "THE WALL STREET JOURNAL": Well, I mean, the commentary that we`ve heard just, sort of, reflects this rather benign race that we`ve seen from both of the candidates.
You`ve got Karen Handel basically trying to disassociate herself from the president. John Ossoff trying to, sort of, get past the fact that all these, you know, billionaire, millionaire progressive donors, Hollywood celebrities have donated to his campaign. And he`s trying to convince the moderate Republicans in that district that he`s going to, sort of, be the down the middle type of Democrat or moderate. That`s not easy.
And then, trying to tar and feather him with this stale play book calling him, you know, a Nancy Pelosi puppet. That -- I mean, the idea of the fact they`re paying money for that old tired attack is something, but it might work in that district.
(CROSSTALK)
STOKOLS: And that`s -- and talk about throwing stuff at the wall. It seems like that`s the thing that worked the best. I mean, it`s interesting. Trump`s tweeting about the race now because he`s going to see it on T.V. He`s going to pay attention to it. He`s going to, you know, wave his pompoms if she wins. But he didn`t go down there and campaign for her. And I think that tells you about the fact that he`s a liability in this race.
TODD: Ramesh, actually, you, like, put it in pretty -- it is funny, both candidates are running away from their bases. No, no, no, no, I`m not that. I`m not that. Oh, no, no, no, I`m something different. It`s hard to be a partisan these days and not -- and then run away from it.
RAMESH PONNURU, "NATIONAL REVIEW": Well, one of your interviewees was saying the race was really about Trump, even though neither candidate wants to talk about Trump.
I think that what that tells you is that even if 95 percent of the voters are crow or anti-Trump, that five percent that they`re counting on are the people who aren`t baked in one way or the other because of Trump. And that`s -- you know, that`s what the contest is about for that five percent of voters is everything but Donald Trump.
The thing that -- the reason we`ve all been obsessing about this race for so long is the sixth most educated district in the -- in the country, and highly educated or at least people with college degrees have been a lagging group for Donald Trump. Romney won this district by 20 points. Trump won it by, I believe, about two.
TODD: A point.
PONNURU: Yes, by a point. So, this -- if the Democrats can`t make inroads here, then they`re really in trouble in the Trump years.
RUTH MARCUS, "THE WASHINGTON POST": I think I have a different perspective on that. I think if Republicans can`t keep this seat, they`re really in trouble in the Trump years. And here is why. Yes, Trump won it by a point. But Tom Price won it by multiple -- you know, double digits repeatedly.
So, the fact that this is a -- the fact that this is a competitive seat tells you about the trouble that the Republican Party is in right now in some congressional districts in the age of Trump. This should not be a -- this would not be a competitive seat were it not for Donald Trump. And, to me, that`s what this race is about.
TODD: No, that might. I have to say, though, the single most important thing I learned was I didn`t realize how bad the weather was today. I mean, I know it`s raining in the Southeast. We`ve got that tropical storm and all that stuff. But you`re, like, boy, throw yet one more weird hurdle into this thing.
MARCUS: And, you know, you usually think that bad weather keeps Democrats home, right? The Republican -- the early voting. It`s really interesting.
TODD: Well, the Election Day voting was enormously important for Republicans in the first round of this Georgia today. It kept Ossoff from getting over the 50 the first time.
STOKOLS: Yes, and I think the impact of this might be -- I mean, health care is huge and that`s in the near term. But looking towards next November, there will be some impact from this, some ripple effect, in terms of fundraising and candidate recruitment.
If Ossoff wins, I think it`s possible some Republicans who are in districts that are similar might feel a little more vulnerable, a little more likely to hang it up.
TODD: I agree.
STOKOLS: And, if not, you know, Democrats may have a harder time recruiting candidates if they feel like they get all this money and they still can`t close the deal.
TODD: And very quickly on the impact on -- potentially on health care. Look, we have John McCain getting cranky about the process, that it`s hidden. He goes, I haven`t seen a bill. Nobody in America has.
