Show: THE BEAT WITH ARI MELBER Date: November 2, 2018 Guest: Donny Deutsch; Al Sharpton; Jennifer Rubin; Barbara Boxer; Robbie Myers; Adam Smith; Anthony Scaramucci, Desus Nice, The Kid Mero
CHUCK TODD, MSNBC HOST: That`s all for tonight. We`ll be back Monday with more MTP DAILY. And if it`s Sunday, it`s "MEET THE PRESS" on your local NBC station.
"THE BEAT WITH ARI MELBER" starts right now. Good evening, Ari.
ARI MELBER: Good evening, Chuck. Thank you very much. I will be seeing you a lot this weekend and next week.
We begin tonight with some big election news. A November surprise from Donald Trump`s fixer, Michael Cohen, using this pivotal moment to argue his former boss, Donald Trump is "Racist". If this seems like a loud perfectly timed PR attack, almost Trumpian, that`s because Cohen was the guy executing Trump`s tactics. The president recently emphasizing Cohen was mainly his PR guy.
Well, tonight, Trump is getting Trumped on PR, Cohen using a classic media maneuver, a devastating leak at a devastating time. Michael Cohen telling "Vanity Fair" that Donald Trump would privately use racist language, including while he was running for president. And Cohen is putting this out now.
He says, to be clear, "To warn voters about Trump`s true nature before these midterms, alleging Trump privately uttered chilling racist language in one on one conversations. That Trump told Cohen in 2016 his rally attendees were mostly white because black people are, "Too stupid to vote for me." And challenging Cohen, name one country run by a black person that`s not an S-hole or one city for that matter.
The White House didn`t formally deny this story of "Vanity Fair" tonight and he lets language matches a term Trump did use about several island nations while serving as president. Cohen also says that while driving through a poor Chicago neighborhood, Trump once told him, "Only the blacks could live like this."
Donald Trump wanted to change the conversation this week but not like this. Now, a source with the Trump Organization is pushing back hard, saying Cohen is desperate and has no credibility as a longtime Trump aide who`s now a convict. And it`s true, Cohen is changing his tune after pleading guilty to breaking election law on Trump`s behalf.
But for voters tonight and going into this weekend, the question is whether you think this impacts any choice you might make to use the midterms to either check Trump or potentially embolden him. And I can tell you in our reporting tight now that as we head into this pivotal final election weekend, tonight this story is everywhere, newspapers, cable news, network news. It is also one of the top trending items on the entire political internet, a place where you may know Trump`s antics often lead the conversation.
Now, Cohen famously said he would take a bullet for Trump. And remember, he kind of did, pleading guilty to that felony before flipping on his client. Now Trump is getting a taste of Trump media tactics at a moment when he may be politically weak. That is a risk outlined by other experts in strategy and battle. Sean Carter once explained the same sword that knight you is the sword they good night you with.
I am joined now to kick off our coverage by Donny Deutsch. He`s a friend of Michael Cohen and MSNBC contributor who has spoken to Cohen recently. And Reverend Al Sharpton, president of the National Action Network, a host of "POLITICSNATION" and he himself met with Cohen in July where they prayed. Thanks to both of you for being here.
Rev, your response to these reported comments?
REVEREND AL SHARPTON, HOST, POLITICSNATION: You know, I think that they will try and pick Cohen apart saying he is desperate I think was one statement. But all you have to do is look at the behavior and does the behavior of Donald Trump match what Cohen is saying. He is said that Donald Trump had said some derogatory statements about a contestant on "The Apprentice." Well, he did not choose that contestant.
He talks about he does not think a black can run a country or a city, he was the one that started his political career questioning the birth of the black president of the United States. Central Park five, I mean anything that has shown a pattern of behavior of Donald Trump goes right along with these statements. So I think Michael Cohen is not making this up because it is not antithetical to Trump`s behavior.
And, you know, people keep saying he`s dog whistling. I keep saying I have dog ears because I understand exactly what he`s saying and I don`t need anyone to try and act like they`re softening it. What a lot of people are missing I think, Ari is that there is not an identifiable black in the west wing. I can`t remember in my lifetime where we didn`t have a black in the west wing of the White House.
So if you have a president that has behaved in a bigoted way through his private sector career and has the highest profile black in his administration, Omarosa leave and call him a racist, then I think people ought not question Michael Cohen. They ought to question this president.
DONNY DEUTSCH, FRIEND OF MICHAEL COHEN: You also would look very hard around the Trump Organization, there`s no black executive there. There is no black working up there either. Let me set this up for you because this was not -- I know this for a fact a premeditated time thing. This was a result of what happened in Pittsburgh. Michael was really really torn apart after Charlottesville when Trump came out with, you know, basically, good guys on each side and Michael`s father is a Holocaust survivor.
And he wasn`t planning on coming forward and was so taken back as we all were with Pittsburgh and the president`s reaction to it, the president blaming the media that I think he felt a moral obligation to come forward. You know, Michael hasn`t spoken --
MELBER: I`m going to push you on that. I know you know a lot about this.
DEUTSCH: Yes.
MELBER: It can be a moral obligation but morality doesn`t have a midterm calendar. You know Michael Cohen. He carried out this media agenda for Donald Trump and he says, his own words, your friend or your associate or whatever word you want me to use, he says he wants this out before the midterm so people can factor it into their decision.
