Show: 11TH HOUR WITH BRIAN WILLIAMS Date: October 2, 2018 Guest: Frank Montoya, Russ Buettner, David Farenthold
BRIAN WILLIAMS, MSNBC HOST: Tonight before a cheering red state crowd in the South, Donald Trump launches a full frontal attack on Dr. Christine Blasey Ford, all of it as the news for his nominee Brett Kavanaugh gets darker. While now details are out about the federal judge as a young man, new reporting tonight that the FBI may be close to wrapping up its investigation without interviewing Chief Kavanaugh accuser Dr. Ford.
And the "New York Times" with a blockbuster piece of reporting today months in the making, the headline "Trump Engaged in Suspect Tax Schemes as He Reaped Riches from His Father." One of the reporters who broke the story standing by to talk with us as THE 11TH HOUR gets underway on a Tuesday night.
Well, good evening once again from our NBC News headquarters here in New York. Day 621 of this administration. And as we go on the air tonight, the United States Senate could soon have the results of the FBI follow-up investigation into sexual assault accusations against Supreme Court nominee and sitting Federal Judge Brett Kavanaugh.
It was first reported by "The New York Times" and confirmed by NBC News that the reopened investigation, this is the important part, may come to a close well ahead of the Friday deadline. That, as the new reporting also from "The Times" paints a picture of Kavanaugh`s high school years that stand in stark contrast to his sworn testimony.
"The Times" obtained a copy of a 1983 letter written by then-high school student Kavanaugh about an upcoming beach weekend condo rental. In it he warns that someone should, "Warn the neighbors that were loud, obnoxious drunks with prolific pukers among us." Kavanaugh confirmed he wrote the letter which he signed "Bart," apparently a nickname. "The Times" interviewed more than a dozen of Kavanaugh`s classmates and friends who shared details of the party culture at his all-boys prep school.
According to the report, four Georgetown prep classmates said they saw Judge Kavanaugh and his friends partake in binge-drinking rituals many weekends in which other partygoers saw them inebriated, even having difficulty standing.
Living aside the long tradition of misbehavior in high school in America, what`s the question here is the sworn testimony of a federal judge and Supreme Court nominee.
And here is how Judge Kavanaugh described his drinking during last weeks hearing.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
BRETT KAVANAUGH, SUPREME COURT NOMINEE: I drink beer with my friends. Almost everyone did. Sometimes I had too many beers, but I did not drink beer to the point of blacking out.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
WILLIAMS: To the best of our knowledge, the FBI has not spoken to those classmates who talked to the "New York Times." Further, NBC News has learned that the FBI has no current plans to interview Judge Kavanaugh or to interview Dr. Christine Blasey Ford.
According to Ford`s attorney, she`s repeatedly tried to reach out and contact the FBI. In a letter her lawyer says, "We have received no response. And it is inconceivable that the FBI could conduct a thorough investigation of Dr. Ford`s allegations without interviewing her, Judge Kavanaugh, or the witnesses we have identified in our letters to you."
And tonight after days of restraint, and despite calling Dr. Ford`s testimony credible just a few days ago, the President chose to go directly at Kavanaugh`s accuser at a rally tonight in Mississippi.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
DONALD TRUMP, (R) PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: It shouldn`t happen to him. It shouldn`t happen to him. What he is going through, 36 years ago this happened. I had one beer, right? I had one beer. Well, you think it was -- nope, it was one beer. Oh, good.
How did you get home? I don`t remember. How did you get there? I don`t remember.
Where is the place? I don`t remember. How many years ago was it? I don`t know. I don`t know.
And a man`s life is in tatters. A man`s life is shattered. His wife is shattered, his daughters, who are beautiful, incredible young kids. They destroy people, they want to destroy people. These are really evil people.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
WILLIAMS: Ford`s attorney fired back on Twitter tonight, "A vicious, vile and soulless attack on Dr. Christine Blasey Ford. Is it any wonder that she was terrified to come forward and that other sexual assault survivors are as well? She is a remarkable profile in courage, he is a profile in cowardice."