Why do I have a feeling if Ossoff wins, you will suddenly see eight to 10 Senate Republicans going, you know, it would be really nice if we did this in public. But if Handel wins, McConnell gets his way.
PONNURU: Senate Mike Lee of Utah who`s in the working group on health care is complaining that he hasn`t seen the bill, let alone everybody else. So, these complaints are widespread and absolutely if Ossoff wins, especially with a large margin --
TODD: It opens the door.
PONNURU: Absolutely.
TODD: Yes. No, that will be -- how do you think these senators are -- you used to -- this was your beat. You were the Senate House person.
MARCUS: I don`t think they like it either way. Once we, in the media, and we have been so distracted by that bright, shiny object that we failed to pay enough attention to this health care bill, to the way it`s being produced behind closed doors.
Sure, it`s going to be worse for the McConnell behind closed doors plan if Ossoff wins. But I think the heat is on there and it`s a really hard thing for people, like John McCain and others, to defend this process.
TODD: Well, because, I mean, we all have videotape. I mean, like, it is - - it -- look, I know we`re all shocked that hypocrisy is taking place in Washington, but it`s, sort of, like, it`s exhausting.
STOKOLS: I think, in a way it`s more shocking --
MARCUS: It`s worse than exhausting. It`s embarrassing. I`m sorry, Eli.
STOKOLS: -- in a way it`s more shocking that people -- we all, sort of -- it seems like the country has become numb to it.
TODD: Or conditioned.
STOKOLS: You know, five, 10 years ago, maybe something as blatant as the hypocrisy we see now on a daily basis would have more of an effect. It doesn`t seem to in this -- in this era.
MARCUS: We`ll find out.
TODD: We are going to find out.
All right, guys, you guys are sticking around. You will be here for the rest of the hour. Polls close at 7:00 Eastern in Georgia. MSNBC will be covering the results as they come in throughout the evening.
But I`m telling you, I think you set your alarm for 5:00 a.m. That would be my guess.
Coming up, could Russia be trying to interfere in today`s elections? There`s still a lot we don`t know about which states got hacked in 2016. I`m going to talk to a Democrat, the top one on the Senate Intelligence Committee, who wants to change that.
We`ll be right back.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
TODD: Welcome back.
As we mentioned earlier, no matter what happens tonight in Georgia`s special election, we could see quick ramifications for how the Senate tackles health care. Republican work on the issue has been accelerating.
The majority leader, Mitch McConnell, said today, they`ll release a, quote, "discussion draft" of the bill this Thursday.
Just this morning, Senator Bob Corker said all Republican senators will meet tomorrow to go over some framework. Democrats, meanwhile, are stuck, locked out of negotiations while Republicans try to pass the bill without them.
They`re now trying to use procedural tactics to grind the Senate`s work to a halt. And late into the night last night, they took to the floor to rail against the lack of transparency in the discussions. That`s a point even some Republicans have expressed some frustration about.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: So, if you`re frustrated by the lack of transparency in this process, I share your frustration. I share it whole heartedly.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Are you satisfied with the process that they`re taking right now?
SEN. JOHN MCCAIN (R), ARIZONA: No, no, of course not.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Why not?
MCCAIN: For the obvious reason that no one has even shared it. We used to complain like hell when the Democrats ran the Affordable Care Act. Now, they`re -- we`re doing the same thing.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
TODD: Senate leaders have indicated we`re likely to see votes on a health care bill as soon as next week. So, I guess this idea of the hearings -- I know Congressman Stivers said we`d have hearings. Maybe we won`t.
We`ll be back in 60 seconds with more MTP DAILY.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Does President Trump believe that the Russian government interfered in the 2016 elections?
SEAN SPICER, U.S. WHITE HOUSE PRESS SECRETARY: I think I have not sat down and talked to him about that specifically. And, obviously, we`ve been dealing with a lot of other issues today.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
TODD: Wow. Welcome back.