DEUTSCH: Of course, he does. Well, that`s obvious. I am saying this was not planned. I don`t think this -- I know this wouldn`t have happened unless Pittsburgh happened. I think it moved because look, his lawyers have been adamant about not him speaking. Other than one interview, he`s not spoken since. So the more he puts himself out there, he`s just setting himself up.
I mean any lawyer, any communications director would say to him right now, dude, you`re getting sentenced in 40 days, lay low. So that`s a reality.
MELBER: I think you`re right. That`s the legal advice he`s getting.
DEUTSCH: So he really felt this needed to be shared. Look, I`ve heard a couple of these stories in the past. These are true stories. If you know Trump, you can almost put yourself in those situations there. And to the Rev`s point, none of this should be a surprise.
What is different here, these are actual words. This is not the dog whistle. This is not, well, one plus one equals two, we can add it up. This is absolutely literally very, very clear. And you know what, it is interesting. There`s always been talk about did Donald use the "N" word. Now, actually, I asked Michael. He said, "I never heard him say that."
Certainly, some of these things have been worse. A horrible word is a word. There`s name calling. This is I`m better than you. Not one comment about blacks, only blacks or whatever. That`s not even hatred or ignorance, that`s I am better. You`re beneath me.
MELBER: I think you`re saying is that when you tell a group of people that because of their skin color, they are stupid. That is saying that another race, the white race is supreme to them, white supremacy.
SHARPTON: And when you treat them that way. See, if he said -- that he had said some names, which he denied him using the "N" word, that`s one thing. Some of us have used off-color statements and apologized years later or dealt with it years later. We`re talking about his behavior and the way he thinks. They can`t run a city. He will not do contracts with them and he doesn`t.
MELBER: And do you think Rev, because this is --
SHARPTON: -- White House.
MELBER: Here we are going into the election. This is not a drill. Do you think Michael Cohen is actually doing this so people in suburban America, people who might like some of Trump or like some of the economic part of it, have to reckon with the idea that in this climate of hate, he is privately, behind closed doors also engaging in the supremacy that encourages hate?
SHARPTON: If he is motivated by his moral conscience or by politics, it still needs to be out there. I think it is irrelevant what the motive is. What`s relevant is, is the behavior there, and why doesn`t the president forthrightly deal with it?
DEUTSCH: All right. Let me ask you a question. Of course, he wants it out there for that reason. Of course, there`s a political -- that`s a given. He wants voters or otherwise, he wouldn`t say it. So that is a given. I am saying this was not -- and I speak of Michael a lot.
This was not two weeks ago, OK, we`re going to do this. This was as a result of what happened in Pittsburgh last week, so many events, the rhetoric, the racism, the rants, the chanting has so heightened in the last week. People have been slaughtered. Arms have been sent. All against this --
MELBER: Very serious times.
DEUTSCH: So I think that`s what pushed him to do it. It is the right thing to do and I`m glad he did it.
MELBER: And Donny Deutsch, you have an insight into this. I want to thank you for coming on the program. We like seeing you on THE BEAT.
Rev, stay with me.
I want to turn from what this is about, some of the words of alleged racism to what many people are saying is a policy of racism and voter suppression. Oprah putting it in very real terms. And Rev, I want you to take a look given how much you`ve worked on this issues at what Oprah is saying today.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
OPRAH WINFREY: Otis Moss Sr. who right here in George`s troop county got up in the morning and put on his only suit and his best tie, and he walked six miles to the voting poll location he was told to go to in Lagrange. And when he got there after walking six miles in his good suit and tie, they said, "Boy, you at the wrong place."
And I picture him walking from dawn to dusk in his suit, his feet tired, getting to the Rosemont School, and they say, "Boy, you`re too late. The polls are closed." And he never had a chance to vote. By the time the next election came around, he had died. So when I go to the polls and I cast my ballot, I cast it for a man I never knew. I cast it for Otis Moss Sr. who walked 18 miles one day just for the chance to vote.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
MELBER: Oprah in Georgia discussing voter suppression. Rev, I want to get your response. And I want to bring in Jennifer Rubin, opinion writer with "The Washington Post" who also looked at some of these issues.
Rev, powerful coming from Oprah, something we know but often gets pushed to the side.
SHARPTON: And I think it is very powerful coming from Oprah. And I think it also is powerful because people don`t understand Oprah and I are the same age. My mother couldn`t vote in her hometown of Dothan, Alabama until she was in her 40s. I don`t think people understand how personal it is for some of us.
I`m talking about my mama and I ended up running for president. So when people act like this is just some civil class, it is not that for people like us that have lived this first person and then all of a sudden you`re going to start playing with the rules again and playing with voter ID and all kind of mechanisms that brings back things that we have thought we have personally had to overcome or personal members of our family, and it hits us where we live because we lived being denied something from a country that many of us had relatives die and fight to protect in the military or in other means. So what Oprah said, it really beats in our chest.
MELBER: Jennifer, when you look at this, what do you think Republicans are trying to do in Georgia?
JENNIFER RUBIN, OPINION WRITER, THE WASHINGTON POST: I think they`re waving the bloody shirt. I think this is the most racist, the most irresponsible campaign I`ve ever seen, and I`ve lived through many of them. People are comparing this ad on immigration to Willie Horton. This is much worse than Willie Horton.
He is attempting to play to the worst elements of his base, specifically because he thinks that that that`s the only way to get them to the polls. Now, the Republican party for a long time, one reason I left it, has been on this decline into nativism. And from what we can conclude in the closing days of this campaign, that`s all it is about. It is only about racism. It is only about fear and it is only about telling people that brown and black people are going to come and take their stuff or come across the border or going to harm their families.
