Republicans tout “Kavanaugh bump”. TRANSCRIPT: 10/12/2018, All In w Chris Hayes.

Kristen Clarke, Rick Wilson, Mehdi Hasan, Tara Dowdell, Howard Dean

Date: October 12, 2018
Guest: Kristen Clarke, Rick Wilson, Mehdi Hasan, Tara Dowdell, Howard

CHRIS MATTHEWS, MSNBC HOST: Tune in Sunday night at 9:00 p.m. Eastern.
“ALL IN” with Chris Hayes starts right now.



this votes.

REID: The plot to steal 2018.

to understand is we`re fighting this.

REID: Tonight, the woman bringing the lawsuit to stop voter suppression in
Georgia joins me live. Then, why the Trump reaction to a missing
Washington Post Columnist is becoming a national security crisis.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: What`s his statement to U.S.-Saudi relations, sir?

TRUMP: I would say they`re excellent.

REID: Plus, inside the rapidly expanding tent city of migrant children in
Trump`s America. And 25 days until Election Day. Why Democrats running as
Democrats are making the biggest wave.

REP. BETO O`ROURKE (D), TEXAS: Are you with me?

REID: When ALL IN starts now.


REID: Good evening from New York. I`m Joy Reid in for Chris Hayes. In
the immediate wake of Brett Kavanaugh`s confirmation to the Supreme Court,
Republican messaging to the public was that the fight was a total win for
them, that it turned things around for Republican candidates in the
midterms, fired at the base and effectively shut down a blue wave. In
other words, Republicans wanted you to believe that they are winning. But
tonight with 25 days to Election Day, there are lots of signs that
Republicans were either faking that bravado or were just wrong.

Polls show a majority of Americans still disapprove of Kavanaugh`s
confirmation and a majority supports further investigation of the newly
minted Associate Justice even if those investigations lead to his removal.
And in states around the country, Republican candidates sure aren`t acting
like they`re confident that they can win this November without extra help
because across the country Republicans are working overtime to try and
engineer an electorate that will keep them in power. By blocking people
from voting if they`re not the kinds of people who tend to vote Republican.

The Republican majority Supreme Court just refused to block a voter I.D.
law in North Dakota which disproportionately targets Native Americans who
just happened to be a key part of the debate – of the base for Democratic
Senator Heidi Heitkamp who`s fighting a tough battle for reelection.
Another voter I.D. law was just upheld in Arkansas and it was passed last
year by the Republican state legislature. And in Ohio, a federal judge
ruled against voters who were purged from the rolls by the Republican
Secretary of State.

But nowhere is the fight over voting rights more in your face than in
Georgia where access to the ballot could decide the state`s next governor.
It`s now a dead heat between Republican Brian Kemp, the current Secretary
of State and Democrat Stacey Abrams who will be the nation`s first black
woman governor and the first ever governor of Georgia who is not a white
man. Kemp is running a familiar southern strategy trying to scare his
almost entirely white conservative base into voting for him.


in case I need to round up criminal illegals and take them home myself.
Yes, I just said that. I`m Brian Kemp. If you want a politically and
correct conservative, that`s me.


REID: Now Kemp is being sued for using his official role overseeing
Georgia`s elections. Yes, he`s overseeing his own election to
disenfranchise tens of thousands of people of color while he`s running for
governor. The Associated Press reported that Kemp`s office has put 53,000
voter registrations on hold under the state`s exact match law passed by the
Republican legislature and championed by Kemp himself.

According to the A.P., 70 percent of the voters whose registrations are on
hold are black compared to Georgia`s overall population which is 32 percent
black. In a race this close, those 53,000 votes could make all the
difference. And that`s on top of 1.4 million voter registrations in
Georgia already purged from the rolls since 2012 according to the A.P. A
coalition of civil rights groups is now suing Kemp in federal court arguing
his office is violating the Voting Rights Act and the Constitution.

And I`m joined now by the head of the organization leading that lawsuit,
Kristen Clarke, President and Executive Director of the National Lawyers
Committee for Civil Rights Under Law. Kristen, thank you so much for being


REID: So let`s go back through these 1.2 million people who are
disenfranchised under this law. They`re not just black because you are
suing on a coalition that includes an Asian American organization, a Latino
organization, African-American organizations. So this seems to have been
target essentially at voters who are not white.

CLARKE: Yes, absolutely. When we conducted an analysis of the scheme back
in 2016, we have to remember this is not new, we sued Brian Kemp over the
same exact voter suppression scheme in 2016 and found that it clearly had a
disproportionate impact on African-Americans, Latinos, and Asian-Americans
who are trying to make it onto the registration rolls. We sued Brian Kemp
then and won and so it is remarkable to be here two years later where the
state is seeking to resurrect something that they know is discriminatory.

We look again and find the same evidence. It has a disproportionate impact
on minority communities and those are the very people who the state wants
to lock out of the process. So it`s why we filed this lawsuit. We believe
there should be a level playing field where everyone gets to have a voice.

REID: And if in fact, left only 9.8 3 percent of those pending for failure
to verify applications or submitted by applicants identifying as white.
Can you just explained how exact match works and how it is keeping people
from being able to vote?