That was White House Press Secretary Sean Spicer this afternoon unable to tell us if the president believes his intelligence agencies on Russian interference in the U.S. election in 2016. This comes as the U.S. Senate Intelligence Committee is ramping up its investigation.
We`ve already seen blockbuster testimony from ousted FBI Director James Comey, Attorney General Jeff Sessions and others. Tomorrow, top officials from the Department of Homeland Security, the FBI, Illinois Board of Elections, and the National Association of Secretaries of State are going to be in the hot seat, amid reports that Russia`s targeting of our election infrastructure in 2016 was far wider than previously thought.
The Intelligence Committee`s vice chair, Virginia Senator Mark Warner, is now calling on the Trump administration to publicly disclose every single state that Russia targeted.
Last year, two states confirmed being breached or targeted, Arizona and Illinois. And "Bloomberg News" recently reported that U.S. investigators believe Russia hackers hit systems in a total of 39 states.
I`m joined now by Senator Mark Warner, Democrat from Virginia, the Vice Chair of the Senate Intelligence Committee. Senator Warner, how are you doing?
I know our time is short, so I`ll get right to it. First question, you sent a letter to the Department of Homeland Security. You want made public how many states will -- are infiltrated. Why is it important for that to become public and are you at all concerned that it could create a little panic?
WARNER: Well, we`re not trying to create a panic. We`re not trying to relitigate the 2016 election or embarrass any state. What we know -- and there have been public reports that have had numbers, frankly, that have been wrong. Only two states, Illinois and Arizona, have acknowledged the Russians attempted to hack into their systems in the 2016 campaign.
I would rather -- I think we would all be safer and better prepared for 2018, or 2017 in the case of my home state of Virginia where we have state elections, if we get this information out. And we can share best practices and make sure.
Because one thing we know, the Russians didn`t just try to do this in 2016.
TODD: Right.
WARNER: They tried to intervene in France. They`re going to try to intervene in Germany. And they will be back trying to attack us again.
TODD: There has been a lot of comfort taken by officials, both in the Obama administration and in the Trump administration, who have said definitively, we`ve had no evidence, no proof, no anything that any vote totals were altered. Do you still have that same level of confidence, given the more information we`re learning about the state level of hacks?
WARNER: Chuck, I do have a high level of confidence that no individual vote totals were changed. Again, this is not about relitigating 2016.
But if we show how extensive the Russian attempts were to penetrate state systems, that, I think, will put us on a higher level of guard and security.
The one thing we do know is that if the Russians were able to even come in, or some other adversary, and even change a county or an individual voting precinct, that could cause a great deal of chaos and havoc going forward.
We just need to recognize, you know, 21st century technology, 21st century hacking is going to with us for a while and we need to be better prepared.
TODD: On "MEET THE PRESS" on Sunday, Angus King, a colleague of yours, I asked him, where would you put percentage-wise where you are in the investigation? He said about 20 percent through it. There`s probably another 80 percent to go.
One, I wonder if you agree with that assessment? And, two, if you could answer this criticism from David Brooks both on the show and this morning in his column. And he writes, as the Trump-Russia story is evolved, it is striking how little evidence there is that any underlying crime occurred, that there was any actual collusion between the Donald Trump campaign and the Russians.
He is growing skeptical that, with all the leaks that have come out, there`s never been a leak about that. What do you say to David Brooks and others that are starting to question whether there`s any there there?
WARNER: What I would say is let`s take this in order. First of all, we absolutely know that the Russians tried to intervene in our election system. They hacked into the DNC. They also used (INAUDIBLE) weaponized information.
Everyone from all the intelligence community virtually every senator, Democrat and Republican agree with this -- with that fact. The only person who, frankly, seems to still reject that notion is the president, himself, who calls this fake news or a witch hunt. He`s just factually wrong.
The second piece is we are still at the relatively early stages, I`m not going to give a percentage, as we start to deal with those affiliates of the Trump campaign who at least have been rumored or talked about having contacts with the Russians.
