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Trump reportedly "brooded" and "sulked". TRANSCRIPT: 11/14/18, The Beat w Ari Melber

Guests: Howard Dean, Donna Brazile, Carlos Curbelo, Dan Sweeney, Anthony Brown, Oren Nimni

CHUCK TODD, MSNBC HOST:  Search and door to door and you name it.  We`re all very proud and that they have made NBC proud.

That`s all we have for tonight.  We`ll be back tomorrow with more MTP DAILY.

"THE BEAT WITH ARI MELBER" starts right now.  Good evening, Ari.

ARI MELBER, MSNBC HOST:  Good evening, Chuck.  Thank you very much.

We are covering a lot of developing stories right now.  We are hours away from a critical recount deadline right here in Florida.  And I`ve got new reporting tonight with Democrats digging in lawsuits flying.                          Plus, witnesses talking about Bob Mueller bearing down on whether Roger Stone illegally intimidated witnesses, including someone you might recognize Randy Credico.  Also, tonight, the Trump tapes, a new lawsuit trying to force the release of unseen videos from The Apprentice.  The lawyer leading the charge is here on THE BEAT.

But our top story is the blue wave changing the Trump era as we know it.  The new Democrats who flipped the house arriving in Washington today for the first time.  You can see these new freshmen, the House class posing for their official photo.

And if you know that old saying, "This is what democracy looks like", well, we`re about to show you what democracy looks like when today`s two parties welcome their newly elected members of their caucuses because it is a stark divide between the new Republican members of Congress that you see here.

And the new Democratic members of Congress, obviously, a larger group because Democrats won so many seats.  And that group simply looks a lot more like America because it has more women, more diversity than the new GOP members.  And this is who Trump has to face starting in January and that seems to be forcing a change of mood from his first reaction to the election results last week.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE:  You`re a man who likes to win but last night was not an absolute victory for you.

DONALD TRUMP, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES:  I`ll be honest.  I thought it was very close to complete victory.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

MELBER:  To paraphrase Daniel Patrick Moynihan, the president`s entitled to his own opinion but not his own facts and since Trump talks so much about well, winning, he certainly knows the fact that Democrats won more seats than they have in four decades and that`s far closer to a complete loss for Trump than a "Complete victory".

Here is another sign that Donald Trump knew he was lying when he said that.  Trump flailing openly speculating about firing members of his candidate -- of his cabinet, I should say, reports he`s upset about this loss brooding over the Florida recount that is a prospect of potentially becoming another Democratic victory.

The Republicans are still up by a hair, reports that he`s sulking over key races that Republicans lost.  A stampede that continues tonight because there are new results from California that give Democrats another House seat.  Nine more races undecided meaning the rookie list that we showed you earlier tonight, well, it could grow to add even more Democrats.

At the end of the day, what we`re looking at now is that elections have consequences.  Elections show where the voters stand.  And even when elections are messy like these races that have taken more than a week of counting to even get the final results, in the end, let`s be clear we do see where the voters stand.

Right now, across the nation, the voters are standing up against Trumpism having tasted two years of it by that very large margin and they`re standing up for change in Congress as we know it.  You see it right here.  Turning this Congress into a younger, more female, more diverse governing institution and a more democratic one and that`s where the power is headed for these next two years.  And the president knows it, even if he lies to his own supporters about what happened which is part of why these leaks from inside the White House are now casting him as retreating into a cuckoo of bitterness and resentment.

I turn now to two former DNC Chairs Donna Brazile whose new book is "For Colored Girls Who Considered Politics" and Howard Dean, a former DNC Chair who`s been an analyst for us here at THE BEAT.

Governor Dean, you see Trump react that way, that means he does know he lost.

HOWARD DEAN, FORMER DNC CHAIR:  Well, not only that but there`s a really big story that people aren`t covering.  Yes, we won the House which is great.  More importantly, young people are taking over the Democratic Party in a big way.  Most of these elections were won by people like ran for something, Indivisible and Color of Change, and Collective PAC, Voto Latino.

They went out and did all the field work, recruited 15,000 people to run for office and they did it at every level.  We took over -- well over 300 legislative seats around the country.  So this is a fantastic thing for the younger generation to take over the Democratic Party.  That`s an even bigger story than kicking Trump`s button winning Congress back.

MELBER:  Donna, listen to Maxine Waters talking about where we are headed.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

REP. MAXINE WATERS (D-CA), RANKING MEMBER FINANCIAL SERVICES COMMITTEE:  Make no mistake, come January and this committed the days of this committee, weakening regulations, and putting our economy once again at risk of another financial crisis will come to an end.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

MELBER:  Donna, what was your thoughts looking at that unusual group of freshmen and women today?

DONNA BRAZILE, FORMER DNC CHAIR:  Well, as a veteran of Capitol Hill, as a staffer, as somebody who spent my early years as an intern, first of all, I was gratified to see so many people who look like me.  We have a historic Congress the most diverse Congress in the history of our country.  It comes from one of the largest midterm turnouts.  And for the Democrats, we almost dropped a decade in terms of the age of those elected.