CLARKE: So how it works is somebody trying to register, completes a form
that gets – entered into a database by a county registrar and if there is
one letter, one hyphen, one accent mark, one extra space that deviates from
information in the state`s database, that individual is penalized and their
form is not processed in the routine way that other people`s forms get
processed. It is a process that is riddled with errors.

You can imagine for people entering the information into the state database
or on the county level, they are making errors all over the place. And
what we find is that people of color have names that are a little bit less
typical and that`s where the errors are at their highest. Brian Kemp knows
this, the state knows this, and they knew it in 2016. He is a repeat
offender seeking to race forward with this discriminatory scheme once
again. And so we`re in court now to stop him.

REID: Yes. And I spoke with a state civil rights official this morning to
talk about somebody whose name is Devin who was caught an exact match
because the Registrar wrote Devon, so little thing like that. Just – I
want to have you explain to people if you`re on that list of 53,000 people,
what should you do and should you still show up to vote on November 6th?

CLARKE: You should show up. The state has sent out a notice to these
individuals that`s not clear that likely got overlooked. But those
individuals should absolutely show up on Election Day. They should be
given the opportunity to vote. The only thing is that they may be
subjected to a stricter I.D. requirement than other individuals.

We hope that we can provide relief before Election Day. We encourage
people to call our election protection hotline at 866-OURVOTE. We have
trained legal volunteers that are on hand providing information to make
sure that people know what they need to participate on Election Day and
we`ve been getting tons of calls sadly from people across Georgia.

REID: Yes. I mean, the important thing is do not give up your right to
vote easily. Make sure that you fight to get to vote. Not provisionally
but to usually vote.

CLARKE: That`s right.

REID: Kristen Clarke, thank you very much. Thank you for what doing.

CLARKE: Thanks for having me.

REID: I appreciate it. Well, for more on the stakes of – over battle –
in this battle over voting rights in Georgia and beyond, I`m joined by New
York Times Columnist Michelle Goldberg who is now officially an MSNBC
Contributor, congratulations and Republican Strategist Rick Wilson.

Rick, I actually want to start with you. I usually would do ladies first
but Brian Kemp, his response to the fact that you have this civil rights
organization leading a lawsuit of five Georgia organizations. This is a
Georgia Asian-American organization, a Georgia based African – Georgia
based African-American, Georgia based Latino organizations, one that was
created by Joe Lowery, the Reverend Joe Lowery, he has responded to this
lawsuit by calling them outside agitators. And that`s a phrase that will
be familiar to anyone who has studied the civil rights movement. That`s
the way that he`s playing this.

Please explain to us as somebody who`s been in the Republican Party who
understands the southern Republican Party why is it that they feel
comfortable being this open about running an old-fashioned Southern
Strategy to say to Black and Brown and Asian-American people you may not

RICK WILSON, REPUBLICAN STRATEGIST: Well, Joy, this is a two-point race
basically according to all the – all the surveys which in the state of
Georgia, one of the reddest of red states in a lot of ways is terrifying to
guys like Brian. And so they`re going to pull out every trope in the old
catalog and they feel a lot more free to do that in the era of Trump to
sort of signal, blow that dog whistle in the era of Trump and they`re
terrified because it`s a two-point race. He should be a generic
Republican, should probably be up seven to ten points right now without
breaking a sweat and you know, they`re fighting it Stacey Abrams and here
fighting it down till the last dog dies.

So he`s definitely feeling on attention and pressure here. And these are
the tactics of a base only election. He`s willing to burn any chance of
African-Americans or Hispanics or anybody else in these growing Georgia
populations. You know, Georgia`s 30.6 percent African-American if my
numbers are correct and so he`s willing to play this game very
aggressively. And in a way that also seems to me – you know, I haven`t
studied the lawsuits per se but it seems to me that these things are just
fraught with legal jeopardy for him to have them overturned. And you know,
based on the election, he`s going to scrap for every vote and try to keep
everybody else off the playing field. It explains it but it doesn`t excuse

REID: Yes, you know – and Michelle, you wrote a piece on this question of
and I`ve been thinking a lot about this idea of minority rule that you have
you know, a white population of conservative Christians who say we are
going to rule this state, this county, this city, this country and it
really doesn`t matter who becomes the majority or what they want. You
will be ruled by us period, end of story.

And you write part of the reason this country is sliding into minority rule
in structural. The Senate and the electoral college both gave
disproportionate power to white rural voters, that the right is also gaming
the system to try and stop changing demographics from changing the
country`s balance of political power. It`s very open now.

MICHELLE GOLDBERG, MSNBC CONTRIBUTOR: Right. It`s very open, it`s very
obvious. I mean it`s essentially the legislative version of the people
marching around Charlottesville saying you will not replace us.

REID: Yes.

GOLDBERG: You know, and Stacey Abrams is this remarkable candidate who
basically is trying a new sort of Democratic campaign in a southern state.
And I remember when she first told me about it last year of this idea that
you know, Georgia is only a little bit under 53 percent non-Hispanic white,
right? It`s a very diverse state. It`s a very kind of thriving state, you
know, with like a lot of young people, of technology. And so it`s a state
where the demographics are changing in ways that are favorable to the
Democratic Party.