And in light of the President`s performance at tonight`s rally, perhaps one brief reminder of Dr. Ford`s testimony.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
SEN. PATRICK LEAHY, (D-VT) JUDICIARY COMMITTEE: What is the strongest memory you have, strongest memory of the incident? Something that you cannot forget. Take whatever time you need.
CRISTINE BLASEY FORD, KAVANAUGH ACCUSER: Indelible in the hippocampus is the laughter, the uproarious laughter between the two, and they`re having fun at my expense."
(END VIDEO CLIP)
WILLIAMS: With that let`s bring in our leadoff panel on a Tuesday night. Maya Wiley is back with us, a Former Assistant U.S. Attorney for the Southern District of New York, currently a professor at the New School here in New York. Julia Ainsley back with us, NBC New National Security and Justice Reporter. And Frank Montoya, a Former FBI Special Agent in charge, who during his time at the bureau played a role in establishing the National Cyber Investigative Joint Task Force. Welcome back to the broadcast, all of you.
Counselor, I`d like to begin with you. Looked at another way, this was the President of the United States in a public place going after a woman accusing his Supreme Court nominee, a sitting federal judge, of sexual assault.
MAYA WILEY, FMR. ASSISTANT U.S. ATTORNEY SOUTHERN DISTRICT OF NY: There`s a certain moment in which in this country I think we all need to take a breath and say, "Who are we?" And this is one of those moments. Because we are talking about the most powerful positions in the land, President of the United States, justice of the Supreme Court if Judge Kavanaugh were to get appointed to this position.
Whatever we believe, and there are plenty of people who have different views of what happened here, the fundamental question is, are we a people who are compassionate and believe that there has to be a just process of understanding what we know? In this case, that means a thorough and complete neutral, nonpartisan FBI investigation on one level, but secondly, a leadership that says that we are a compassionate land in which we listen to the real experiences of our people. And we understand that we have to have a process for understanding whether someone was harmed.
And Christine -- Dr. Ford, no matter what anyone thinks of her, I don`t know anyone -- and I have talked to folks on both sides of the aisle in the community, not in Congress, but in the community, and no one has said they thought she was a liar. So to be a President of the United States who has substantially more power than Dr. Ford does, to make fun, to make fun of what is nothing less than a clear, raw expression of trauma is something that we should, as a nation, say no. It is not okay, it is not acceptable, and it`s not about what you believe is truth or not truth. It`s just about whether or not we have any compassion whatsoever for our fellow citizen.
WILLIAMS: Did Dr. Ford`s attorney get it about right tonight that this is why more women don`t come forward?
WILEY: Absolutely. If you think -- now, remember that the social science, I mean, even if we just take this from the standpoint, I`ll put on my faculty hat --
WILLIAMS: Right, hear the college professor.
WILEY: -- of social science, the social science tells us that people do not come forward because they feel ashamed, they feel fear, they feel that they will be blamed, they feel that they will not be believed. And we have the single most powerful man in the country telling people, you will be belittled, you will be ostracized, you will be in the square of public opinion, you will be ridiculed.
And Brian, you and I have had this conversation before. This isn`t just an issue of women. This is men and women, girls and boys, because in this society, we have people who are sexually abused, violence, sexual violence, sexual molestation of all genders.
WILLIAMS: I realize this is emotional stuff. Thank you for getting through that.
WILEY: It is emotional stuff. And I appreciate you, because I think at some point as a country, and I`m a lawyer so I can put a legal hat on. But I think at some point in the country, what we saw today was fundamentally about whether or not we are a compassionate society.
WILLIAMS: All right, Julia Ainsley, you get to go next and tell us what the state of play is on this story. It is clear what the emotional quotient is, and this conversation is going on wherever two or more Americans are gathered this week. What`s the state of play of this story?
JULIA AINSLEY, NBC NEWS NTL. SECURITY AND JUSTICE REPORTER: Yes, I`d be happy to get through that, Brian. So I spoke to Dr. Ford`s legal team over the course of the day. And when I started talking to them, they said, we remain hopeful even though I had FBI sources saying, "Look, her name is not on the list of people that they plan to interview."