So it was a good night, a good week, a good election season for Democrats.  Look, and Howard Dean knows this.  We had a 50 state strategy.  We ran everywhere.  We had candidates who understood that they had to go back to the grassroots.  We had people volunteer and send them money through regular means.  It was a people-powered campaign in a people-powered Democratic Party that is undergoing great changes at all levels.  And I was proud of the success that we saw last week.

MELBER:  Well, Howard, Donna is quoting the platform that you ran on as DNC Chair.  And as viewers of this show know, like a rapper, Howard, if you`re being quoted, obviously you`re influential.  Chris Collins, the indicted Republican congressman unlike Trump was a very clear and factual about the fact that Republicans lost and that changes everything because, in the House, it`s all about who`s in charge.  Take a look.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

REP. CHRIS COLLINS (R), NEW YORK:  Let`s face it.  When you`re in the minority, the -- your job is just to vote no on what goes on.  Because in the minority, you don`t control the hearings, you don`t control the legislation.  So it`s going to be a different world for all of us.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

MELBER:  A different world for those House Republicans, Howard.  As a politico, what do you think he`s doing there?  Is he trying to lower expectations so people understand that the Trump era, as we know it, has changed?

DEAN:  Well, he and Duncan Hunter, the two indicted members of the Republican Party who won reelection in spite of that have got a particular problem.  So I don`t want to guess about what he`s trying to do.  I think the odds that both of them don`t finish out their term are pretty high.  And I was actually shocked that Collins was reelected because he had a pretty good opponent.

So who knows?  I don`t know what Republicans say and why they say it.  You know they have an aversion to the facts for the most part and we`ll just have to see what happens.  I think Maxine is going to do a great job as the Chair of the Finance Committee.

BRAZILE:  I agree.

DEAN:  I really do.  She is, you know, unlike what Trump claims about her.  First of all, she`s really smart.  And second of all, she really knows what she`s doing.  And I think we`re going to get a good and fair chairperson who`s going to protect average Americans and not worry about all the campaign contributions that the Republicans seem to worry about all the time.

BRAZILE:  Maxine is not only tough, she`s tenacious, she`s smart, she knows her business, and she`s fair.  She`s fair.  She wants an economy that works for all people, not just flowing in those on Wall Street.

MELBER:  So Donna and Howard, we talked a little bit about what Democrats see as good news.  In a moment, I`m going to bring in a Republican congressman who`s departing.  But I want to press you on one thing Donna, which is for all this talk of change, we are not seeing the voice of change or young people being reflected so far in the House leadership race.  There seems to be a little bit of a deficit of democracy there when you have at least the idea that maybe someone should run against Pelosi, even if she still may have the votes to win.  She is projecting confidence.  Take a look.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

REP. NANCY PELOSI:  Hello.  Here we are.

REPORTER:  Feeling confident you`ll be the next speaker still, Leader Pelosi?

PELOSI:  Yes, I do.

REPORTER:  What`s your level of confidence?

PELOSI:  High.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

MELBER:  Now, obviously, on behalf of reporters, I will say, you know, we ask those questions, they`re not the best questions.  Of course, she`s going to say high confidence, Donna.  What else is she going to say?

But more broadly, and I know that you`ve been very supportive of her --

BRAZILE:  Very.

MELBER:  -- but wouldn`t it be good for the Democrats with all of this new blood, so to speak, to actually have a more robust open race for speaker?  I mean that`s part of why would Howard Dean run for president.  People said, "Oh, you know, we`ve got to stick with the establishment."  There`s this idea, no, a big open wide race is good.

BRAZILE: Look.  I am a strong supporter of Nancy Pelosi.  I don`t have a voice but I -- I don`t have a vote but I have a voice and I respect her.  Her leadership has been tremendous.  One of the reasons why we have more people at the table, more women and minorities, and others at the table in the Democratic Party is because of the leadership of Nancy Pelosi.  She has opened doors for many to be able to take their seats.  I am confident that when our leadership race is over at the end of this month, you`re going to see some new blood.

Look, we don`t have to go to Count Dracula to get a blood infusion in the Democratic Party.  We did that last Tuesday.  What we need to do right now is to put the best leader forward who knows how to fight, who knows how to get things done, and I do believe that person is Nancy Pelosi.

MELBER:  All right.  I want both you to hang with me.  I`m bringing in Florida Republican Congressman Carlos Curbelo.  He lost his bid for re- election last week and then was publicly criticized by the president the day after the election.  Let`s start with the way Donald Trump talked about you and some of your colleagues that day.  Take a look.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

TRUMP:  They did very poorly.  I`m not sure that I should be happy or sad but I feel just fine about it.  Carlos Curbelo, Mike Coffman, Mia Love gave me no love and she lost.  Too bad.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

MELBER:  The president says you lost your seat because you didn`t embrace him enough.  Is he right?

REP. CARLOS CURBELO (R), FLORIDA:  Ari, good evening from Washington.  I wish I was with you at Miami.  It`s getting kind of cold here.  With regard to the president`s comments, it`s just total nonsense.  And if you look at the numbers, you can see it.