I would have expected to have more of that work done. But who could have ever predicted that the president, himself, would have gone out and fired FBI Director Comey, that he would be launching these, at least, rumors that he might be firing, or potentially firing, special prosecutor Mueller? That has actually taken time away from the further conversations with those Trump officials who may have been involved with the Russians.
TODD: And final question because it sort of relates to health care. There`s this idea that Democrats may try to do the delaying of all committee meetings by at least two hours. That actually could have an impact on the Senate Intel Committee. Are you comfortable with that and should it?
WARNER: Well, listen, we will end up, whether it`s a formal hearing or a briefing, we`re going to manage to get the information we need because trying to make sure that we`re safe going forward in terms of our electoral system is extraordinarily important.
I also, though, believe the Republicans -- we all recall some of the criticisms they made in the Obamacare process, where literally hundreds of amendments were accepted, many from Republicans. Yet I`ve never, in all my years up here, Chuck, ever seen anything like what`s going on right now, in terms of this so-called secret bill being created behind closed doors.
TODD: Right. Senator Mark Warner, I`m out of time. I got to leave it there. I appreciate you rushing to the camera.
WARNER: Thanks, Chuck.
TODD: I know it`s a busy day. Thank you, sir.
Still ahead, how can the U.S. respond to the death of the American student, Otto Warmbier? Is there any action that can and should be taken against North Korea beyond just more sanctions? (COMMERCIAL BREAK)
TODD: Much more ahead on the second half of "MTP Daily" including the other special election happening today that could actually provide more of an earthquake for the politics of this town than anything that would happen in Georgia. Plus, why I`ve been quoting "My Cousin Vinny" for the past week. But first, Aditi Roy with the "CNBC Market Wrap."
ADITI ROY, GENERAL ASSIGNMENT REPORTER FOR CNBC: Looking forward to that. Thanks so much, Chuck. Oil prices tumble as stocks pull back from record highs. The Dow falling nearly 62 points, the S&P shedding 16 points, the Nasdaq losing nearly 51. Signs of rising production sent the price of oil falling to its lowest level of the year. U.S. crude for July delivery dropped 2.19 percent.
And FedEx shares up 2 percent after earnings beat estimates. The shipping giant is considered a bellwether of U.S. economic conditions. Sources saying executives are meeting with President Trump to discuss a potential roll for FedEx in the White House infrastructure push. That`s it from CNBC, first in business worldwide.
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TODD: Welcome back. The Trump administration is facing a seemingly impossible diplomatic challenge today following the tragic news of the death of Otto Warmbier just about a week after returning home in a coma from a year and a half in prison in North Korea.
The State Department says it holds North Korea accountable for Warmbier`s death and is demanding the release of three other Americans who are also detained there. Senators John McCain and Marco Rubio say the 22-year-old was murdered by the Kim Jong-un regime. Today, President Trump lashed out over the timing of Warmbier`s return seemingly blaming the Obama administration.
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DONALD TRUMP, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: It was a total disgrace what happened to Otto. It should never, ever be allowed to happen. And frankly, if he were brought home sooner, I think the result would have been a lot different. He should have been brought home that same day.
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TODD: The president`s words echoed frustration from Warmbier`s family who believe the Obama administration should have pushed harder for Otto`s release. What kind of response will this tragedy prompt from the president who once said he`d be honored to meet with Kim Jong-un? What should be the response to this kind of crime? Can anything be done? This afternoon, the White House did not signal any change in tactics for now.
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SEAN SPICER, WHITE HOUSE PRESS SECRETARY: We will continue to apply economic and political pressure and try to continue to work with our allies. We had, I think, positive movement on China over the past five months of this administration. We will continue to work with them and others to put the appropriate pressure on North Korea to change this behavior and this regime.
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TODD: An understandably measured response from Sean Spicer and the administration because they don`t know what to do here. Joining me now is Christopher Hill, former U.S. ambassador to South Korea and NBC News analyst. Ambassador Hill, I`m probably not alone.