As the day continued, that hope turned to anger, and we saw that letter come out at the end of the day from her legal team saying that it was inconceivable that they would not speak to Dr. Ford about these allegations if they wanted to really get to the truth of this. And as we know, it`s not a lack of willingness on the part of the FBI, it`s the client the FBI is serving. And in that case, that`s the President. That`s the White House.
And there`s still, even with the probe that kind of got expanded yesterday, they`re still not giving them all the room they would need to run all of these pieces down. And another thing that her lawyers pointed out is it`s not just her story she wants to tell, there are other witnesses, there are other details that she couldn`t give in a public setting like we saw in front of the Senate Judiciary Committee last week. And what that really comes down to is exactly what Prosecutor Rachel Mitchell said. She said, "Do you realize, Dr. Ford, I shouldn`t be getting your story in five-minute increments in a political setting. You should be sitting down with a trained investigator who can hear your story."
So at the end of the day, there`s a lot less that they will get. And the thinking of from the White House at this point is that they say the FBI doesn`t need to talk to her because she already gave her testimony publicly. But as we`ve seen over and over, there is more that she can give in a private setting and more details that they`re willing to come forward if they were just asked about it, Brian.
WILLIAMS: Frank, a couple details for our viewers to share about you, starting with the fact that you served our country for decades starting in the U.S. military, but most recently in the FBI, and of course your job here tonight isn`t to speak for the FBI, it`s to talk about them. having said that, I talked to a former top-level manager at the FBI tonight and got a really dark assessment of the leeway they have in this extended investigation. This person said, "The investigation has received only the smallest expansion of scope." That`s a quote I`m reading from my notes.
Incrementally more interviews than ever before. Not everything they want to do. this person said there`s huge frustration within the bureau, that they`re turning away people, they`re turning in walk-in candidates who come in the door with information, notes that come in under the door or over the transom aren`t being followed up on. Again, this was a really dark view of this investigation. Frank, I guess I`m asking you to react to that.
FRANK MONTOYA, JR., FMR. FBI SPECIAL AGENT: You know, first off, many, many thanks to your previous two commentators, especially Maya. The anger that I am feeling right now, it`s almost incomprehensible. I haven`t felt like this in a long, long time. In fact, perhaps the last time was most recently, I guess, was one of my last cases in Seattle where a young six- year-old girl was kidnapped and brutally murdered.
And just the anger I felt when we recovered the body and then continued with the investigation, it`s just -- it`s that same kind of emotion. And you can`t separate it from situations like this. But to answer your question directly, that`s what I`m hearing as well. You know, I`ve characterized it recently as, you know, catching another political football that -- in a no-win situation, but it`s deeper than that. It`s really -- it is visceral.
You know these are guys that they are professionals at investigating crimes of all sorts, and while this is a background investigation, they see lines of investigation that they should be following. And they`re not being able or allowed to follow them. And it`s just -- it builds a frustration that just adds to everything else that they`ve endured over the last two years in terms of the assaults on their credibility, on their integrity, on everything that they pride themselves on doing well, not just for a living or as a job, but because it is their calling. You know a calling that they swear under oath to fulfill to the ends of their lives if necessary and that`s how deep this is.
WILLIAMS: And Frank, I`ve got to ask, if Director Wray isn`t going to get pressure to be to the FBI what Jeff Flake was in the Senate, to be that guy who says, "Hang on a second, this ain`t right?"
MONTOYA: You know, you would hope that that had already happened or is that is happening. I don`t know. You know, part of the challenge the institution is facing right now is its precarious position, its situation under this administration. On the one hand, it is, you know, it strives to be independent. On the other hand, a lot of its efforts, and this is just the latest example are being nullified. They`re being nullified by tweets, by direct accusations, by what`s happening to coworkers.
And you know, for what purpose? For what purpose other than to sustain a power base, perhaps. But it`s -- they are in a precarious situation, and it`s also unprecedented. You know it`s been a string of unprecedented acts and trying to figure out how to deal with that when you`re not a politician, when you are a professional investigator who has sworn an oath to uphold, protect and defend the Constitution, it`s an anathema. It`s something that doesn`t compute in our minds.