So in my district, I got about 49.1 percent, really close race.  Governor Scott, a friend of mine who will likely be the next Senator from Florida got about 44.5 percent and Ron DeSantis who is the governor-elect of Florida as far as we can tell got 45.5 percent.  And we know Ron ran a race very closely, aligned with the president.

So the president just has to accept the facts in suburban districts throughout America his tone, his rhetoric, and his style were rejected by many voters.  Even in districts like mine where members like me had our own brands, pretty independent minded people --

MELBER:  Right.  You`re making a --

CURBELO:  -- and yet we lost.

MELBER:  Let`s dig into that.  You`re making a fascinating point here.  And we don`t know what`s going to be the outcome in that Senate race.  Obviously, state law has mandated this recount.  But what you`re saying is this is one of those funny things in politics where you had better total numbers than some of your Republican colleagues who were closer to Trump but 49 didn`t quite do it in your district.  So if that`s the case, do you think Rick Scott would have been better off and maybe not even a better recount if he hadn`t been so Trumpy?

CURBELO:  Well, look, I think we`re at a time in our country`s politics where most Americans and for sure it`s a silent majority, Ari, they want people in Washington who are independent minded who are going to be willing to compromise to this new Democratic majority that`s coming to the House.  My message to them is sure, the opposition is important but what`s even more important is a willingness to compromise to reach across the aisle.

Winning elections is not an end.  It`s a means to getting good policy passed.  And the way our government is designed, the way the founders designed it is that it requires compromise and that`s what the American people need solutions for infrastructure, for immigration --

MELBER:  Do you think -- so let me hit you on that.  Do you think --

CURBELO:   -- that`s the big challenge, not just winning the elections.

MELBER:  Congressman, so do you think that Donald Trump should extend all of the branches?  So many presidents have been encouraged to do when there is a new power in the House that he should go out there, meet with them, and try to figure out where they can avoid an adversarial footing and cooperate with these investigations.  And as you mentioned infrastructure, maybe do an infrastructure bill because he hasn`t been reaching out.  He was dissing you, he was trash talking you as a fellow party member and then he`s out here trash talking everybody else.

CURBELO:  That`s right, Ari.  I think President George W. Bush showed a great example of that in 2006 when Democrats took over Congress.  He knew that it was a rebuke of his policies, of his style at the time, and he did what he could to work with that new Democratic majority.  It was the end of his term so not a whole lot got done.  But certainly, there was some bipartisan cooperation there.

And this president, if he wants to put the country first -- and, by the way, not just him but Republican leadership in the Senate, Democratic leadership in the House and the 116th Congress, if they want to put the country first, they will put politics aside at least for a few months and get some big things done for this country.

MELBER:  Right.  And Congressman, I appreciate you joining us from Washington.  I`m sorry we`re not here in your native Miami together.  Do you have a great bar or restaurant tip for us while we`re down here?

CURBELO:  There are a bunch of great places in Miami.  If I tell you one, I`ll get in trouble because I have a lot of friends down there.  But I had the great honor of representing the Florida Keys for four years.  So if you`re willing to make the drive down, go to Key Largo and have some fresh fish.  And for everyone out there, it`s about 80 degrees in Miami.  Ari can confirm that.  If you`re feeling cold --

MELBER:  I can confirm.

CURBELO:  -- come on down.

MELBER:  There it is.  A pitch for -- a pitch for your constituent`s local tourism business.  Maybe we`ll all do it.  I know that Donna also has a lot of good taste in seafood if I remember correctly.

BRAZILE:  Yes, absolutely.  There are great bars and restaurants, I agree.

CURBELO:  That`s right.  Thank you.  Thanks for visiting.

MELBER:  And we`ll leave Howard in Vermont with the maple syrup.

CURBELO:  Yes, that`s his problem.

MELBER:  All right.  All right.  I`ve extended this as far as I can.  Howard Dean, the Congressman Curbelo, and Donna Brazil, my thanks to each of you.  Donna, we`ll speak to you a little bit more later as well.  Thank you.

Coming up, we have these new reports that Mueller`s investigating whether Roger Stone might have illegally tried to intimidate witnesses.  And then we`re going to break down this legal fight over the recounts later in Florida and Donald Trump`s new theory about why his party keeps losing the election.

And I have a very special fact check on a story that we have uncovered on purpose, the caravan and why "Fox News`" claims about it are suddenly disintegrated.  And later, my interview with a lawyer filing a lawsuit today to try to get a hold of long-lost Trump "Apprentice" tapes.

I`m Ari Melber.  You`re watching THE BEAT on MSNBC.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

MELBER:  Tonight, new signs of action from Bob Mueller as the fight escalates in Congress over how to protect his work from Trump`s new attorney general.  The "Wall Street Journal" reporting during grand jury sessions, prosecutors have also been repeatedly asking about witness intimidation by Trump advisor Roger Stone.  Asked him about e-mails, text, and online posts exploring whether Stone tried to intimidate Randy Credico who is contradicting Stone`s version of events about his contacts with WikiLeaks.