So I found her statement incredibly emotional. And I also would say that when I think about the people around the world, remember the Iraqis when they first voted, the purple fingers with the print on it, think about the people around the world, think about what`s going on in Saudi Arabia, think about what`s about to go on in Brazil. There are repressive dictators all over the planet and the right to vote that Americans should be too lazy, should be too blase not to cast that vote, I find terribly, terribly disappointing and sad.
I mean if there ever were a time to -- as she said and I think that`s my favorite part of her speeches of late, vote your values. This is a time to vote your values.
MELBER: And when you look at this going into next week, Donald Trump clearly has been knocked off message a little bit, despite many attempts as you mentioned that video which isn`t real, they don`t have any money behind it, it was just one more attempt to rattle things, what do you think is on his mind tonight when you look at this attention as well as Michael Cohen coming out this way this forcefully?
RUBIN: I think he thinks that any coverage of him, and the more the mainstream media focuses on these things, the better for him because his base so hates the media and is so thrilled by this xenophobia and racism that somehow he will drag one more person out of their house to go vote. I think he is wrong.
I think America has changed and I think the Republican party is foolish if they think that they don`t need the suburbs, they don`t need women, they don`t need college graduates. Those are all of the people who he is offending. He is also, of course, stirring incredible enthusiasm among young voters, among African-Americans. The early voting is off the charts now in Georgia.
So I think he can only think this way. This is all he does. The old dog doesn`t learn new tricks. I don`t think he is going to be successful this time around. I hope he isn`t.
MELBER: From old dogs to dog whistles to Rev. Sharpton saying he has dog ears. We`ve covered some ground on some important topics. My thanks to Jennifer Rubin.
And Reverend Sharpton, before we go, I want to mention, "POLITICSNATION" airs live Saturdays and Sundays, 5:00 p.m. Eastern now. And they have come and joined the Rev for a special coverage tomorrow.
SHARPTON: Tomorrow, yes.
MELBER: We are going to fit in a quick break.
Coming up, Barack Obama hitting the trail, slamming Trump on corruption.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
BARACK OBAMA, FORMER PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: Our president doesn`t get to decide on his own who`s an American citizen and who`s not. They have racked up enough indictments to fill the football team.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
MELBER: Trump also in hot water for using the military for politics. My special interview with an insider, tracking Trump`s closing strategy.
And today is still Fallback Friday. Desus & Mero are here for a takeover.
I`m Ari Melber. You`re watching THE BEAT on MSNBC.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
MELBER: Welcome back. Trump at a rally in West Virginia today, hitting his immigration message while President Obama punched back.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
OBAMA: They`re also resorting to the same tactic that they did the last time, which is to try to scare folks with whatever bogeyman or divisive social issues they can come up with. Why is it that the folks that won the last election are so mad all the time? A president doesn`t get to decide on his own who`s an American citizen and who`s not.
CROWD: Boo.
OBAMA: Don`t boo. No. Let me tell you something. Republicans can`t hear you boo but they can hear you vote.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
MELBER: And Obama invoked Trump`s guilty former aides in the Russia probe.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
OBAMA: They have racked up enough indictments to fill the football team. I didn`t have anybody in my administration get indicted.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
MELBER: Let`s get to it. I am joined by former Senator Barbara Boxer, host of the podcast Fight Back and Robbie Myers, editor-in-chief of Shonda Rhimes` recently launched media site shondaland.com. She`s also editor-in- chief of Elle Magazine for 18 years. Thanks to both of you for being here.
Senator, when you look at these closing arguments, what do you think will move people more who might still be undecided in these key districts?
BARBARA BOXER, FORMER SENATOR: I think the undecideds, those will be the independent voters are going to move in the Democrats` direction. And I think those who are sitting back, here`s what they see. They see Donald Trump framing the message for the Republicans, and that message is fear, hate, and distraction.
And they see the Democrats` message is we the people and what we need. And that includes health care and education and Social Security and Medicare and good paying jobs. So I think people are going to move in the direction of hope and away from fear. I really do.
MELBER: Robbie, we talk about this as a big decision on Tuesday but a lot of people have already voted, and that gives us some indication of enthusiasm. Early vote right now, almost 30 million. That is higher than the midterms you had in 2014 at 21 million.
ROBBIE MYERS, EDITOR-IN-CHIEF, SHONDALAND.COM: Well, I mean I`m happy to say that, you know, I teach a class at Fordham University, young journalists. They want to be you, and they --
MELBER: Or you.
MYERS: Or me. Well, they`re all women but -- and they were all early voters. We were talking about this being the year of the woman, et cetera, et cetera. And I posed that to them, how do they feel about that. And they`re actually really excited about the idea that there are so many women running. But I don`t know that that represents all women, that this is the year of the woman again.
But, you know, to the Senator`s point, I mean I think people are going to get out and actually vote their conscience which is certainly has been stirred by everyone but you and everyone
MELBER: Well, and Senator Boxer, you mentioned the fear mongering. So much of this gets put in the context of the current president, Donald Trump. Obama clearly tried to convey that it`s s bigger than that, that fear is something many people use, including in our recent history. Take a look.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
OBAMA: In 2010, they said for Bill and I, we were setting up death panels to kill your grandma. In 2014, they said Obama is going to kill all of us, shut the borders. In 2016, it was Hillary`s e-mails. You know they don`t care about that because if they did, they would be worried about the current president talking on a cell phone while the Chinese are listening in. There`s just constant fear-mongering to distract from the record.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
MELBER: Senator, what is he doing there? Is he appealing to base Democrats who find that exciting or is he also trying to inoculate other voters who may pay less attention but are tuned in right now?