And you know, even as a former FBI official, it`s hard to comprehend. It`s hard to accept. and you wonder, how -- what can we do next to try to change the circumstances? Because there is -- there hasn`t been, at least, an answer that is made itself known.
WILLIAMS: Maya, as a matter of law, did I get it about right earlier in the broadcast that we`re not relitigating how much bud light someone consumed in high school. We`re talking about truth under oath here.
WILEY: Absolutely. So under -- you can have a perjury charge for false statements to Congress. A perjury charge means that you willfully said something you knew to be untrue.
WILLIAMS: Yes.
WILEY: There is evidence that a sitting federal judge willfully said something he knew to be untrue in terms of drinking, and the additional thing you have to say is that it`s material. It`s important. It`s not just a small side issue. Because at the core of the allegations around his violent behavior, his potentially criminal behavior, is drinking, I would argue that drinking becomes a material fact.
None of this has to do with whether or not he`s ultimately prosecuted for the crime of perjury.
WILLIAMS: Right.
WILEY: But it has everything to do with whether or not a federal judge, which he is, violated the judicial code of ethics, which is also extremely important if we`re talking about whether he becomes a sitting Supreme Court justice. It is central to our rule of law that the folks who are administering it, making decisions about it are above reproach, that they have what we call in the law, no appearance of impropriety. Honesty and integrity are core principles in that assessment of ethics.
And there are -- those questions alone are disqualifying for whether or not he becomes a sitting justice. And that has nothing to do with idealogy. Not a thing.
WILLIAMS: Two things for viewers to remember, a lot of talk about this being about a Supreme Court seat for life. He`s already a federal judge. He has been appointed for life. Another interesting thing to remember is the President`s sister is a senior federal judge. And I`ve wondered throughout this if that dynamic will affect it at all.
Julia Ainsley, you get the last word. What are you looking for next?
AINSLEY: Well, it`s going to be this timeline, Brian. We`re reporting that this could wrap up as early as tonight, possibly tomorrow. That`s all within the Senate`s timeline because they want to get that vote by the end of the week. Mitch McConnell has said that. It`s unclear if maybe he could get a cloture vote by the end of the week and then move on to the final vote over the weekend or early next week.
But this being spread through at rocket pace. There were former FBI people who have come on our air and who I have spoken with, he said, "A week seemed like a realistic timeline, going from Friday to Friday." They think if they put the amount of resources toward this, they would be able to talk to everyone they needed to.
Now we`re talking three days, if that. So if that comes really quickly, the first question I`ll be asking tomorrow is, Brian, is, was everything uncovered? Did you talk to everyone you could?
And at this point if they`re not able to talk to Judge Kavanaugh or Dr. Blasey Ford, it doesn`t seem like they`re going to be anywhere close to uncovering and overturning all of those stones.
WILLIAMS: We`re blessed and grateful to have these three guest to start of our broadcast tonight. Our thanks to Maya Wiley, to Julia Aisnley, and to Frank Montoya, we appreciate it greatly.
Coming up for us tonight, what we`re learning this evening about Trump and his father after this "New York Times" story about the Trump family financial records. One of the reporters who broke the story standing by to talk with us.
And later, why one of the Democrats rising stars is putting his life ahead of mere politics. THE 11TH HOUR just getting underway on a Tuesday night.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
WILLIAMS: Remember that song, that sequence? That man right there, that was the Donald Trump that was sold to the American people for 14 seasons on T.V. from this network, from this building, viewers saw the helicopter, and the plane, and the limo, the trappings of a self-made billionaire who was living a life, thanks to his business savvy.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
TRUMP: It has not been easy for me. You know I started off in Brooklyn. My father gave me a small loan of a million dollars. I came into Manhattan and I had to pay him, and I had to pay him back with interest.
When I came into Manhattan and I started buying up properties and I did great.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
WILLIAMS: But a "New York Times" investigation into the Trump family finances reveals that small loan of a million dollars was actually closer to 60 million and never repaid. "The Times" article, 18 months in the making coming in at more than 13,000 words, I`ve read shorter books, offers an exhaustive look at the source of Donald Trump`s wealth. It finds, "President Trump participated in dubious tax schemes during the 1990s, including instances of outright fraud that greatly increased the fortune he received from his parents.