That`s the context for the retiring Republican Senator Jeff Flake today trying to force a vote that would stop Trump from firing Mueller.  Remember, Trump says he can fire the special counsel.  He thinks he has that power and he`s now installed an acting attorney general who has publicly attacked the probe.  NBC reported that Trump wanted to fire Mueller in summer 2017.  "The Times" reporting, he also wanted to do it in the winter of 2018.  Today, top Senate Republican Mitch McConnell blocking that vote intended to protect Mueller and claiming Trump doesn`t even want to fire him.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

SEN. MITCH MCCONNELL:  The president fairly often no indication that the Mueller investigation will not be allowed to finish.  He`s never said he wants to shut it down.  I think it`s in no danger and so I don`t think a legislation is necessary.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

MELBER:  Senator Flake respond to McConnell by threatening to block the Trump administration`s 21 judicial nominees currently pending before the Judiciary Committee.

I`m joined now by Joyce Vance, a former U.S. attorney, MSNBC legal analyst and Maya Wiley, former chair of the New York City Civilian Complaint Review Board, the oversight agency for the NYPD.

Joyce, your view of the Stone news.

JOYCE VANCE, FORMER FEDERAL PROSECUTOR:  Well, the Stone news I think is very interesting.  It`s always seemed like he had a big target on his back and would likely be where Mueller is going next.  The interesting thing about this news, Ari, is that there`s a lot about obstruction.

We`re not hearing much in the way of leaks about whether Mueller is looking at charging Stone with substantive violations that might be the link between Russia and the Trump campaign.  But, of course, that`s what all the fuss is about here.  And we`ll have to wait and see how that plays out.

MELBER:  Yes.  And I want to read a little bit more just on this, Maya, from "Wall Street Journal".  It says, "Look, grand jury sessions and interviews, these Mueller prosecutors have been asking about the e-mails, texts, and posts that link Stone and The New York radio personality Randy Credico."

Now, viewers of this show may remember when Randy has come out and spoken.  It`s been on THE BEAT in some pretty newsworthy exchanges about what they were looking at with Mueller.  And he did break the news for the first time on our show about Roger Stone threatening both him and his dog.  Take a look.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

MELBER:  I`m going to read to you something that Roger Stone allegedly said to you.  "I`m going to take that dog away from you.  Nothing you can do about it."  I`m paraphrasing.  "I will prove to the world you`re a liar."  Is stone in your view trying to threaten you so you will change your account of his activities in 2016?

RANDY CREDICO, COMEDIAN:  I think he didn`t like me being on your show the first time.  He`s afraid I`m going to unload on him.  I --

MELBER:  Why is he - let me ask you this.  Why is he bringing your dog into this?

CREDICO:  Because he`s a sick man.  He`s delusional.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

MELBER:  Maya, this is a bizarre one.  We don`t have a lot of dogs threatening precedent in the case law.  Do you think it helps Roger Stone because it could seem so outlandish as to not be a credible threat or do you think this could be a crime?

MAYA WILEY, FORMER COUNSEL TO NEW YORK CITY MAYOR:  I don`t think we have enough facts to actually assess that legally.  But I think there`s no question that Roger Stone has demonstrated some pretty bullying behavior in public, particularly if he feels threatened by people.

He`s been blocked on Twitter periodically.  I personally -- he dropped the B word on me once because he didn`t like something I said on television.  I`ve never met the man.  I do not know him personally.

So he does have a pattern of behavior that is not very positive and doesn`t put him in a positive light.  Whether or not it crosses the line into obstruction is a separate issue.  And, of course, one of the primary issues is whether or not Randy Credico was, in fact, some form of a back channel and the efforts that Roger Stone took apparently and allegedly to create that back channel with Russia or Russian operatives who were, in fact, stealing e-mails.

MELBER:  Joyce, if this is all that Mueller ultimately has on Roger Stone, then it would look like stuff he did pursuant to the investigation and not collusion and while no one`s saying you get a pass on that, all kinds of people get in trouble for this all the time, that does mean that this isn`t super collusion, right?  I mean isn`t that what the implication would be if this is all about intimidation?

VANCE:  Mueller has is showing a willingness to indict people for lying to law enforcement during this investigation.  But Ari, I think based on the amount of time and the number of witnesses that he`s been -- just that we`re publicly aware that he`s been putting time into in this case, it`s unlikely that all he`s looking at Stone for is obstruction.

And as you correctly point out, of course, Stone is believed to be one of the key links between Russian interference and the inquiry into whether or not the Trump campaign knew about that interference and participated in it.  We won`t know until we see the final indictment here.

MELBER:  Joyce Vance and Maya Wiley, thank you as always.

The Florida recount deadline is looming.  It is tomorrow and we have new reporting from the ground when we`re back in just 30 seconds.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

MELBER:  We`re in Florida tracking this historic statewide recount, three different races at once.  And right now, on the eve of these potential results that could come in tomorrow, there is a torrent of mudslinging, especially by Republicans.  New false claims of voter fraud and stealing elections.

Here`s the state of play.  Florida Governor Rick Scott ahead a Democrat Bill Nelson in that crucial Senate race by just 12,000 votes out of the 8 plus million.  In the governor`s race, Republican Ron DeSantis ahead and Democrat Andrew Gillum by a more comfortable 30,000 votes, 33,000 to be exact.