She was convinced that rather than running the way people usually run in
southern states which is to find a slightly less conservative white guy,
she could kind of harness the power of this potential new electorate. And
it looked like she was getting really close to doing that. I mean if you
just – if you look at the polls, if you look at all these new voter
registrations, but that depends on this new electorate actually being
allowed to vote for her.

REID: Yes. And I mean, Rick, I`m old enough to remember when Republicans
used to say that if you`re in a demographic situation where there`s this
rising tide, let`s say of Hispanic voters in your cohort, if there are more
Asian-Americans coming around, I remember there used to be a lot of
courting of Arab-Americas. They said you know, we need to try to eat into
that constituency because we`re losing the demographic battle overall.
They said – even try to get African-American voters based on common social
conservative ideas. That is gone. Republicans have said nope, we – are
Republicans behind closed doors comfortable with this idea that they are
willing to rule a hostile majority as long as they rule.

WILSON: No. Actually a lot of them are terrified of it because an awful
lot of Republicans even today the ones who are all you know, bowing down to
Trump recognize for years that we`ve been insufficient in our efforts to
reach African-Americans and insufficient in our efforts to reach Hispanics,
and insufficient in our efforts to reach Asians. And now what`s happened
in the era of Trump is you have to have this assertive position that says,
nah we don`t need you. We want 55-year-old white guys who watch Fox News,
that`s it. That`s the base. We`re going to play to that audience. That`s
where we`re going to go.

And you know, as every political strategist in history has said, you cannot
get to a majority by subtraction. You just can`t get there. And right now
you know, you`re looking at an argument where the Republican majority in
Georgia is under demographic challenge and so instead of saying hey we`re
going to have different candidates, we`re going to flex a little bit, we`re
going to do a little better at outreach, it`s no, we`re not going to play.
We want our base to turn out, that`s it, and that`s the game.

REID: And that only works, Michelle Goldberg, as long as white women play
along as long. As a majority of white women go along and add themselves to
this white male sort of dominance, it works.


REID: But my question is in the wake of Kavanaugh, how solid can that? I
mean, it`s maybe 50 percent, but can they keep it being 53 percent.

GOLDBERG: I don`t know. I mean, I think that you know, obviously Stacey
Abrams is going to do I think really well with single women who took
constituency that she`s specifically targeted, and you know there are a lot
of these wearing women, I`ve met them in Georgia who weren`t particularly
politically active, you know had a PTA moms who woke up after Donald Trump
was elected and were scared and traumatized and are now out there
organizing like nothing anyone has ever seen.

Whether there`s enough of them, you know whether there`s enough of them who
sort of see their self-interest in being women and citizens as opposed to
their self-interested being part of the vanishing white majority, that
remains to be seen.

REID: That is the trillion dollar question. Michelle Goldberg, welcome to
the family.

GOLDBERG: Thank you.

RIED: Rick Wilson, thank you very much. Congratulations on that book,
man. Great to have you both. And up next, how Donald Trump`s non-
committal response to the potential murder of a Washington Post Columnist
is creating a national security crisis. Mehdi Hasan and Malcolm Nance
joined me to talk about the latest on missing journalist Jamal Khashoggi in
two minutes.



TRUMP: This is a very serious thing and we`re looking at it in a very
serious manner, OK. And we`ll see you. We have a big crowd.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Have you spoken to the King of Saudi Arabia about this

TRUMP: I have not. I have not.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Do you have plans to see him, sir?

TRUMP: I will. I will be calling him. I will be calling at some point
King Salman.


REID: Donald Trump is under renewed pressure tonight after a series of
non-committal responses to the disappearance of a Washington Post columnist
in Turkey last week. Jamal Khashoggi entered the Saudi consulate in
Istanbul late Tuesday and hasn`t been seen since. Turkish officials say
they`re confident that Khashoggi was murdered. And now businesses
including CNBC are pulling out of a Saudi investment conference this month
as a result.

Notably, the CEO of Uber is among those dropping out of the future
investment initiative conference in Riyadh. That`s especially significant
because the Saudi Arabians sovereign wealth fund is a major Uber investor.
But do you know who`s still planning to attend the conference? The U.S.
Treasury Secretary Stephen Mnuchin.


at this point. If more information comes out and changes, we could look at
that but I am planning on going.


REID: Here to help me understand what`s going on as Mehdi Hasan Columnist
and Senior Contributor at the Intercept and Host of the deconstructed
podcast and MSNBC Terrorism Analyst Malcolm Nance. Thank you both for
being here. Mehdi, I`m going to start with you because I think it`s
confounding to a lot of people. This seems pretty simple. This is a U.S.
resident, wrote for The Washington Post, he`s thought dead, presumed dead,
perhaps murdered inside this consulate. Donald Trump can`t bring himself
to say unequivocally this is a terrible thing. We`re going to get to the
bottom of it. Why?

right. He won`t say unequivocally. He got more angry at the cost of
Hamilton. He got angry at Nordstrom when they dropped Ivanka`s clothing
chain. He doesn`t get angry when a permanent resident for the United
States is murdered on foreign soil by an allied government. And they
aren`t – the answer, well, there`s many potential answers.