"The Times" investigation based on a vast trove of confidential tax returns and financial records, reveals that Mr. Trump received the equivalent today of at least $413 million from his father`s real estate empire, starting when he was a toddler and continuing to this day."
In a statement to "The Times," a lawyer for President Trump called "The Times" report, "100 percent false and highly defamatory saying there was no fraud or tax evasion by anyone. President Trump had virtually no involvement whatsoever with these matters."
Well, here to talk to us about all of it, "New York Times" reporter, Russ Buettner, one of the co-authors of this extensive report. And the Pulitzer Prize Winning of "Washington Post" reporter David Farenthold who covers the President`s businesses and conflicts of interest.
Russ, first, you just mentioned to me on the break the synopsis of your story is 2,000 words long. So I`m going to ask you to do the impossible. For people rushing to their devices and printers, for people who didn`t take the latter half of the day off to read it, what is the takeaway versus the story we were told on "The Apprentice," the story we`ve been told for years?
RUSS BUETTNER, THE NEW YORK TIMES REPORTER: Oh, the story you`ve been told for years is that Donald Trump received a million-dollar loan from his father sometime around when he was starting, and he had to pay it back with interest, and that was the sum total of -- that sort of parental support he received. That`s wholly untrue. He began receiving money from his father when he was three years old. His father gave Donald Trump and his siblings some land, and then started paying them rent on that land. In that land on which his biggest department buildings were built.
And then the thing just progressed from that, growing to $5 to $10 million a year when he was in his 40s and his 50s. And then one interesting part of the whole thing is he`s tried to portray his father`s portion as too small to be of interest to him. But there are clear signs that all through the 1980s and the 1990s, they were taking very aggressive, sometimes apparently illegal maneuvers to -- for him to grab even more of his father`s fortune before he even passed away.
WILLIAMS: Was the setup to make this kid wealthy from a young age, this kind of flow through system about which you write so much about shell companies and the like?
BUETTNER: Absolutely. I mean, it`s very clear Fred Trump was very forward-thinking and trying to pass his wealth along from his -- to his children. He was a relatively young man when he began that process. He had five children. He had put up some buildings for returning vets from World War II.
On his way to being very, very rich but not yet totally there but already setting up trust funds to begin passing that along. And over the years, as Donald emerge as the favorite chosen son, more and more of that money went to him as suppose to his siblings.
WILLIAMS: David, I need not stress to you that some nights it`s "The Post" journalism we`re talking about. This just happens to be "The New York Time" turn. I know I join you in tipping hats toward them.
The story that Russ and his colleague have contributed to the question to you, David, what could come from all of this?
DAVID FARENTHOLD, THE WASHINGTON POST REPORTER: Well, in a legal sense, we`ve already seen the New York State Department of Taxation send in my opening investigation. I think you might see investigations in New York City and New York State which would have been deprivative, lots and lots of tax payments under the system in addition to the IRS.
Journalistically, this is an amazing story. And one of the things that I really love about it is that it gives us a template for where to look next. The schemes that Donald Trump`s father and Donald Trump himself self- employed to avoid income tax, it gives us a place to look, OK, did they repeat those, those same schemes in other context? Is this something that happened more recently under Trumps own leadership and not under his father`s.
WILLIAMS: David, do you think we will see, and I guess this calls for a judgment on your part, but you live this story, too. Do you think we`ll see the President`s tax returns in our lifetime?
FARENTHOLD: You`re really asking me if Democrats will ever win control of any House of congress because I don`t think Donald Trump will ever give them up. The Democrats do take either House of Congress, they will have the power to request. And if they want to make public the President`s tax returns, I imagine that they will if they have that power.
This is a matter of things like some law suits that are going on regarding the emoluments clause where there could be some discovery. It`s possible those could lead to the revelation of President tax returns. But unless the Democrats get political power and use that power to get those returns, I don`t think we`ll ever see them.
WILLIAMS: Because the secret of life is timing.