And yet two days after a Florida judge said there were no signs of voter fraud here, Donald Trump this afternoon telling the "Daily Caller" if Republicans lose, it would be because of "potentially illegal votes" and saying voters go around in circles and then change their outfits to vote multiple times.  Republican Senator Marco Rubio today attacking the Democratic lawsuit to extend recount deadlines.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

SEN. MARCO RUBIO (R), FLORIDA:  What we should not see happen here is that somehow lawyers are able to find federal judges that change Florida election law after the election, go in and basically order the state of Florida to ignore its own laws.  That would be stealing an election and that would be unacceptable.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

MELBER:  And here was another Republican, Matt Gaetz.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

REP. MATT GAETZ (R), FLORIDA:  The resistance movement has changed from, you know, yelling in town halls, to yelling in restaurants to now potentially trying to steal elections that they can`t win at the ballot box.  Democrats justify anything they do against Trump as being righteous, even if it`s morally wrong or even if it`s illegal.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

MELBER:  As we reported at the top and as I`ll reiterate right now, everything you just heard, and those are from current members of Congress is false and has not been supported by the independent judicial review up to this point.  If we find out something else, of course, we will bring that to you.

Meanwhile, there is a fight going on to extend the deadline further based on problems with the recounts.  I`m rejoined by Donna Brazile.  She`s been through a Florida recount before as Al Gore`s campaign manager in 2000.  And Dan Sweeney, reporter for "The Sun Centennial" right here with me.

Let me go to you first, Donna, because Florida 2000 looms over everything.  Have the Democrats learned anything politically and are the Republicans up to the same old tricks in that rhetoric or is it worse when we hear it basically embraced by Trumpism?

BRAZILE:  Well, first of all, I think we`ve learned a lot since 2000.  We`ve fought to open up the voter registration process.  We`ve fought to make sure that we update the machine, the technology.  And since 2016, when we saw tamper and potential meddling by the Russians, Homeland Security is now involved in the process of helping states update their entire election administration.

But what we haven`t learned is that when the deadline to cast your ballot is November 6th and many of these ballots are still coming from overseas, whether it`s military or nonmilitary, you have to count every vote.  And back in 2000, Ari, as you recall, we had less than 6 million voters.  We had over 8.5 million people cast their ballots.  I think it`s important to have every legal and lawful ballot counted before we certify the election results.

I also believe that voter intent matters.  We need to take a look at what happened with regards to how people tried to cast their ballots.  And finally provisional ballots and mail-in ballots that may not have a signature match, look, in the morning I might write my D one way and the afternoon I might write it another way.  The bottom line is that should not be a reason to invalidate ballots.

I`m sick and tired of the tactics that have been used every election season.  From 2010, I`ve watched 28 states.  Basically -- and that some of the most egregious voter restrictions possible, you saw what just happened in North Dakota.

MELBER:  And yet -- and yes, I want to be clear.  You`re right to call that out and yet we`re in this state, I keep mentioning it because it`s so important where there was a bipartisan coalition to restore voting rights to ex-convicts showing that there really is more than one thing going on.  I don`t know if I could cheer you up from what you said upset you, Donna but I have a very good friend of yours on the line here that you might remember from the year 2000, your friend Catherine Harris.  Take a look.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

CATHERINE HARRIS, FORMER FLORIDA SECRETARY OF STATE:  Everyone always talks about Florida but Florida is a purple state.  We have close elections.  I said earlier, it`s not a constitutional crisis, it`s a close race.  We`re going to have these close races.  You`re not going to have that in New York or California.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

MELBER:  For those who remember 2000, I know the two of you became very close, vacation together, all that kind of stuff.

BRAZILE:  No, we did not vacation.  We lived on the same block on Capitol Hill.  She and I -- she had a couple glasses of wine.  I got a chance to talk to her.  We had our differences.  And she -- I respect her very much.  She`s right, we`re going to have close races in Florida and, therefore, we should have policies that allow us to count every legal lawful ballot in the state of Florida.

MELBER:  Dan, let`s write into what`s going to happen tomorrow?  Are they going to meet the deadline and is there going to be a manual recount at least in the Senate race?

DAN SWEENEY, REPORTER, SUN SENTINEL:  Well, that depends on what county you`re talking about.  Broward County says it`s going to meet -- not only meet the deadline but exceed the deadline and have everything done by 6:00 in the morning tomorrow morning.  At least that`s what the Supervisor of Elections says.  All the Republican and Democratic lawyers that have been watching this at the -- at the scene down there, the over-under for them is around 11:30.  And then Palm Beach County keeps saying that they may not be able to meet the deadline on all of its races.  Keep in mind, they don`t just have the three you talked about, they have four at the State House race.  And they also had their counting machines overheat and they had to recount -- re-recount a 170,000 votes or so.  So looking a little shaky there.

MELBER:  And why do you think this happens in Florida so much, Dan, since you`re here.

SWEENEY:  Well, you know, look, every election is messy.  It`s just --

MELBER:  Every election in Florida?

SWEENEY:  Every election everywhere.  The difference is down here, nobody cares about it, these provisional ballots, overvotes, undervotes, no one cares when one candidate wins by ten points.  They only care when it`s close.  And in Florida it`s close. 