There`s something about what happened with Otto that just makes you angry as an American. And there`s some need for retribution, for retaliation here. But for the life of me, I can`t think of an obvious answer or I`m guessing if there was one, it already been implemented.
CHRISTOPHER HILL, FORMER U.S. AMBASSADOR TO SOUTH KOREA, NBC NEWS ANALYST: Well, you bet it makes people angry. I mean, everyone can relate to a son or a child who has gone off and done something, maybe should not have done, but to apparently allegedly try to take a poster as a souvenir and to be charged and sentenced to 15 years of hard labor is simply ridiculous and outrageous. So, I think people do feel there has to be something we can do.
But the problem comes back to the same problem we have with nuclear weapons. What is it we`re supposed to do? Do we try to attack them with force? Do we then hold our breath and hope they don`t retaliate in South Korea and get us into a second Korean war? Lot of problems there. And I think the Trump administration has tried to deflect it and turn it into politics and blame it all on President Obama, but I frankly don`t think that dog is going to hunt.
TODD: Well, he put up this other tweet and I`m curious of your reaction to it. He says this earlier this afternoon. "While I greatly appreciate the efforts of President Xi and China to help with North Korea, it has not worked out. At least I know China tried." All past tense. What do you make of it?
HILL: Yeah. Well, I think there`s a lot of criticism of the president especially among Republicans and sort of foreign policy establishment that somehow he gave way all his leverage, bet on the Chinese, put everything in on the Chinese lo and behold, they haven`t been able to solve the problem yet. So what he is trying to say is, look, I did the right thing in going with Chinese, they really tried.
But as the tense suggested, he might try to be moving in another direction. But I don`t think he has any idea where he is going to move. And one of the problems with diplomacy with this administration is you get sort of one announcement to the next announcement without a lot going on in between. So, he doesn`t really have sort of an ongoing strategy and approach to the Chinese that`s daily in nature as opposed to episodic.
So, I think he comes up against the same old problem, what do you do? And, you know, he has a rather delicate relationship with the South Koreans. You know, they don`t want to be pushed around by us. They don`t like the North Koreans either. But we`ve got to manage that carefully.
If we`re perceived by South Koreans as not allowing them to have any talks with North Korea, we`re kind of falling into that very deleterious propaganda they have there which is to the effect that the great powers have prevented the Korean people from coming together. So, this is not an easy issue for him. I do understand the frustration with the Chinese, but to some extent it was entirely predictable.
TODD: Let me go back to -- I heard Sean Spicer say, we`re going to continue with economic and political sanctions. No country likes sanctions, but this country is operated under this sanction. Kim Jong-un`s whole life -- hasn`t it been his whole life that country has been under sanctions? I mean, at this point, what new sanction could be enacted that might have any bite?
HILL: Yeah, it`s hard to say. People have tried to get at the North Koreans by, you know, banning cigarettes and liquor sales and things like that. And nothing really on the sanction side has really moved them. The issue is whether China would somehow quarantine North Korea, prevent any movement across that border, stop selling them refined gasoline.
As you know, they have no refineries there. So maybe China could step it up. But I think history has shown that sanction trains are never fast enough for the thing that you are really trying to deal with. In this case, it`s utterly brutal regime, essentially. I think John McCain has a point. Until the North Koreans can explain in some honest way what happened to him, we have to assume he was frankly mistreated in such a way that I don`t think murder is too far off the mark.
TODD: Ambassador, I guess it`s sort of -- do we have to do -- is there a consequence of doing nothing?
HILL: Well, you know, throughout history countries have gone to war over the treatment of their citizens. And certainly, the highest level of responsibility certainly at the State Department and elsewhere is to take care of our citizens. And by the way, that`s been true since long before the Trump administration. So when you have a citizen mistreated and ultimately killed, there is a sort of sense that something has to be done.