These are live pictures from Andrews Air Force Base as the President has landed from tonight`s rally in Mississippi. Reminder, the first lady is on her first trip on the African Continent in Ghana. First off on her trip, he will now switch to Marine One, fly over to the White House.
Russ, just for the folks who are going to read it, have already read it, is there any way to explain to lay people the effort that went into this, how many months, how many people, how many lawyers, how many words?
BUETTNER: Of our effort. So it was 18-month effort. Three of us, my colleagues Sue Craig and David Barstow, much of that locked in a room with the shades drawn. We brought in a group of sort of pocket advisers, very experienced trust in the state attorneys, accountants, and whatnot, who we could run by our findings as they came up. And then we also developed a network of sources of people who were in and around the Fred Trump, Donald Trump Empire during the pertinent years here.
And then through that process, gained access to a couple hundred tax returns later to Fred Trump`s businesses, his general allegers, his bank statements and we were able to collate all of that into a sort of cohesive narrative of what transpired.
WILLIAMS: On top of everything else, you must now deal with environmentalist because I`m told you`re a tree killer, they added eight pages. Apparently, there`s a print version to the "New York Times" website that they put out every day. And they added eight pages to the print run, that meant bringing in union type setters and printing workers tonight for the "New York Times". So maybe you`ve made the holidays more joyous for some families and there are some trees in the Pacific Northwest that are no more.
Obviously, our message to the viewers is that we hope everyone takes the time to read your piece of journalism. Thank you so very much at the end of a longer than usual day for you and your colleagues for coming in to talk to us.
Russ Buettner of the "New York Times", David Fahrenthold of the "Washington Post", gentlemen, thank you both so much.
And coming up, with this FBI investigation, we`re told, wrapping up were close. We`ll ask a former GOP strategist about the moderate senators who will determine Brett Kavanaugh`s fate when we come back.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
DONALD TRUMP, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: Well, I say that it`s a very scary time for young men in America when you can be guilty of something that you may not be guilty of. This is a very, very -- this is a very difficult time.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
WILLIAMS: President Trump said again tonight at the rally that any man could find himself falsely accused, that it`s happened to him several times. At tonight`s rally in Mississippi from which he has just returned, he called it a sad situation.
Let`s bring in our friend Steve Schmidt, political veteran of the Bush White House, the McCain presidential campaign, among others.
So, Steve, the president went there tonight, a full-on attack of Dr. Ford from the podium. We just heard him say it`s a scary time for young men. Tell me what an audience of three people is likely to make of all of this, and that is Flake, Collins and Murkowski who, with every passing day, get more critical to this Supreme Court choice?
STEVE SCHMIDT, FORMER MCCAIN CAMPAIGN CHIEF STRATEGIST: Well, the battle lines are being drawn here, as Buffalo Springfield once said, Brian, and on one side of it are decent people, and on the other side of it are indecent people. And when you look at the president`s indecency tonight, presuming that Jeff Flake, Susan Collins and Lisa Murkowski are all decent people, then they`re going to be as horrified and offended as the rest of us.
And what Donald Trump showed tonight is he is as contemptible as he is vulgar. He is as cruel as he is dishonest. No American citizen deserves that treatment from the head of state, from the commander in chief, from the president of the United States Of America. Steward of an office once inhabited by men like George Washington and Abraham Lincoln.
And so these senators are going to have to make a decision. And that decision is simple. Does lying matter? Does integrity count? Can a sitting federal judge make dishonest statements about small and trivial things and get onto the Supreme Court? And so that question is an important one, because our institutions in this country are under assault.
Our judicial system, the Supreme Court, the Senate, the Senate Judiciary Committee. When you look at the performance of someone like Lindsey Graham, for example, his angry tirade, the smallness of a small man, a principlest man in this moment, what American people are seeing is the degradation of 242 years of institutions to enhance the pursuit of happiness and to defend American democracy and liberty. It`s beyond awful. It`s tragic.
WILLIAMS: What happens within you when you listen to the Senate majority leader, Mitch McConnell, these days, when you listen to him promising a vote on the Senate floor by the end of this week? When we heard him last week saying, we`re going to get this passed?