One of the obvious ones is, is he making money out of Saudi Arabia which is
a question that`s being asked a lot now because we never got the Trump`s
tax returns. We know that the Saudis spent a lot of money on his
apartment. He bragged about it a couple years ago in the action campaign
that they spent $40, $50 million on his apartment earlier this year, the
Trump International Hotel in Manhattan, posted the first increase in
revenue in two years in its first quarter thanks to the Saudi entourage
with the Crown Prince Mohammed bin Salman coming to stay.

It`s really odd. I mean this is a President with lots of conflicts of
interest and a President who likes authoritarian leaders like the Saudi
King and the Saudi Crown Prince, so it`s a perfect storm.

REID: Yes, absolutely. Let`s just actually play Donald Trump. He`s in
Mobile, Alabama on August 21st, 2015 and this is Donald Trump talking about
Saudi Arabia to your very point Mehdi.


TRUMP: Saudi Arabia – and I get along great with all of them. They buy
apartments for me. They spend $40 million, $50 million. Am I supposed to
dislike them? I like them very much.


REID: And Malcolm, it`s not just Trump, it`s also his son-in-law. You
know, we all remember, you and I have talked about this many, many times
when Jared Kushner went hand in hand over to the Mideast to Qatar and to
Saudi Arabia looking to get that 666 Fifth Avenue building paid off. He
made buddies with NBS, with the leader of Saudi Arabia. Is this just as
crass as that, that the Trump family are in hock, they have moneyed
interests with the Saudis and therefore this is just going to be let go?

MALCOLM NANCE, MSNBC TERRORISM ANALYST: Well, it`s quite possible that
that`s true, that it is just going to be let go. And now to the chagrin of
the Trump family, it`s probably not going to be Robert Mueller that puts
that information out. If anything, it`s going to be the Alliance of the
government of Turkey, Erdogan`s Turkey and the government of Qatar who have
a grudge against the Saudi government for imposing a blockade against them,
and they`ve created this sort of ad-hoc Alliance. And the Turks themselves
have their own interests that they need from Donald Trump. One of which is
the release or I`m sorry, not the release but the rendition of Fethullah
Gulen, one of the ones biggest enemies who is a resident of Pennsylvania.

And so I think there`s going to be some Middle East blackmail, something
which they`re very good at between the Trump family and Mohammed bin Salman
of Saudi Arabia and Erdogan in Turkey. Because if the real story gets out
that it – that it`s true that the Saudis did this murder and that the
United States may have known about it, then you have a something that`s a
crisis that could take down both government.

REID: Yes, and Mehdi, you know, it was your – the news organization that
you work for they put that did do this story that hints at the fact that
Jared Kushner was very open. That he liked his father-in-law had very
loose lips when in the – when in the presence of foreign leaders whom he
probably should not have been chatting to, right? And that he may have
given information to the Saudis that was helpful to them in determining who
was speaking about them out of turn. Is there – I mean, what do we have
to back that up?

HASAN: Well, I mean, the report from my colleagues also mentioned, you
remember the Intercept that MBS himself bragged to others that he had Jared
Kushner in his pocket. So the close relationship between these two –
these two princes if you could call them that, has been known for all.
What`s interesting is what I – what I always find so fascinating when we
talk about Jared Kushner and MBS is they`re both so similar. They`re both
kind of spoiled brats in their 30s, over-promoted and actually not very
good at their jobs.

Everything MBS touches turns to dust. The war in Yemen, disaster. The
blockade of Qatar, disaster. And now if he ordered this assassination of
Jamal Khashoggi, I think it`s backfired in a way he never imagined. That
maybe he thought that his great Davos in the desert conference would fall
apart like this over the death of Jamal Khashoggi where all these U.S
.media companies are pulling out of sponsors. Richard Branson is saying he
doesn`t want Saudi money. You`ve got Arianna Huffington saying she won`t
speak there.

I mean, one thing I would say though, I mean it`s easy to line up and bash
Trump and we should. He`s the President but all these U.S. media companies
and all these U.S. business leaders, the head of Uber, I mean why did it
take the killing of Khashoggi for them to think again about how much they
buddied up with the Saudis? I mean, the Saudis have been starving and
blockading the people of Yemen for several years now.

REID: Yes. And it is a fair point you know, Malcolm, because just the
people who are quitting that conference tells you who was going to the
conference, right, and just how sort of cuddled up American businesses,
international businesses were with the Saudis. How is it that we`re just
now having people have a come – you know, sort of a come-to-Jesus moment
to mix all sorts of metaphors about who this government is.

NANCE: Well, you know, I lived over there for seven years and in the Gulf
states and just recently returned to the United States. And the one thing
that we can say unequivocally is they have ridiculous amounts of money. I
mean, they`re not billionaires, they`re technically trillionaires that
allow the state to hold on to their money. And they are developing lots of
work and in the region and they have many, many lobbyists here in the
United States. And so there`ll our guess is what everyone really wants.
And that`s why Donald Trump scheduled his first visit to Saudi Arabia as
his first state visit as President of the United States and was overwhelmed
at the type of you know, money that they have and the luxuriousness of
their buildings.