MELBER:  And that`s -- and that`s the argument that Katherine Harris who`s a well-known associate of Donna Brazile -- sorry I`m just having fun with this now.

BRAZILE:  That`s all right.  That`s all right. 

MELBER:  This is -- that`s her argument that we just heard is -- and she was very controversial in the way she defended Republicans in 2000.  But she may be saying what you`re saying that look, when it`s really close you end up noticing the problems that actually are there in a lot of different places.

SWEENEY:  Sure.  Yes.  And you know, you see it time and time again in Florida and it`s basically because it`s several different states kind of matched into one.  North Florida is very Republican, Southeast Florida is very Democratic and it all sort of balances out in the end.  The voter registration here is very close, it`s going to have close elections.

MELBER: And Dan, final question.  A little bit of local political gossip is all about whether Pam Bondi who is a Trump buddy is any closer to making it into the administration.  Do you have any read on that?

SWEENEY:  Well, there were about three or four different jobs she was up for and when the you know, the administration first kicked off, she was maybe up for A.G. and then she was maybe up for drug czar and she was maybe up for a couple of other things and she never got any of them.  So I feel like if her time was going to happen there in the White House, it probably would`ve happened already but we`ll see. ` MELBER:  Well, you know what they say, the stone that the builder refuse can still be the head cornerstone.

BRAZILE:  Hey, I`m still looking for those 537 votes, Ari.

MELBER:  Thank you for breaking the silence.  It`s an occupational hazard.  Donna Brazile always a pleasure.  Dan, thanks for sharing your local reporting with us right here on the ground in Florida.  Up ahead we have more from the recounting fight, our latest reporting and what you need to know about how it`s going to shake out tomorrow.  Later, will the secret apprentice tapes leak.  Immigration lawyers are pushing for it as evidence of potential racism.  And whatever happened to the caravan.  I`m going to go inside one of the most disgraceful political stunts of the current era.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

MELBER:  Tonight over 5,000 U.S. soldiers are serving near our border under the order President Trump issued heading right into that Midterm Election.  The soldiers will be sleeping in tents, eating military meals, they`re on deployment through Thanksgiving separated from their families, a mission costing you the taxpayer about $200 million.  Donald Trump said he was deploying them to combat a caravan of immigrants marching thousands of miles away. 

Now, if you watch this news program, you may know over the past month we have not led our newscasts ever with that Caravan or dedicated entire segments to it because that migration march itself was not a big or unusual development for global migration.  It was of course seized on by Trump partisans, a kind of final political scare tactic right before the election and that was obvious.  A top Trump official even leaking to a reporter in October that "it doesn`t matter if it`s 100 percent accurate, this is the play."  Let me repeat that quote, "this is the play."

So if that Trump leaker is correct, they`ve already admitted their boss Donald Trump deployed the military for a misleading political play.  And on cue, Fox News gave that play huge coverage.  Now, Fox defenders might argue well they can cover what they want, and maybe they just care a lot about the caravan issue regardless of the election.  You could argue that but it`s not true because here are the facts. 

Since the election, Caravan coverage has mostly disappeared.  The same folks hyping this before the election aren`t even talking about it now.  Here was Trump before election day.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

DONALD TRUMP, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES:  How about that Caravan.

The caravans.

Caravan --

Caravan --

Caravan after Caravan --

Caravan after Caravan after Caravan. 

More Caravans --

I notice all that beautiful barbed wire going up today.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

MELBER:  Fox News echoing that message with almost breathless self-parody. 

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE:  It`s not a caravan, it`s an invasion.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE:  Gang activity, gang members in those caravans.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE:  Some allegedly carrying guns and even firebombs.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE:  I want to know who`s in that Caravan.  Are there pedophiles, are there career criminals.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE:  Could more Isis terrorists be embedded?

UNIDENTIFIED MALE:  They`re coming in with diseases such as smallpox and leprosy and TB.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE:  They got HIV, measles, pertussis, rubella, rabies --

UNIDENTIFIED MALE:  You can see they`ve got family in the raft.

NEWT GINGRICH (R), FORMER SPEAKER OF THE HOUSE:  This is an act of attacking the United States sovereignty.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

MELBER:  If any of that were true, it would be a big long-term story.  But since the election, Fox News had 33 hours of segments about the caravan through election today.  And since the election you see it right there, nothing on Election Day.  The hours of coverage melt away.  And I want to be clear.  The facts here are important and they don`t only indict Fox News.  Let`s follow them where they lead.  Two of the most respected print outlets in America, the New York Times and The Washington Post ran a whopping 84 stories on the caravan in the single week before the election and that fell, you see it there to half in just the week after.

Now, the drop off shows how much this nontroversy was echoed by serious outlets.  Now, press critics are not saying that none of those stories should have run.  Some of them were just reporting news like what a president said and fact-checking those claims.  But that journalistic rule does not require dozens and dozens of stories time for the election and certainly not double the coverage before the election than after. 

Now, all of that`s important so people don`t get played again.  We can learn together but the joke may be on Trump who lost the election even with that Caravan coverage but it`s also on those of us in the media.  And Stephen Colbert hit the punch line about how the caravans completely disappeared after the election.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

STEPHEN COLBERT, COMEDIAN:  And now it`s gone.  I mean, how`s that possible?  Who got rid of the caravan?  Could it be the caravan?