SCHMIDT: He is an utterly, irredeemably pernicious force in American life. The Senate majority leader`s first priority should be to strengthen the institution of the United States Senate. It was once known as the greatest deliberative body in the world. He`s turned it into a laughingstock.
This process has been profoundly corrupted. This investigation, by the way, is no such thing. It`s not just a sham, it`s a farce. It`s not an investigation if the FBI is not permitted to be able to talk to either Judge Kavanaugh or to Dr. Ford if it doesn`t have a free hand to pursue every lead.
And so this investigation is directed by the White House. The FBI in essence is a contractor serving an employer in this. It`s directed by the White House. And so Jeff Flake is going to have to decide since he is the one who instigated the investigation if, in fact, it meets his standards of an investigation. Or is it an investigation designed in essence to be a cover-up?
Certainly for Mitch McConnell, there`s no interest in finding out anything about anything. He wants to put him onto the Supreme Court. And the question here is, when you give consideration to the veracity of Judge Kavanaugh`s various claims, and I`m not a psychiatrist. I can`t explain why you would lie about something so small or trivial about your drinking in high school or college, but he apparently has on any one of a number of different fronts.
And if lying can get a 19-year-old kicked out of WestPoint, certainly we should give consideration to the fact that it might be disqualifying for somebody seeking a lifetime appointment on the Supreme Court, which is arguably even more so than the executive branch, even more so than the legislative branch. The singularly most important institution in the country. Because democracies exist not on the basis of elections, but in societies where there is fidelity to the rule of law.
And the rule of law, when you look at the edifice of the Supreme Court, lady justice is blindfolded. Because all must be equal under the law, and when you have a justice temperamentally essentially vowing revenge, alleging conspiracies, I think those three Republican senators have the right to be concerned. This isn`t about ideology. It`s about temperament and honesty.
WILLIAMS: Steve Schmidt, don`t move an inch. We`ll fit in a break. Our conversation will continue to include some of the news of this day about Donald Trump when we come back.
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(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
SEN. JEFF FLAKE, (R) ARIZONA: The initial defense that Judge Kavanaugh gave was something, like I told my wife, I hoped that I would sound that indignant if I were -- if I felt that I was unjustly, you know, maligned, but then it went on. And the interaction with the members were sharp and partisan and that concerns me. And I told myself, give a little leeway because of what he`s been through. But on the other hand, we can`t have this on the court. We simply can`t.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
WILLIAMS: Steve Schmidt continues along with us.
Steve, that last sentence, we can`t have this on the court, we simply can`t. A lot of people seized on that and said it was more than just the end of a sentence. It was more than an afterthought. Listen to what Jeff Flake is telling us here. He is such an interesting figure, I`d like to hear you out on him. Is this a case of an imperfect man on his way out of town, and he fully admits if he were running for reelection, there is no way he`d be in this role, an imperfect man coming along at a perfect time?
SCHMIDT: We`re all imperfect men and women, Brian. Jeff Flake is a good guy. I know him. He`s principled. I think that you see what he`s feeling there. He`s agonizing over this. But I think he has reached the proper conclusion as I literally believe him to be meditating out loud. You cannot put a person onto the Supreme Court who says things like, what goes around comes around, that this is all a conspiracy. It goes back to the Clintons, it goes back who knows how far, but that partisan anger, his enraged behavior directed at the left, at the interest groups, might there be a possibility that a Supreme Court justice will have to decide issues that involve liberal interest groups? Of course there is.
And so putting someone in that position of power who has a motive for revenge and all but stated that it`s coming, I think he understands the importance of the institution, the integrity of the court. We have a lot of ideologists in the Congress. We have people like Lindsey Graham who are followers, not leaders. We have precious few people that are institutionalists, who put the institutions first.
The institutions of the country, wherever you look, are under assault. They`re under assault by Trump. They`re under assault by Mitch McConnell. They`re under assault through the complicity, the acquiescence, the silence, the cowardice of a corrupted political class.