Look, and they realize for the first time the Saudis, that a President of
the United States is in play. He`s not going to lecture them on democracy,
he`s going to want in on the deal. And if they can do that which mom had
been Salman apparently is done with the facilitation of Jared Kushner, then
you can – if you can buy a President then you can essentially buy his
silence. And by going this one step too far by possibly killing Khashoggi
– we haven`t seen the body yet and we`re probably going to hear the audio
tape, then he has Donald Trump over a barrel and Donald Trump apparently
seems to enjoy sitting over that barrel.

REID: Yes, indeed. Mehdi Hasan, Malcolm Nance, thank you both. I really
appreciate your time tonight. Thank you. And after the break, with over
100 migrant children still, still separated from their parents as of the
latest report, the Trump administration is reportedly considering options
for a new process of family separation at the border. We`ll give you the
details – the details next.


REID: It has been nearly four months since Donald Trump was forced to
reverse his policy of forcibly separating migrant children from their
parents. Two weeks ago, the Trump administration reported that 136 of
those children are still in custody, still separated from their moms and
dads. That includes three kids under five years old. Today the
administration invited reporters to tour its density in Tornillo, Texas
where the government says it`s detaining migrant children who came across
the border without a parent, so-called unaccompanied minors.

This is U.S. government video of the facility released today which was
showing because the media were not allowed to film inside the detention
camp. This tent city did not even exist at the start of this year and it
was initially designed to house around 450 children. It`s been
dramatically expanded over the course of the year as the Trump
administration systematically reduced the number of children being released
to live with relatives or sponsors.

Officials say the camp now has around 3,800 beds and that there are
currently 1,500 kids age 13 to 17 being held there. They say children who
pass through the facility are kept in the system at Tornillo or elsewhere
for an average of 59 days, which is up from the 30 days that was common for
unaccompanied children under the Obama administration.

And joining me now from outside the detention camp in Tornillo is NBC News
national security and justice reporter, Julia Ainsley, who toured the camp

Julia, thank you for being here.


REID: We have a little bit of a delay. So, I was locked in Tornillo in
the summer. And since that time, it has obviously expanded greatly. We
saw that video. It looked very familiar to me.

I wonder if, as you were touring that facility, if unlike when we were
there, when I was there before, they allowed you to talk to any children.

AINSLEY: Well, yes, you know, officially, we`re not supposed to talk to
any children. They say that`s part of privacy reasons. A big part of it
is because they want to show you that government narrative. They want
those pictures out there. They wanted to show what is in a lot of ways
normal teenage life, we saw kids playing soccer, we saw their arts and
crafts projects, we saw, you know, people kind of getting together and
going to school like you would see any normal teenager.

But we were able to talk to a few children on the sidelines, of course, we
won`t disclose their names for their privacy reasons, they are minors,
after all, but we really did get what was at the heart of that. There was
a 16-year-old girl from Guatemala that I had a chance to talk to. And she
said, when she left her home, Joy, she didn`t even know that the U.S.
detained children. She thought as soon as she got to the United States,
she would be able to join her brother, who`s an adult living in Texas, and
that she`d be able to claim asylum, that`s what she was told when she left
her home.

She got here, she was held for two and a half months in Miami and now she`s
been in Tornillo about a month. And she doesn`t know when that day will
come. She`s confused. She`s a teenager trying to navigate a really
complex legal system.

And speaking to her, I think, really got to what`s at the heart of all of

REID: Yes.

AINSLEY: You can have a clean facility, you can have it air conditioned,
you can teach school, but these are children in a very abnormal situation
and it will affect them. The longer they stay here, child welfare
advocates say these children need to be in their homes. And as you pointed
out this policy where we require longer background checks, even of parents
and of everyone in the household, is in large part to blame. The commander
of this facility said as much today.

REID: Yes. And just to be clear, you know, when parents are sending these
children unaccompanied, it isn`t that these children are coming here
expecting to be on their own, there is a person at the other end of that
circuit that the parent is sending them to this cousin, or this brother, or
this auntie. And it is the U.S. that is creating this enormous tent camp.
And instead of sending them to that person, they`re putting them in a camp.
There`s nothing normal about detention in a giant military camp.

When you were there, did you get to see the phone facility? Because when
we were there, there was a facility where kids could call their families.
Are these children in any way in touch with their families in the U.S.?

AINSLEY: Yes, they are. We understand that they can make at least two
calls a week. They say sometimes more. A lot of children have a phone
number memorized because just like you said, Joy, they were sent here to
reunite with someone that was going to care for them on the other side of
the border once they got completed with that trip. So we understand, yes,
they`re allowed to do that but we`ve also been able to get in touch with
some of those parents and some of the sponsors who say, yes, we can hear
from them twice a week but we are no closer to knowing when that day will
be, when we can take these people into our homes.