(END VIDEO CLIP)

MELBER:  And even if voters were not fooled, this is real life.  This is not a drill tonight.  The U.S. soldiers are still down there long after Trump and Fox News have moved on and covered this stunt far less.  And as you see on the screen you are also paying for it.  I`m joined now by Congressman Anthony Brown, a Democrat from Maryland and an Iraq war veteran.  Thank you for joining me to dig in to what matters in this story, sir.

REP. ANTHONY BROWN (D), MARYLAND:  Ari, great to be on with you.

MELBER:  What do you think of the substance as a legislator and a veteran that these soldiers are still down there even though Trump seems to have completely moved on that this was an election stunt?

BROWN:  You know, look, as a soldier who deployed to Iraq for a year, I spent Thanksgiving, Christmas, a number of other important family events deployed and away from my family.  I`m very disappointed that the President used our military as a plaything quite frankly.  Men and women who raise their right hand do to join the Armed Forces, they know they`re going to be deployed, they`re going to be deployed at times when they`d rather be home, but they`re willing to do it when the mission is real, when they`re -- when they`re doing what they`re trained to do and what they`re asked to do in defend their country.

 But to send thousands of soldiers to the southwest border when there`s no threat, the mission is dubious at best, it can be -- it`s demoralizing and I think it has a real impact, negative impact on the military`s readiness.

MELBER:  Secretary Mattis gave away part of the game and obviously he`s got a follow lawful orders but he directly said they`re not going to be stopping any invasion, they`re not even to be making direct contact.  Take a look.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

JAMES MATTIS, DEFENSE SECRETARY, UNITED STATES:  At the present, I do not anticipate military personnel coming into direct contact with migrants.  The military police will provide force protection for the service members who are supported custom border police and putting in the obstacles.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

MELBER:  Given all that and what we`ve learned, I guess I want to take part of our setup to this conversation and put it to you.  How do we do a better job distinguishing between these stunts and covering what our actual national security or migration issues?

BROWN:  Well, first of all let me say I`m very disappointed with Secretary Mattis who otherwise I have considerably high regard for.  Earlier this year when the National Guard was being deployed to the southwest border I introduced an amendment to the Defense Authorization Act.  It wouldn`t have prevented these deployments because if they`re necessary then we ought to do them, but it said hey if we`re going to deploy men and women to the southwest border, we need to have a strategy, you need to be able to lay out to the American people, to Congress what`s the cost, what`s the benefit, what`s the impact on readiness, and what is the long-term play, what is the long-term strategy.

This afternoon Secretary of Mattis could answer in the short-term you`re going to lay concertina wire but in the long-term, he couldn`t articulate to soldiers which is very disappointing why they`re there and what they`ll be doing.  That`s not how you operate a military and I know that Secretary Mattis knows a lot better than that.

MELBER:  I`m almost out of time, but you mentioned the Authorization Act.  Are there are other things that your party can do now that you`re coming in the majority to constrain this type of potential abuse of the military in the new Congress?

BROWN:  Absolutely.  We`re going to have oversight Authority, we will be bringing the civilian and military personnel into Congress with very some probing questions.  We also have the power of the purse and we`re going to put restrictions on this needless deployment of active duty soldiers so that we can ensure that our military is ready to face real threats that we face in many other areas around the globe.

MELBER:  Right.  And the money matters.  I mean all spending bills originated in the House, you`re about to have a lot more party on your side of the aisle and that $200 million was spent on this.  It`s always a question in a democracy an addition to the soldiers time, effort, and risk, whether this was the right spend.  Congressman Brown, thank you so much.

BROWN:  Thank you, Ari.  Thank you for having me.

MELBER:  Thank you.  Up ahead, the eyes of political world on Florida, my latest reporting from inside some of these recount centers.  But first there is a lawyer taking on Donald Trump to get the apprentice tapes and alleging racism.  That`s up next.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

MELBER:  You may have heard about these secret apprentice tapes.  Well, some civil rights lawyers want to get their hands on them.  Lawyers suing Trump over his immigration policies issuing subpoenas today alleging that Trumps plan to stop some deportation protections was actually motivated by racial animus.  And I`m about to speak to a lead lawyer in the case who claims that outtakes from The Apprentice will actually reveal "racial or ethnic slurs" which would bolster the allegation that Trump`s policy is tainted by racial animus. 

Trump denies that any incriminating such tapes exist.  Here was a former apprentice contestant though on that issue on THE BEAT just last week.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

KWAME JACKSON, FORMER CONTESTANT, THE APPRENTICE:  President Trump is a racist and I think we should stop playing this racial bingo with him to figure out how many times he has to prove that he is who he is.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

MELBER:  What are you going to achieve through this suit?