BOXER: I think he is telling the truth. He is saying that in past elections, fear was used by the Republicans, and a lot of people fell for it. And the fact is, you know, you talk about this president, every other word is, "Be afraid. Be very afraid." And the fact is the Democrats are not falling for it. We keep saying voters, this is not about fear, this election is about you, what your needs are. And there are many needs out there and they`re legitimate needs.
And the pre-existing condition fight that we keep coming back to is quite real, and we could see 23 million Americans lose their health care if the Republicans retain control of the House. So there is serious issues about the American people. Therefore, you see this distraction from the Republicans which they`ve done in the past, and in the past many times they`ve succeeded. I don`t think they`re going to fall for it this time and I`m very excited about the turnout. And I really think that people who are sitting back and watching this are going to move toward hope.
MYERS: I also want to say I think he is doing a little fact checking there, meaning he will introduce a fact, they said this, that didn`t happen. They said X, they said Y, these things didn`t actually happen. And I think that`s probably one of the biggest issues now is that there are so many claims, there`s so much information that`s always rolling out from both sides.
And it is nice to have him stand up and say let me just remind you, the economy was actually doing much better before the recent election and I`m sure, look, we`re all happy that the economy is still doing well, but what was that founded on?
MELBER: And where did it come from?
MYERS: Where did it come from? And are those basic foundations, are they going to be wiped away and how quickly will that turn over? Probably, possibly. I don`t know.
MELBER: Right. And we know people pay more attention right now and going into this weekend. And so you couldn`t have a bigger contrast than Obama, Oprah, and Trump, Cohen.
Robbie Myers and Barbara Boxer, thanks to you both.
BOXER: Thanks.
MELBER: Big questions about Donald Trump`s plan for the troops at the border. Trump walking away from the suggestion that they should open fire against migrants with rocks. "CNN" is reporting that Pentagon rejected a request from Homeland Security that the troops perform emergency law enforcement functions, instead saying they`re actually there to support civil authorities.
Is this election politics or more? I want to bring in Congressman Adam Smith, Democrat from Washington State and I want to mention, as ranking member of the House Armed Services Committee.
Congressman, you would potentially be chairing that committee if your party prevails next week. Thanks for being here tonight.
REP. ADAM SMITH (D-WA), RANKING MEMBER ARMED SERVICES COMMITTEE: Thanks for the chance. I appreciate it.
MELBER: Let`s start here with what Trump is saying he might do on the border. How would you deal with that if you become chairman?
SMITH: Well, first of all, we need to be clear. President Trump hasn`t delivered on the promises he made to the American people. And your two guests alluded to that just a moment ago. Our healthcare system is falling apart. He has had no replacement. People with pre-existing conditions are increasingly being denied access to healthcare.
You`ve got Senator Mitch McConnell saying that you know, because of these $2 trillion in tax cuts that they gave to corporations and the wealthy, they now want to cut Social Security and Medicare, something that Donald Trump promised he would not do. There`s no infrastructure plan. On promise after promise, it is important to working-class people in this country, the president hasn`t delivered.
So what does he want to do? He wants to distract you and scare you as your previous guest said by imagining an invasion coming from our southern border. This inflammatory rhetoric is incredibly divisive, and dangerous, and creates fear in this country and we have seen it, and it creates violent reactions. I think the president is being unbelievably irresponsible in this language about what`s happening south of our border.
And the only reason he is introducing active duty military to it is to ramp up that fear. If you`re claiming there`s invasion, well send the active military down there because that proves it. This is an incredible waste of resources.
MELBER: Do you think he is playing politics with enlisted soldiers?
SMITH: I don`t think there`s any question about it. We have had, in fiscal year 2018, 400,000 people attempt to cross the borders in an unauthorized fashion. The border patrol was able to handle that. Now, we`ve got a series of caravans but by best estimate, the only one that`s recently close to us has about 1,000 to 2,000 people, half of whom are children. Our current border control can absolutely handle that, number one.
Number two, it is not an invasion. It is people seeking asylum. I got an e-mail today from, I don`t know, America First Group. I`m somehow on their e-mail list telling me that there`s this invasion coming to our southern border full of terrorists and murderers and the worst people. That is completely untrue, but that is Donald Trump`s right-wing fear mongering message to cover over the fact that he hasn`t delivered on the promises that he made to the American people.
MELBER: Well, it is interesting because you`re so involved in the oversight to that to get a little factual antidote from you and to keep an eye on what happens. Nobody knows what`s going to happen Tuesday but you would be in a position be driving this if your party does prevail. Congressman Adam Smith on the Democratic side, thank you so much.
SMITH: Thank you for the chance.
MELBER: I want to turn up next to someone so close to the action, they`re very controversial. We`re going to take this on when we`re back in just 30 seconds.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
MELBER: Tonight, we are four days from the midterms. The voters will be deciding if they want to embolden or check Donald Trump and that requires an assessment of his achievements thus far. Anthony Scaramucci campaign for Trump was appointed to economic positions in the administration and a brief stint as White House Communications Director.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
ANTHONY SCARAMUCCI, FORMER WHITE HOUSE COMMUNICATIONS DIRECTOR: He is an unbelievable politician. He is the most competitive person I`ve ever met. OK. I have seen this guy throw a dead spiral through a tie rod. He sinks three-foot putts. Here`s what I would tell you, OK. I love the president and the president is a very very effective communicator.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
MELBER: Anthony Scaramucci live on THE BEAT taking all questions. Your new book is Trump, the Blue Collared President which details your time in the White House. Thanks for being here.