They`ve given their information to the FBI, or they`re waiting to give
their information to the FBI, but they really feel like they don`t have
control over this process. And I will point out, some of these tent
facilities did exist for a temporary time under the Obama administration,
primarily in 2014, when we saw an influx of children coming across the
border just like we do now. It was actually much higher then. That was
more of the record numbers. We`re about at a three-year – or a third
record high this year.

But the reason those existed was for a very temporary part. They only held
them 30 days and got them out very quickly.

Now, HHS says that under those policies, they couldn`t be sure that the
children were going to a safe home and that there was a handful of people
who came forward claiming to be parents when they weren`t. But I think a
lot of advocates would tell you the majority of these parents are telling
the truth and that the child should be in the home with them. And no
matter how much communication they might have with them, it`s not like
having them under their roof, putting them into a routine and getting them
into school where they actually get credit.

Here, the school we saw today, a teacher stands in front of the room, there
are English slides on a projector. Most of these children don`t speak
English. And they`re really just there just to take up time and keep them
busy while they wait in this purgatory to find out where they`ll go next.

REID: Yes. And, of course, the administration is now weighing on starting
family separations again. We`ll have to talk about that another time.

Julia Ainsley, thank you very much. Really appreciate you being here with

And still ahead, Democrats gaining ground in red states, not by blurring
the political lines but by running, get this, as Democrats. Why the
National Party should take note as they look to 2020. Coming up.

Plus, tonight`s Thing 1 Thing 2 is next.


REID: Thing 1 tonight, you`ve probably heard about Kanye West`s little
visit to the White House yesterday. An appearance which most people
thought was quite unusual.


KANYE WEST, MUSICIAN: His hero`s journey right now. And he might not have
expected to have a crazy (INAUDIBLE) like Kanye West run up and support,
but best believe we are going to make America great.


REID: But not everyone thought was – not everyone was put off by that.
Fox News thought it was awesome.


LAURA INGRAHAM, FOX NEWS ANCHOR: It was an amazing moment in the Oval
Office today when pop culture icon, rapper extraordinaire, Kanye West met
with President Trump.

genuinely interesting things this afternoon, things we ought to be talking
about in public.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: All he wants is answers, all he wants is solutions, all
he wants is opportunities.

INGRAHAM: Sometimes unlikely figures emerge in American history to play
important roles.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: It was awesome.

INGRAHAM: I enjoyed –

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: If that make my mind not wanted to curse so much, but
the freedom –


UNIDENTIFIED MALE: – of thought that no one`s going to tell me who to be,
how to act, I am my own person, and I like success, and I want every
American to be successful. That part, I loved.


REID: I`m sure they`re so into hip hop over there. I know they just
always like, damn (ph), hip hop. I know they just – they`re so into it.

Conservatives everywhere rallied to Kanye`s defense because they are, you
know, so into celebrities voicing their political opinions. The Daily
Caller`s Benny Johnson even took to Twitter to praise Kanye as a man, “born
impoverished and into a broken home who became a millionaire –
multimillionaire, and dares to think different politically to the chagrin
of liberals.”

OK. But here`s the thing. Kanye West, in fact, grew up in the middle
class. His mother was a professor. His father was a photo journalist.
Kanye grew up in the suburbs. News flash, not all black people are poor.

Conservatives really seem to love to assume that black life is just one
long horror movie. Until, of course, you make it big in sports or hip hop
or become one of Donald Trump`s African Americans. And just wait until you
hear the right`s take on the latest actual horror movie. That is Thing 2
in 60 seconds.


REID: So, the new Halloween movie is coming out next week featuring Jamie
Lee Curtis, once again, being chased around by her serial killer brother,
Michael Myers. And Fox News apparently has a problem with the film because
real life Jamie Lee has advocated for gun control measures and movie Jamie
Lee uses the guns against the psycho killer. Oh, the hypocrisy of that
make-believe movie character.

As that hot take went viral, Jamie Lee Curtis herself responded in an
interview with USA TODAY, saying she supports the Second Amendment and has
absolutely no problem with people owning firearms, if they`ve been trained,
licensed, a background check has been conducted. Curtis adds, “If I had my
– made my career as a pacifist actor, I would have never worked, ever.
But I have always proud to represent women who fight back ad fight back
with intelligence, cunning and creativity, and who fight for their lives
and for their families lives.” I just hope that no one at Fox has seen
“Freaky Friday”.


UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Oh, I`m like the Cryptkeeper.




REID: Given that we are in the age of man`s fury at women`s insolence,
it`s fitting that we`re finding out that John Kelly, the man who lied about
Congresswoman Frederica Wilson to try and get her to quiet down, also
thinks that Senator Elizabeth Warren is an uppity gal.

Back when Kelly was secretary of Homeland Security and Trump had, soon
after taking office, imposed the first of several illegal travel bans
targeting Muslims. Senator Warren spoke to Secretary Kelly on behalf of
constituents illegally barred from the country. And in an e-mail recently
obtained by BuzzFeed News, Kelly described their phone call this way.

“Absolutely most insulting conversation I have ever had with anyone. What
an impolite, arrogant woman.” He ended his description of Warren`s call
with the words “blah, blah, blah.”