OREN NIMNI, LAWYER FOR CIVIL RIGHTS:  So thanks for having me.  Last spring we filed a lawsuit challenging the Trump administration`s termination of temporary protected status on behalf of Haitians, Salvadorans, and Honduran immigrants.  What we are trying to do is save that program which affects over 300,000 immigrants in this country.  As part of our lawsuit, we`ve alleged that the Trump administration was motivated by racial bias and racial animus, some of that coming from Trump himself.  What we`re looking with these subpoenas --

MELBER:  So let`s -- yes, let`s dig into this.  And I should mention, I was so excited to hear your argument, your name is Oren Nimni from the Lawyers for Civil Rights.  I was a not right to not get you in on that.  Oren, what you`re saying basically is you have this larger very big stakes issue and you think that the judge is more likely to say that Donald Trump acted as president as let`s call it what it is, as a racist, you allege, if you can prove that he was privately like that on tape?

NIMNI:  That`s correct.  We have ample evidence from tweets, from public statements, from other documents that there is racial bias in the Trump administration coming from the President himself.  But we`re in the phase of our case where we`re looking for all the evidence we can possibly get.  And so we want to seek these tapes to see if there`s any more bias that we can uncover.

MELBER:  I think it`s fascinating because viewers will remember this was the big issue in the travel ban case.  Presidents have a ton of authority decide who comes into the country and that`s not really widely debated.  The question was, was it an anti-religious act because he publicly said he wanted to ban Muslims, and people felt -- non-lawyers felt that seemed like overwhelming evidence.  It wasn`t good enough in the eyes of the Supreme Court, so was that part of your motivation here and does that help you maybe get more evidence because you can say look, obviously the court set a very high standard, they need a lot of proof before they declare a politician a racist which is kind of the implication if you overrule something that way.

NIMNI:  Yes.  We all agree that the president has the authority to limit people that come in and out of the country but he can`t do it in a racist way.  And so we have some of the evidence that I was talking about but more evidence is always needed to bolster particularly in light of that decision from the Supreme Court.  And so that`s what motivated us looking at these tapes as one piece of overwhelming evidence that this program was terminated because of racial animus.

MELBER:  It`s really a fascinating tactic that you and your team has adopted and we`ve heard a lot of people argue that they should see the tapes they want to see the tapes, they like the idea of seeing the tapes.  As we know, courts don`t give you tapes just for those reasons.  You seem to have hit on one that is both important and would affect a lot of people`s lives depending on the outcome of your case here.  So Oren, thanks for telling us a little bit about it.

NIMNI:  Thank you for having me.

MELBER:  I appreciate it.  We wanted to get that in our broadcast.  Now, tomorrow here in Florida there is a big deadline to finish the county recount so we`re going to be covering that continuing some of the reporting we`ve been doing here on the ground all this week. 

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

MELBER:  This is ground zero of how the Florida election could be decided.

By show of hands, how many people here are affiliated with are hoping the Republicans win?

What do you want to see happen inside there?

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE:  We just like justice.  We want the truth, we don`t want fraud.

MELBER:  This is the mother of all waiting rooms.  So you`ve got a lot of different people who are gathered.  The seal is being broken on these boxes of preserve ballots and the recounting underway.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE:  Corsi is the little fish, Stone is the bigger fish, and Trump is the biggest fish.

MELBER:  See, we`re in Florida, I would say Corsi is sort of maybe the bottom-feeding fish and, Kendall, Roger Stone is like the little bird inside living off the alligators, you know, tooth decay, and Trump may or may not be the alligator.

RUSS FEINGOLD (D), FORMER SENATOR, WISCONSIN:  You`re down there in Florida where it`s nice and warm and you`re talking about alligators and I`m up here where it`s about 15 degrees in Wisconsin. 

(END VIDEO CLIP)

MELBER:  Everybody knows it`s warm down here.  I`ve learned that tonight.  We`re going to be back on the ground with this recount deadline tomorrow.  We could know who won this Senate race as soon as tomorrow and we`re here to bring you the facts directly so we wanted to remind you of that when THE BEAT is live tomorrow.  Now, up ahead, Michelle Obama, her mom, at a moment you really have to see with your own eyes.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

MELBER:  Breaking News this hour on Michael Avenatti, the lawyer for Stormy Daniels.  NBC is reporting that Mr. Avenatti has been arrested for domestic violence charge.  That`s breaking right now and MSNBC will bring you updates as warranted.  Now, before we go, we did want to show you one other thing that I mentioned earlier in the hour.  Michelle Obama joined by someone quite special to her on this book tour she`s doing, her mom Marian Robinson who actually lived in the White House with the first family and helped raise their granddaughters.  Now, she has never ever talked to the press until this interview.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE:  Why did you want her there?  Why was it important?

MICHELLE OBAMA, FORMER FIRST LADY, UNITED STATES:  Because -- for the girls.  You know, I wanted them to come home to family.  There was just parts of the girl`s life that I just knew we`re going to be OK because mom was there. 

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE:  What`s the best thing about Michelle Obama that makes you proudest. 

MARIAN ROBINSON, MOTHER OF MICHELLE OBAMA: Well, now I -- my saying is, when I grow up, I would like to be like Michelle Obama. 

OBAMA:  Wow. 

(END VIDEO CLIP)

ARI MELBER, MSNBC HOST:  And she gets the last word on our show tonight. 

"HARDBALL" with Chris Matthews is up next. 

  THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED. END