But the problem with North Korea is always finding out what that something is. By the way, if we haven`t been able to find that something for nuclear weapons, it`s hard to find that for the death a single American. So I think we are going to have to continue to do what we are doing. Go after Chinese. I hate to channel Sean Spicer, but he does have a point. We have to go kind of try to do more things with the Chinese, do more things with our allies.
TODD: And maybe just go purchase a punching bag at home and get our frustration on that, unfortunately. All right, Ambassador Chris Hill, probably as tough of a diplomatic challenge as anybody faces no matter your partisan feel on that one. Thank you, sir. I appreciate it. Just head, why tonight`s special election in Georgia reminds me of "My Cousin Vinny." I think you will appreciate this one.
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TODD: Welcome back. Like a lot of people interested in politics tonight, I`m obsessed with today`s special election in Georgia. It`s no exaggeration to say there is a lot and I mean a lot riding on the outcome. Democratic fund raising, Republican fund raising, momentum for 2018, the Trump resistance movement, candidate recruiting, strategy, the future of health care.
I`m missing like ten other things. In fact, the future of it seems the whole political world. In fact, so much has said to be riding on today`s vote, that it reminded us of a scene from one of the fun movies of our time, "My Cousin Vinny."
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JOE PESCI, ACTOR: I ain`t slept in five days. I got no money, a dress code problem, and a little murder case which, in the balance, holds the lives of two innocent kids. Not to mention your biological clock, my career, your life, our marriage, and let me see, what else can be pile on? Is there anymore (beep) we can pile to the top of the outcome of this case?
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TODD: That was me at our morning meeting about Georgia Sixth. What else can we pile anyway? We don`t know who is going to win today but at least we know Vinny Gambini got the two youths acquitted. We`ll be right back.
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TODD: Welcome back. Time for "The Lid." Panelists here. Ruth Marcus, Eli Stokols, Ramesh Ponnuru. I want to talk a little North Korea and a little bit of Russia. Ruth, Fred Hiatt, editorial page editor, wrote sort of why he was -- it was a great personal essay, like why he is bothered to what happened to Otto Warmbier. It is frustrating. It feels as if we are powerless. Essentially, Ambassador Hill, President Trump, Sean Spicer, everybody is saying yeah, we are.
RUTH MARCUS, JOURNALIST FOR THE WASHINGTON POST: it`s totally heartbreaking. Fred and I both have kids about the age of Otto Warmbier, and so any parent, any human being sees this and is outraged. Every American sees it and is outraged. Here`s something I think we need to remember and Fred pointed it out in his op-ed and my colleague, Kristen Carroll, wrote about it again today after Otto Warmbier passed away.
We need to remember him. We need to be outraged about his treatment and outraged of the fact there are three Americans held there. We also need to be outraged at the treatment by this regime of its own people. Tens of thousands, hundreds of thousands of people who are killed, tortured, imprisoned. Christian wrote about how if you were one of their concentration camps and you catch a rat and eat it because you`re so starving. They punish you for theft of state property. That`s this regime. We can`t forget it.
TODD: There`s not another regime around the world like this. We talked about the different (inaudible). Ramesh, this is on a level of, you know, (inaudible) too kind.
RAMESH PONNURU, COLUMNIST AND SENIOR EDITOR FOR THE NATIONAL REVIEW MAGAZINE: It`s like a combination of communism and psychopathic cult.
TODD: Yeah.
PONNURU: . in one state. It`s a country as a lot of concentration camp really. And what`s frustrating about it is we know these things. But there is a limit to what we can do about it. There is not effective military answer here. And so we end just sort of flailing (ph) about trying to find other ways to tackle the issue.
MARCUS: Also nuclear weapons.
TODD: No, Eli, I was just about to say, Eli, that is, boy, if that isn`t a reminder and I`m sorry, it`s another reminder to any rogue state in the world, what`s the best way to prevent the United States or any other world power for ever punishing you for mistreating its people, have nukes.