The Warren trashing didn`t end there. A Homeland Security senior counselor
responded, “Too bad Senate Majority Leader McConnell couldn`t order her to
be quiet again.” The again was a reference to McConnell, just one day
before forcing Warren to stop reciting the words of another woman who did
not want to be shut up, Coretta Scott King, on the Senate floor.

Warren had been trying to make a point about Attorney General Nominee Jeff
Sessions` history of hostility to African-American voting rights.
McConnell defended his actions with this infamous comment.


SEN. MITCH MCCONNELL (R), KENTUCKY: She was warned. She was given an
explanation. Nevertheless, she persisted.


REID: So now that Kelly`s testy e-mail had surfaced, Warren, never one to
pipe down just because some guy said so, responded. In several tweets
today, she said that then Secretary of Homeland Security Kelly wouldn`t
return her calls and that when she finally got him on the phone, she
insisted on getting his cellphone number. And she concluded that, “Mitch
McConnell and Donald Trump can`t shut me up, and neither can John Kelly.”

And that, “There are some men who can only hear “blah, blah, blah” whenever
a woman`s talking. But there`s nothing impolite about people`s right to
speak and hold their government accountable. And sometimes people are
right to be angry.”

Coming up, we`ll discuss why maybe just what America needs right now is a
fed-up woman.



CHRIS HAYES, MSNBC ANCHOR: Let me get you on the record on Judge
Kavanaugh. Would you have voted to confirm him?

REP. BETO O`ROURKE (D), TEXAS: I would not have. We need a Supreme Court
justice who believes in voting rights. In a state where you can be fired
for being gay, a Supreme Court justice who believes in civil rights, a
state that`s the epicenter of the maternal mortality crisis, a justice who
believes in a woman`s right to make her own decision about her own body and
have access to the health care that ensures that she can. He fails the bar
on each and every single one of those tests.


REID: OK, when I saw that moment watching from home the other night, I
have to admit, but just for the second, after Chris asked the question, I
braced for a political answer. Instead, Beto dropped that big no, wouldn`t
have confirmed him. And I thought, OK, now, this is a different kind of
Democrat running in Texas.

Beto O`Rourke, who`s challenging Ted Cruz for his Senate seat, is looking
to upend the way Democrats run for statewide office in the south. And he`s
not the only one. Stacey Abrams is running as an unabashed liberal in
Georgia, trying to become that state`s first democratic governor since 1998
and the country`s first black woman governor ever. Then there`s Andrew
Gillum, and his outspokenly progressive campaign for governor of Florida.

If Democrats can make Republicans fight tooth and nail in three southern
states by running a straight no chaser liberals, then why not think boldly
about 2020? Why not lean into the moment and nominate an all-woman ticket
to challenge a president that has been accused by at least 19 women of
sexual misconduct and who put a man accused of sexual assault on the
Supreme Court?

Joining me now to talk about how this would play out is Tara Dowdell,
democratic strategist, and Howard Dean, former chair of the Democratic
National Committee. All right, I`m going to come to you first because in
the break, Tara, we were talking about the fed that you and I did agree on
something during 2016.

They had Hillary Clinton double down and gotten (ph) big and picked
Elizabeth Warren. People would have thought she was crazy, but it would
have helped her a lot. And so this idea of doing the unexpected thing and
saying, you don`t like this woman? Here`s two. It feels like this is a
moment for Democrats to potentially go big. What do you make of it?

TARA DOWDELL, DEMOCRATIC STRATEGIST: I think Democrats need to go big or
go home. This is a moment to be bold. This is the moment to be unabashed.
This is a moment to embrace everything that the Democratic Party stands for
and to double down on those things. And so I think that, yes, I think two
women would be great. I think that people said Andrew Gillum couldn`t win.

REID: Yes.

DOWDELL: No one was going to pick a black man to win – you know, to win
even the primary.

REID: Yes, that`s right.

DOWDELL: Let alone he`s ahead in the polls in the general election.
People thought that Stacey Abrams would not – she was not the party`s
primary choice –

REID: She was not.

DOWDELL: – for that race. And look at how well she`s doing in the face
of massive voter suppression –

REID: Yes.

DOWDELL: – I might add.

REID: Yes.

DOWDELL: And so I think that the Democrats need to stop saying, telling
voters who they won`t vote for.

REID: And, you know, Howard Dean, a really wise man once said back in
2004, I am coming to represent the democratic wing of the Democratic Party.
His name was Howard Dean. And you at that time were trying to tell
Democrats stop pretending to be for (ph) Republicans.


REID: Tara just laid it out. The people that the party wanted to win
these primaries didn`t. They didn`t think any of these three had a chance.
All of them have a great chance of winning. Should Democrats take that
same attitude into 2020?

DEAN: Absolutely, yes. I don`t – you know, I mean, I think it`s too
early to say we should have all women or whatever. You know, it`s going to
be 15, 20 people running and I hope we pick the most qualified person. But
the most qualified person is a stands up – person who stands up for who
she or he is as genuine. People are so sick of canned politicians. And if
we nominate one, we`re going to lose to Donald Trump for a second term. We
have got to stand up for who we are and what we believe in. That is what`s
so unbelievably attractive about the candidates that you just talked about.