SCARAMUCCI: Yes. And also tells the story of the campaign and how he was able to move a lot of the people that were traditionally Democratic supporters over to his side of the ledger.
MELBER: Let`s talk about how he is trying to move people going into these midterms. A lot of negative messages, a lot of fear. We just talked about that. What`s the positive message from Trump to vote for Republicans Tuesday?
SCARAMUCCI: Well, listen, I mean he is delayered the administrative state. He`s pulled back regulations in the economy. And one thing he has definitely done which they don`t really talk about it the way I am going to, by tightening the border, he took the slack, Ari, out of the labor market. And so he tightened up the labor market for the African-American, Hispanic-American communities, and you`ve also seen wage growth.
So if you look at what The Wall Street Journal reported three weeks ago, they said that the bottom ten percent of the society is experiencing about 5.5 percent wage growth in the last 12 months so --
MELBER: So you see that as a positive for voters who want to give them credit for the economy?
SCARAMUCCI: Those things are positive but here`s the problem. That level of complacently, economic complacency, you don`t get a lot of voters to the voting booth. And so when you -- when you analyze these Midterm Elections, usually angry voters step up and they vote. Obviously, the Democrats are angry about a lot of things in the President`s agenda and some levels of his personality. And so when you look at the totals, he`s trying to get the participation up on the Dem -- on the Republican side to combat what`s going to happen on the Democratic side.
MELBER: You mentioned anger. Someone that you crossed path was John Kelly seems pretty angry. Let me read from a New York Times account that Mr. Kelly grabbed another Trump aide, Mr. Lewandowski by the collar, pushed him against a wall. The Times account says Lewandowski didn`t get physical in response. That looks like one-way violence in the White House. Is that appropriate?
SCARAMUCCI: Well, listen. I mean, it`s not appropriate. Obviously, I have my issues with John Kelly and so I mean, I wrote about him in the book. The flipside is you know, I admire the guys service to the country. He did lose a son in the Iraq war and so I admire all those things that the family has done for the country. But as it relates to him and his militancy and his military management style, as I`ve written in my book and expressed openly, that`s probably not the best thing for the White House. OK, you probably needed a little bit softer, more civilian touch in the White House and I think it`s --
MELBER: Softer than assault is what you`re saying.
SCARAMUCCI: Yes. Well, I wasn`t there and what does Corey`s saying about it? Did that actually happened or not?
MELBER: I mean, that`s a source account and it`s from people who say they witnessed it.
SCARAMUCCI: Yes, I`m not saying it didn`t happen but here`s the thing, if it did happen, then it sort of fits like -- I may not have been the best communications director. I only lasted 11 days but I`ve run two reasonably sized businesses, founded both of them, and I know how to evaluate talent. And so when you`re -- when you`re putting a team together, you got to have like a level of collaboration. It can`t just be a top-down command structure, it`s not going to work in a civilian organization.
So Trump pushing people around like that though, you know, he should either apologize for that, admit that he did it and apologize for it or you know, something perhaps a little bit more aggressive --
MELBER: Right. Well, that`s interesting coming for you because he hasn`t done that. You mentioned the markets and the economy going in the --
SCARAMUCCI: Well, guys like him have a tough time apologizing. You know that.
MELBER: Yes. Well, let`s take a look at how --
SCARAMUCCI: Guys like you and me are intellectually secure, Ari, so we can apologize.
MELBER: I see. I see you have some view of yourself and of me. Let me play for you --
SCARAMUCCI: Intellectual security.
MELBER: -- Republicans and Trump, how they campaigned to get into office on deficits. Take a look.
SCARAMUCCI: OK.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
LARRY KUDLOW, DIRECTOR, UNITED STATES NATIONAL ECONOMIC COUNCIL: Deficit which is one of the other criticism is coming down and it`s coming down rapidly.
SEN. MITCH MCCONNELL (R-KY), SENATE MAJORITY LEADER: It`s very disturbing and it`s driven by the three big entitlement programs that are very popular Medicare, Social Security, and Medicaid.
REP. PAUL RYAN (R-KY), SPEAKER OF THE HOUSE: That was going to happen -- the baby boomers retiring was going to do that.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
MELBER: Do you agree with that, the deficits and growing deficits are a problem for America?
SCARAMUCCI: Well, I mean, those guys are confusing to me because they`re saying they`re a problem but they`re layering on more deficit spending. And so when you really step back from it and analyze it and you know, I was trained as an economist, run an 11 billion --
MELBER: Yes, you know this stuff, yes.
SCARAMUCCI: The deficit is actually OK for right now when you look at the whole totality of the deficit. What would really spook people and the International debt markets is a systemic rise in inflation. And so --
MELBER: But before we get to inflation, I just want to get you on this. They ran saying deficits were a problem under Obama.
SCARAMUCCI: Yes.
MELBER: Now they`re growing the deficit.
SCARAMUCCI: Yes.
MELBER: Isn`t that wrong?