ELI STOKOLS, WHITE HOUSE REPORTER FOR WALL STREET JOURNAL: That`s right. I think you see from this White House, you saw during the situation in Syria where the president was motivated because he learned of a chemical gas attack against innocent people. He was motivated to take action.
The difference is this case is there is no real action that can sort of check a box and say, I responded, I was resolute, I drew a red line. With North Korea, it`s just infinitely more tricky. I don`t think it will be very satisfying for this president to tweet about it. But there`s not much to do beyond that.
TODD: Where we are in Russia?
MARCUS: With the Russian investigation or with our relation.
TODD: No, Russia investigation. We know the relationship. The Russia investigation.
MARCUS: Well, we have to keep pursuing it. I mean, I think that the argument that has been afoot in some corners that there`s no evidence of collusion. Okay. Kind of got bored with that story, case closed. Gets it completely wrong. The reality is that this is a really complicated story. We have been pursuing it for a while. But there are threads that keep on opening up. The president clearly has been frantic to keep Michael Flynn safe.
What is the interest in that? What was going on with the contacts during the transition? We don`t know. We are not yet even close to the bottom of what happened between the campaign and Russian -- Trump campaign and Russians during that. Let`s let the process go forward. Anybody who has ever watched legal investigation proceeds knows that it takes a really long time.
TODD: Ramesh, I was intrigued by something that Mark Warner said which made me wonder that`s a White House coming with a good strategy or well, you know, firing James Comey sort of threw us off our schedule and suddenly we went down this path. And that actually has served as it`s added fog to the whole story.
PONNURU: Just imagine how much more thrown off they will be when Mueller gets fired. Look, I agree with Ruth that the investigation needs to proceed. But I do think that the giddy talk among Trump`s opponents mostly on the left and some on the right as well about impeachment and 25th amendment and smoking guns has gotten ahead of the story in a way.
TODD: But the story.
PONNURU: . that this counts anything to actually gets turned up.
TODD: Right. Let the investigation proceed on its own. Don`t jump to the conclusion yet. Everybody`s trying to read the last page of the book, right? And it`s not been written.
STOKOLS: And I think the zeal on both sides. You see Trump so eager to brush this away and move on. That hurts him. It made him looks more like he has something to hide. I think the media has to be careful about leaning too hard into these Watergate comparisons as well because we`re already living in these (inaudible) worlds where nobody really trusts each other. That is not a climate where even if there`s obvious evidence, there`s a certainty that is going to proceed like it did 40 years ago.
TODD: I guess I trust you. All right. I trust you. I trust you, guys. At least today. I appreciate it. Any way, well done. Thank you all. After the break, why Jon Ossoff`s carpetbagger status hits home with several members of congress.
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TODD: In case you missed it, in every Republican with an interest in the Georgia Sixth special election, just try to make sure you did not miss it. There is one vote that Democratic house candidate, Joh Ossoff, is not going to get in tonight`s contest, his own. Ossoff does not live in Georgia Sixth, so he can`t vote in the race. He lives in Georgia`s 5th congressional district. That what John Lewis represents. And the constitution only requires that you live in the same state, not the same district, to be a member of congress.
In case you missed it, this happens more than you might think. According to "The Washington Post," if Ossoff wins, he wouldn`t be the only member of congress living in Georgia`s 5th district who represents another district. Democratic Congressman David Scott has apparently registered vote in Georgia 5 as well, but he represents the 13th district in Georgia. The post identified at least 21 members of congress who live in districts they do not represent.
Guess what? It`s pretty bipartisan. 11 Democrats, 10 Republicans. Here is something, none of them are from Wyoming or Montana. We will let you -- give you a minute there to think about why. In some cases, these are folks who used to live in their districts, but the lines got redrawn. In any case, if Ossoff wins tonight, he will have some neighbors on the house floor just like camp (ph). That`s all we have for tonight. "For the Record" with Greta starts now. Get ready to refresh those election Georgia 6 pages. Greta?
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED. END