And I think Jeff Flake is saying, stop. The institutions matter. It is a profoundly conservative sentiment. Conservatism at its best defends these institutions. Jeff Flake is a conservative. The two women senators are moderates. But I think all three of them are institutionalists and we`re going to see who stands up to defend the institutions.
WILLIAMS: Steve Schmidt, thank you for sharing your opinions and spending part of your Tuesday night with us. We always appreciate it.
SCHMIDT: Great to be with you, Brian. Thank you.
WILLIAMS: Coming up for us, a rare public admission from a politician who, it turns out, has something in common with so many Americans that we learned today. That story when we come right back.
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WILLIAMS: Tonight, a guy who has repeatedly been called a rising star in the Democratic Party has gone public with a private battle. Jason Kander, an army veteran turned politician, has taken himself out of the race for mayor in Kansas City. He said it`s time for him to get some help, after struggling for 11 years with post-traumatic stress from his military service. Our report on this tonight comes from NBC News correspondent Cynthia McFadden.
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CYNTHIA MCFADDEN, NBC NEWS CORRESPONDENT: Jason Kander is 37 years old, and today, he made a very hard decision and a brave one. He will not run for mayor of Kansas City. It`s the reason that has drawn national attention. In an open letter released today, Kander, an Afghanistan war veteran, says he has post-traumatic stress disorder.
After 11 years of trying to outrun depression and PTSD symptoms, he writes, "I have finally concluded that it`s faster than me. That I have to stop running, turn around and confront it." Kander Candor joined the military after 9/11.
JASON KANDER, AFGHANISTAN WAR VETERAN: At that moment, I just decided, like, instead of putting that in the some day category, I was just going to do that. I was going to serve my country.
MCFADDEN: But tonight admits that service has left him needing help. Kander is not alone. About 8 million Americans in any given year will have PTSD. And between 11% and 20% of veterans. Some experts believe the number may actually be much higher.
Kander writing, "I was afraid of the stigma. I was thinking about what it could mean for my political future if someone found out." So much worse, he says, last week, he called the V.A. for help. "I found myself on the phone with the VA`s veteran`s crisis line, tearfully conceding that, yes, I have had suicidal thoughts. And it wasn`t the first time."
DR. NATHANIEL CLARK: I think it`s incredibly important that he`s come forward with this, because it gives veterans permission to give voice to what they`re suffering from and that mental illness is as real as any form of illness.
MCFADDEN: Tonight, Kander has a message. "If you`re struggling with something similar, it`s OK. It doesn`t make you less of a person." In fact, what Jason Kander is showing all of us is that courage comes in many forms.
Cynthia McFadden, NBC News.
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WILLIAMS: And our coverage continues. Coming up tonight, the words we will all see on our phones tomorrow, when THE 11TH HOUR continues tonight.
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WILLIAMS: We`ll get to him in just a moment. Last thing before we go tonight, a reason to get up in the morning. The government tells us that our phones are all going to receive an alert tomorrow. It`s related to something people of a certain age grew up with and insomniacs will recognize from overnight television called the Emergency Broadcast System.
Since the Kennedy administration, these words, this is a test of the Emergency Broadcast System, have been part of American life, along with that piercing tone that was chosen because it was so piecing and unpleasant and because it was designed to get your attention. We can`t play that tone for you on the air because it`s use as reserve for emergencies.
The system was designed during the Cold War for a president to send a message to the entire population of the U.S. in an emergency. In all its history, it has never been used to alert the nation but it`s been used often for local alerts, including severe weather.
Fast forward to 2018, and here we are most of us now carry a portable electronic device. And we now have the wireless emergency alert system along with the emergency alert system. And tomorrow, provided you`re in reach and your service providers on the network, any time after 2:18 p.m. Eastern, 11:18 in the morning on the west coast, your phone will show this. It`s going to say, you`ve received a presidential alert. It will go on to explain it`s a text.
And no, the president can`t use this for anything less than a national emergency. That`s why he has Twitter. But tell your friends, tell your family, especially those who might worry about receiving such a dire looking message just to heads up that it`s coming soon to a phone near you.
That is our broadcast for tonight. Thank you so very much for being here with us. And good night from our headquarters here in New York.
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