SCARAMUCCI: Yes, that`s wrong, but that`s a hypocrisy of the swamp, OK. That`s why people like me you know, last --
MELBER: But that`s Donald Trump. That`s the guy you like. And I`ll put it -- let me put up on the screen so voters can see because a lot of people are making up their mind right now.
SCARAMUCCI: I appreciate you wanting to hold me accountable and that`s fine.
MELBER: I do. Here`s Barack Obama --
SCARAMUCCI: But the --
MELBER: Let me show you. 587 billion was when he was leaving office. Donald Trump run saying deficits are a problem. Kudlow, you just saw there who`s in charge and they`re growing the deficit now under Trump to 782 billion. Is that not just hypocritical but really wrong because they promised the opposite.
SCARAMUCCI: OK, so there`s a number of layers to the question. So the first one is the deficit it`s not going to have that big of an impact, I could explain that if you want. Number two, that`s totally hypocritical and I totally disagree with. We should be straighter with the American people. Number three, if you look at the Obama Administration, they racked up more debt than the other 43 administrations combined in terms of the amount of deficit spending that they spent.
And by the way, while we`re at it, you know, President Bush, he put in a tax cut in March of 2001 and then we went to war in October, unfortunate, because --
MELBER: But I`m asking about the guy you worked for, Trump. You`re saying they are wrong to grow those deficits?
SCARAMUCCI: Well, I`m saying it`s not as going to have a big of impact as people think, but I think it`s wrong to mislead people.
MELBER: It`s wrong to mislead people and they ran on cutting the deficit. They said it was bad under Obama. We`ll put it back up on the screen. They`re growing the deficit. This seems like something that they have to be answerable for. Let me show you Donald Trump at Boeing -- there it is. I mean that`s something people should know. Donald Trump at Boeing saying the tax cuts we`re going to help everybody. Take a look.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
DONALD TRUMP, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: Six months ago I promised that we would cut taxes to bring Main Street roaring all the way back and we did. We helped Wall Street, we helped Main Street, we helped everybody.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
MELBER: You know right now today that`s not true. It helped Wall Street, it has not boosted other investments.
SCARAMUCCI: Oh other investments or other people?
MELBER: Mainstream investment, business investment.
SCARAMUCCI: OK. So look, you have to first of all again measure these things over a 12 to 18-month period of time. The tax cut went into place 11 months ago. Any economist is really doing the work and being honest. It takes about 18 months for that to filter through the system. If you`re making the point that there was an immediate impact for American large corporations and Wall Street, 100 percent true, but --
MELBER: Which people -- you`ve been successfully, you`re a Harvard law guy, you`re a Wall Street guy, but it`s not getting out there, and let me - - I`m going to let you finish but I want to show --
SCARAMUCCI: The missing element of the --
MELBER: Let me show you Washington Post, tax cuts not leading to business investment. Headline, Trump tax cuts failed to spark investment boom. The wait goes on for the business investment boom that Republicans promised this corporate tax cut would unleash. If it`s not happening now, are you guys -- are the Republicans running on Tuesday saying trust us, it`ll happen at some later date in the future.
SCARAMUCCI: No, I`m saying that there`s a lag effect. There`s at least 18 months. There`s a little bit of disingenuous. I didn`t read the whole article but somebody that was really doing their economic homework in an article like that would say listen, you typically don`t see the effect for 18 months, you`re 11 months into the tax cut. So obviously they`re trying to spin it in a certain way. But you`re asking a different question a more important question. Will it have an impact? Will it have a systemic sustainable impact on the economy and will it lead to rising wages. And I think the answer to that is yes. And again there`s three reasons for that. Number one --
MELBER: We`re almost out of time.
SCARAMUCCI: OK so --
MELBER: I want one more thing with you. We talk policy, we talk markets which is your thing, before I let you go, you know Michael Cohen. He says Donald Trump use racist words. Is he telling the truth or is he lying?
SCARAMUCCI: Well, let me put it to you this way. Michael worked on that whole inner-city thing for the president and you know, I have very good relationship with Jim Brown and the people that worked on that like you know --
MELBER: Is he telling the truth do you think or is he lying?
SCARAMUCCI: I don`t know.
MELBER: You don`t know the answer?
SCARAMUCCI: I don`t.
MELBER: Have you ever heard Donald Trump talk like that?
SCARAMUCCI: On the Bible, I`ve never heard him talk anything like that. Of anything, I thought his signature line what do you have to lose, because a lot of these left-leaning policies in the inner cities have been a disaster for the African-American community. I thought that was a pretty winning statement. He got a higher voting percentage than McCain and Romney in 16 and his approval rating since he furloughed that woman, grandmother, have gone up in the African American community so --
MELBER: I got I don`t need a break for "FALLBACK FRIDAY."
SCARAMUCCI: I don`t think the President is a racist though. If you think that, I don`t think that.
MELBER: Copy. I got to fit in a break. Like the President, some people like you a lot some people don`t like you a lot, I appreciate you coming in and taking the question.
SCARAMUCCI: We take you take bullets in Washington. I mean, if you like somebody and other people don`t like you, what are you going to do?
MELBER: I appreciate you coming and taking the question.
SCARAMUCCI: What other people think of you, Ari, is none of your business. Remember that.
MELBER: There you go. Anthony Scaramucci on THE BEAT. Up ahead it`s Friday and it`s time to fall back. We got Desus and Mero in the house.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
MELBER: It`s Friday on THE BEAT. Today we have a very special edition to "FALLBACK FRIDAY," a takeover with yes, the comedy duo Desus and Mero.