REID: And –

DEAN: And I think each one – I think we can win all three of those races.
I have no doubt in my mind that we can do that.

REID: They can win, because the reality is one of the things that Stacey
Abrams is doing, and remember, the party wants Stacey Evans, the other
lady, (INAUDIBLE) white (ph) Stacey, right?

But what she is saying is no, it`s not about conversion. There are voters
out there who haven`t been touched. They haven`t been registered. They
haven`t been motivated.

DEAN: Right.

REID: She`s going out to these rural places.


REID: Where there are actually black people and brown people. So is Beto.
He`s like, I`m going to way out in the middle of nowhere where no one ever
goes. You can do it by adding more people. And, you know, when Howard
Dean says we`ll hope we pick the most qualified person, that`s what
Democrats say and it`s smart. But Republicans say, you know, Sonny Bono
wants to be, you know, Cooter from, you know, that –


REID: – from the TV show. Yes, we`ll take heavy diamonds (ph). And it`s
a very different mindset.

DOWDELL: Right, and exactly. And so another thing that all of these three
candidates have done is they engaged young voters early.

REID: Yes.

DOWDELL: Not just engage young voters –

DEAN: Right.

DOWDELL: – they engage young voters early.

REID: Yes.

DOWDELL: And so what Democrats have a tendency to do, and this is not –
I`m not looking to indict the Democrat – I`m a Democrat, but Democrats
have a tendency to wait too late in the game.

REID: Yes.

DOWDELL: To engage young voters and then later say, well, young voters
don`t come out to vote. We need to give them a reason to come out to vote.
And a lot of people want to dismiss –

DEAN: Yes.

DOWDELL: – younger voters.

REID: Yes.

DOWDELL: A part of why they`re not coming out is because we have not given
them a reason. And then we asked for their vote at the last minute. And
that is not lost on younger voters. And so I think you`re seeing them with
this riding this wave of support. And it`s a multiracial big tent wave of

REID: Absolutely, absolutely.

DOWDELL: And so it is the winning coalition for the Democratic Party is a
multiracial big tent coalition, and they have engaged that coalition.

REID: Yes, absolutely.


REID: Go on, go on, Howard.

DEAN: I think they`ve learned that lesson. If you look at what happened
in Virginia, it was extraordinary, 69% of people under 30 voted for Ralph
Northam who I would call a really good guy but a boring centrist. He`s
certainly no Bernie Sanders. But the rest of the ticket was all – was 11
out of 15 women. There were a large number of people of color. The first
Hispanic woman ever elected to the legislature in Virginia, gay people,
transgendered people. And that`s what the Democratic Party looks like, and
that is what our ticket has to look like.

REID: Yes, and it`s interesting because, right, you`re giving people a
sort of a panel, you know, sort of a panoply of people who look like them.
And the other thing that all of places that you may have just been talking
about are in the south.


REID: The Democrats, and, you know, Howard, you got it – your people
picked on you for saying, we got to go down to the south.


REID: The Democrats are rediscovering, that`s where most of the people
are. That`s where – their people are in the south. You can win down

DOWDELL: Exactly.

DEAN: Right.

DOWDELL: And on top of it, so the – so there`s large black population in
the south, but there`s also demographic changes in the south where people
are moving from the north –

DEAN: Yes.

REID: Yes.

DOWDELL: – who have traditionally voted democratic.

REID: Yes.

DOWDELL: And now they`re moving into southern states for whatever reason,
there`s –

REID: Yes.

DOWDELL: – a number of different reasons. So that`s also –

DEAN: But there are also – there are also a lot of southern young people
that are willing to vote for Democrats now –

REID: Yes.


DEAN: – because they`re disgusted with Trump.

REID: Yes, absolutely. And by the way, Elizabeth Warren –

DOWDELL: And these states aren`t doing well. Remember a lot of these
states, I mean, Texas aside, a lot of these states are not doing so well.

REID: Right.

DOWDELL: So, they have not been served well by Republican Party

REID: Yes.

DOWDELL: So it`s not as if people are doing extraordinarily well and the
Republicans have been – they`ve benefited from Republicans, they have not.

REID: Yes, absolutely. So, Warren Harris or Harris Warren?

DOWDELL: I`ll take either.

REID: And so Howard, Warren Harris or Harris Warren? Pick one.

DEAN: The primary voters will decide.

REID: Oh, Howard. Rediscover your boxing politician. Don`t be a
politician. Tara Dowdell, Howard Dean, thank you for joining this All In -

DEAN: No, I`m interested – as long as they`re under 50, I – you know, I
love Elizabeth, but I want to see – we need to have a young person out

DOWDELL: Please, I think she`s young in spirit.

REID: That`s all for ALL IN this evening, Chris will be back on Monday.
Until then, you can catch “AM JOY” tomorrow morning at 10:00 a.m. “THE
RACHEL MADDOW SHOW” starts right now. Good evening, Rachel.


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