(CROSSTALK)
MELBER: Wow. You guys -- you guys have a lot of energy coming in the news. You guys are very funny people. You have a big following -- you also cover a lot of politics. In 2019 you`re debuting a brand new weekly show on Showtime. Congratulations.
Thank you.
MELBER: Let`s take a look at some of your work.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Didn`t -- you didn`t celebrate Halloween in the Bronx?
THE KID MERO, COMEDIAN: I mean, every day in the Bronx is Halloween basically.
There`s only two costumes you can wear in the Bronx, the dead President`s face paint or a screen mask that you get from the Dollar Store.
DESUS NICE, COMEDIAN: Are you tired of talking about Donald Trump yet or is it just like everyday you`re just like this is --
RACHEL MADDOW, MSNBC HOST: You know what, it`s -- the thing that -- I go in everyday with the intention of not talking about Donald Trump, and then --
MERO: (INAUDIBLE) is coming down.
NICE: Trump former campaign manager Paul Manafort got his (BLEEP) indicted.
MERO: Because there`s a tendency for him flip on his Trump his (INAUDIBLE).
(END VIDEO CLIP)
MELBER: You guys have fun? You do what you do. Desus, who needs to fall back?
NICE: This week, who needs to fall back? Jacob Wohl --
MELBER: Jacob Wohl --
NICE: We`ve known him --
MELBER: (INAUDIBLE) and framed Bob Mueller.
NICE: Keystone cop`s style. We`ve known -- we`ve seen this guy`s name familiar for you on Twitter. He replies to Donald Trump`s tweets. He`s like kind of a troll. It looks like-- you know, he was using -- he`s using Photoshop pictures, (INAUDIBLE)
MERO: I guess this guy doesn`t know about reverse image search on Google, I guess, and he also use the picture of Christoph Waltz. I`m like who (INAUDIBLE) it`s the most awesome movie ever.
NICE: It was very recommendable. And also they have a press conference today and who was -- the guy that Robert -- the other guy. He had his fly open for the whole press conference. So it`s just -- on every level this is just -- it wasn`t fully thought through. We have no idea what they were trying to do if this was even like will thought out, but it may have worked because right now we`re talking about it. Even though I didn`t officially work --
MELBER: They wanted it to work more. They want people to talk to about it. As if there is a problem for Bob Mueller. I mean, Mero, you know how they say like the one person you don`t fight in the club is the bouncer?
MERO: Yes.
MELBER: How are going to try to frame former FBI Director Robert Mueller?
NICE: Like that`s not the guy.
MERO: Like that`s not the dude. He`s the -- he`s the guy. Like he discovers frame jobs.
NICE: He maybe someone who grabs you like --
MERO: Chill, chill, chill. (INAUDIBLE) don`t get rob like that.
NICE: Jacob, you need to fall back.
MELBER: Mero, who needs to fall back?
MERO: The Tristate area, every other borough, you know what I`m saying? Because you know why? Because the Bronx got the biggest pumpkin in world. The world`s biggest pumpkin comes from New York.
NICE: From the Bronx, from the botanical garden of the Bronx.
(CROSSTALK)
MERO: That`s right. You know what I mean? So fall all the way back. We got the largest (INAUDIBLE) in the world.
MELBER: Where does pumpkin fit in on the list of fruits though? Because pumpkin like only gets to shine like a little bit out of the year.
MERO: I`m like -- I consider pumpkin like an in between -- it`s like he`s mysterious, you know what I mean? Because it`s like pumpkin is a fruit because it has seeds but it`s like you`re also like not a fruit.
NICE: How did it become he?
MERO: I don`t know. I just -- I just gendered the pumpkin.
NICE: I think -- I think pumpkin is like a top-20, like in the 20 or 40 range. It`s not top 20 fruit or vegetable or --
MERO: So you like --
MELBER: I think pumpkin is low on list. I`m big on tomato and other people try to define tomato your fruit, but you`re in the vegetable lounge. Tomatoes are like, don`t label me. What I am is delicious and I`m in every kind of sandwich.
(CROSSTALK)
MELBER: Fruit norms.
MERO: Yes, he`s on the spectrum. Like he doesn`t care. You know what I`m saying? Like he`s just like I`m just like I`m on the sauce. I`m chilling.
MELBER: That`s something I will be honest even on this show we haven`t covered enough which is fruit normative culture.
NICE: Yes. It`s prevalent nowadays all over our campuses.
MERO: It`s -- yes, it`s out of control. You know what I`m saying?
MELBER: Anyone watching the T.V. on mute will not know this is for tomatoes.
MERO: We can be talking about the (INAUDIBLE)
MELBER: All right, those are your fallbacks. I want to dig in the proverbial crags of your show because you guys do a lot of funny stuff, a moment with Will Smith that also relates to our current politics. Take a look.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
WILL SMITH, ACTOR: I want to represent magic, right, that you`re in a universe and two plus two equals four. Two plus two only equals four if you accept that two plus two equals four. Two plus two is going to be what I want it to be.
MERO: There`s two fingers, there`s two fingers, now put them together, there`s four fingers. That`s it.
NICE: He`s talking about he`s trying to get us some wow money scheme on Facebook.
MERO: Come on, dog, chill.
We all got to ask it. What`s the net worth?
NICE: It got to be in the bank.
MERO: You have enough in the bank to talk like this. How much?
NICE: Oh no.
MERO: The guy has worked that much.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
MERO: Quarter bill, Will.
MELBER: So you don`t think Will Smith can change the laws of math?
NICE: No, you can`t do that.
MELBER: But isn`t that what Trump has gotten away with politically?
MERO: Absolutely.
NICE: It`s something we say all the time in our podcast. Facts don`t matter.
MERO: Facts don`t matter.
NICE: And if you say it with your chest and you`re just like facts don`t matter, and someone says no they do that and you say no, that`s it. That`s the end of it.
MERO: That`s the President now.
MELBER: So Will Smith was -- he was ahead of his time politically.
MERO: He was way ahead of his time. Donald Trump was the loudest guy in the barbershop.
NICE: Yes
MERO: He`s like no, no no, you got what`s best than Wu-Tang. That`s it. That`s it.
MELBER: Who else needs to fall back, Mero?
MERO: Twitter, fall back. Like you keep trying to update and do all types of stuff. Twitter is looking to remove the like button. Friend, leave it alone. Leave it alone. The only thing we wanted is to edit tweets. That`s it. If you give us that, it would be good. Other than that, leave it alone. Fall back.
MELBER: Fall back.
NICE: I think that might be something -- there`s something -- a visual component to that because we`re out on Twitter every day like, my god, do something about the Nazi. These people are harassing us. And Twitter is literally ripping out the heart icon thing from Twitter. It`s the one thing that`s about love.
MELBER: That`s like also that`s not shouting or virtue signaling, but just like, I like that.
MERO: Yes, I think that`s cool.
NICE: Yes, exactly.
MERO: And sometimes you don`t want -- you -- like you agree with some but it`s not like --
MELBER: Some potential names for your new show on Showtime have leaked and we have them. The number five -- number five, The Brand is Strong.
MERO: OK.
NICE: All right.
MELBER: Number four, Tom and Jerry.
MERO: OK.
NICE: OK.
MELBER: Can you live with that?
MERO: I mean --
NICE: You can`t clear that from Warner Brothers.
MERO: Yes. (INAUDIBLE) meet me out physically.
MELBER: OK, then things start to get interesting. Number three We Run Tings
MERO: Tings don`t run we. Everything happen to (INAUDIBLE)
MELBER: And you told me your mother is from Jamaica?
NICE: Yes, both my parents are from Jamaica.
MELBER: Both? So shout out to your parents.
NICE: Shout out to Kingston --
MELBER: So they might like that.
NICE: They won`t like it, no.
MELBER: No?
NICE: We don`t like things.
MELBER: Now, look at the -- this one surprise me. The Story of Adinon. Just as the name of your whole show.
NICE: Just for no reason, that`s -- just to be (INAUDIBLE).
MERO: Just to be (INAUDIBLE).
NICE: There`s a booze you see right here.
MERO: Who`s going to go on this (INAUDIBLE)
MELBER: And I got the number one name. We believe this could be the real name of the show. You Know What It Is: A Bear and Two Random Dudes From The Bronx.
MERO: What do you think about like The Beat with Desus and Mero?
MELBER: That`s not taken?
MERO: No, we did the Google Search, nothing came up.
MELBER: I shine, you shine, we shine together.
NICE: Our executive producer Jacob is helping us with this so --
MELBER: Are any of those names are actually on your final list?
NICE: We are not allowed to say it.
MELBER: So it could be one?
NICE: It could be one of those.
MELBER: You won`t tell us your name.
NICE: We can`t tell.
MERO: You got to -- you got to call Surefire security to find out.
MELBER: Yo, that`s a Surefire Jacob Wohl security joke. That`s impressive. We always love when you guys are here. Take a lighter, you know, we`d have THE BEAT lighters of "FALLBACK FRIDAY" or four or five. Desus and Mero.
MERO: I want a lighter. I know where I`m getting from.
MELBER: By the way, let me -- you`re in New York.
MERO: I`m putting right in -- I`m putting these on my kid`s stocking. You know what I`m saying?
MELBER: If you`re in New York, I want to plug you guys. They`re going to be in Madison Square Garden for the New York Comedy Festival on November 11th. Check it out.
DESUS: Yes.
MELBER: Wow.
MERO: Everybody was like, no there`s no fire outside.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
MELBER: I want to share something else with you because it`s Friday, and also because this country has an important election next week. This is something I recently did. We caught up with hip-hop artist and co-founder of The Roots, Black Thought, and he had a special fall back he wants to share with you.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
BLACK THOUGHT, CO-FOUNDER, THE ROOT: If you`re unhappy with the government and the way things are run in this country, but you don`t plan on voting in the upcoming Midterm Elections, then you need to fall back.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
MELBER: A preemptive warning "FALLBACK." If you or your friends are not ready to vote, everyone, no matter what you think or believe should get out there and vote next week. And as for this weekend, I do want to share a programing note. I am going to be joined by several colleagues for with extended special coverage for the Midterms starting 6:00 p.m. Eastern this Saturday. Joy Reid will be there. I`ll be in at 7:00, and my colleague Stephanie Ruhle and Lawrence O`Donnell at 8:00 p.m. and 9:00 p.m. Eastern. We want you to know about that in case you want to catch all the Midterms news on Saturday night.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
MELBER: That does it for me. I`ll see you back here tomorrow at 7:00 p.m. Eastern, or Monday at 6:00 p.m. the usual time. "HARDBALL" with Chris Matthews is up next.
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED. END
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